Problem during winter (Hereford vs. Angus)!

[Ellie May]

Howdy Ya'll! I'm not trying to start anything just stating facts. So far (I don't want to blame it on Angus) but maybe it's just the genetics. We've raised Herefords forever it seems like they've went through the family and everything but we recently bought an angus bull last year to put w/ some of the hereford heifers from our other hereford bull. We bred them and had calves, our hereford bull was old and got hurt so we had to sell him but to keep the calves coming we put the angus bull in w/ the big cow herd, they've calved now, but we've had 5 calves die, all black baldies. And even had a cow and calf die giving birth in the middle of the night. I don't know what it is. We bought a new Hereford bull in the spring and now have him in there for feb. calves to see what happens. But we've never had so many problems with cows and calves passing on in the winter. I think we are going to sell the angus bull and buy another hereford unless someone could help us change our mind somehow and explain what's going on. So far I've learned Herefords put on weight easy, birth easy, and tame down easy and when you take the hide off YOU CAN NOT TELL ME YOU COULD TELL THE DIFFERENCE BETWEEN HEREFORD AND ANGUS BEEF..??!! THe good thing is the calves that have made it are nice looking calves that grow fast but not nessecarily put on the weight. So I don't know what to think. I love Herefords and love the black baldies but I don't know if its worth it. Any help, advice anything would be great???
Thank ya'll!
Ellie May

 

[Scotty]

OK I can't tell the difference. I have used HEreford bulls in the past. One I had was no easy calver. I don't think just because they are ANgus means they are easy calvers. But the only problems I have had with calving in the winter is just the plain cold and wet. Can't really think of any problems breed specific no. And for the last four years I have only used Angus bulls and usually calve from Nov. to first of Febuary.


Scotty

 

[Ellie May]

Yeah I'm think it's the coldness, we had 7 born (5 died) while it was sleeting about 20 degrees but then again we had a couple of herefords(none died) calve in below zero last year so I dunno. I think the only way to stop the problem besides just not raising cattle which will never happen is we are going to stop breeding them to have a winter crop.
Thank you!
Ellie May

 

[Alan]

I don't think it's a matter of Angus or Hereford, it's probably the bull. The first year I was in this, I rented a reg polled hereford bull to cover my four heifers. Spent 3 hrs in the middle of the night, pouring rain, pulling our first calf, second calf was dead in the morning after birthing during the night, third born on it's own but weak calf, and finally fourth was a 28lbs heifer that I gave to a friends wife as a yearling (her pet). I called the guy who rented the bull to me to see how he did...he had already shipped the bull, worst calving year ever for him. Next year I bought a bull with good birthing EPD's gave me 7 calves, from the time the fluid bag started showing to calves on the ground, all were born in 20 minutes or less. All were up and running in another 20 to 30 minutes, all were in the 90lb range. Probably your bull.

Or maybe red slides out of the birth canal easier. :roll:

Alan

 

[certherfbeef]

I don't think it's a matter of Angus or Hereford, it's probably the bull.

It can also be management as well.

 

[Alan]

It can also be management as well.

Good point, cows have got to be in good shape, not too fat.

 

[mwj]

Yeah I'm think it's the coldness, we had 7 born (5 died) while it was sleeting about 20 degrees but then again we had a couple of herefords(none died) calve in below zero last year so I dunno. I think the only way to stop the problem besides just not raising cattle which will never happen is we are going to stop breeding them to have a winter crop.
Thank you!
Ellie May

Wet cold calves equal trouble unless the cow does a good job drying them off and keeping them dry. Cold and dry is a lot better than cold and wet. The core temp. drops like a rock when they are wet and they are dead before long. If you had 5 die in the sleet storm that is the answer to your question. As far as the cow that died calving I can see no conection to the bull unless he throws very high birthweight calves. My advice would be if you are calving in a sleet and cold situation you better be prepared to be on hand for the calving or stand the losses.
your friend
Mike

 

[Bez]

Lots of good advice - bottom line it's an "either or" situation.

They both do well.

Management is the key.

Bez

 

[Ellie May]

Well when it sleeted only one was born the others did ok threw it. They all had warm dry hay to sleep in, sooo??
Ellie May

 

[cattle_gal]

Sorry Ellie won't be able to take your poll. We calve in the winter(Feb,Mar, little into April) each time.

Some breeds work well in places, some not as will in other places. Some work well everywhere. Some have more birth (get up and go) vigor than others. Some breeds are high birth and low birth wieght just with in the their own breed. Different feed stuff and requirements from one season to another season.

 

[docgraybull]

We bought a new Hereford bull in the spring and now have him in there for feb. calves to see what happens.

If you "now have him in there for feb. calves" you better check your gestation table, unless you have developed a breed with an extremely long or extremely short gestation period! :shock: Good luck with the new calf crop - whenever they come!

 

[Angus Cattle Shower]

Could you post his sire, and grandsires so we do not mess up? (Actually so I don't mess up :lol: )

 

[mwj]

Well when it sleeted only one was born the others did ok threw it. They all had warm dry hay to sleep in, sooo??
Ellie May

Ellie May
Reread your second post that I replied to I am confused as to what you are saying. If the post you made is corect I stand by what I posted. If not please give us all of the corect information so we can answer your question.
your friend
Mike

 

[Campground Cattle]

Ellie I have Herefords/Angus/Brangus/British Whites in the pasture we calf year round I have seen no difference. I will say again we have lost one calf in the last seven years. We do have milder winters than most on the board

 

[Jake]

I voted yes because the hereford cows we had seemed to have about one prolapse a year... that or just blow something.... always had problems with the old crowbaits

 

[Ellie May]

Howdy,
Well we had one that was born when it was sleeting but they all had access to hay bedding in the dryness.
Ellie May

 

[mel sandlin]

OK I can't tell the difference. I have used HEreford bulls in the past. One I had was no easy calver. I don't think just because they are ANgus means they are easy calvers. But the only problems I have had with calving in the winter is just the plain cold and wet. Can't really think of any problems breed specific no. And for the last four years I have only used Angus bulls and usually calve from Nov. to first of Febuary.


Scotty

 

[mel sandlin]

In the East.. Virginia...we have a large selection of many excellent angus bulls..not that many herford bulls..so my county agent says pick
a top angus..if you have a number 1 bull angus... your best selection of
a herford bull may only be a number 4 due to the smaller selection to
select from...the last sale that I went to had over 70 angus bulls and 2 herford bulls...I had 15 bred angus heifers with a calf ease bull...no problem born in Jan..Feb.. We have a lot of cedar trees and I picked the thick ones and under each tree I took a large bale of old hay and put it under the trees..those young angus mothers calved under the trees and the calves would only lay down on that hay..I would bet that herford
mothers would do the same.

Mel ...South Anna Angus

 

[Campground Cattle]

The sorriest cows in my herd are Angus. Come this spring every one of those black things are leaving as cow calf pairs. Knotty calves that grow slow. I sell beef by the pound at the salebarn and the Angus ain't got it, the Herefords, Brangus do. Jury still out on the British Whites.

 

[Caustic Burno]

Never did figure out why people wanted to raise those little calves either.
Hual an Angus at weaning to the salebarn at six months weighs 500 lbs brings 1.30 a pound = 650 bucks. Hual a Brangus,or F-1 tiger brings 1.20 and weighs 600 pounds at weaning = 720 bucks. I must have this wrong to cause with me its about the size of the deposit slip.