Piedmontese Breeders

[Chuckie]

Who are some of the closer Piedmontese breeders closer to the upper NorthWest corner of Tennessee to Nashville and a few miles to the outside borders of other states to Tennesee. I would like to have one good sound heifer, not to show, but to raise calves.
Chuckie

 

[Frankie]

Who are some of the closer Piedmontese breeders closer to the upper NorthWest corner of Tennessee to Nashville and a few miles to the outside borders of other states to Tennesee. I would like to have one good sound heifer, not to show, but to raise calves.
Chuckie

Here's a link to the PAUS membership list.

http://pauscattle.org/memberdirectory.htm

There's another association, too:

http://www.piedmontese-napa.com/

 

[Chuckie]

Thank you Frankie!
Chuckie

 

[Frankie]

Thank you Frankie!
Chuckie

You're welcome. It's obvious you're excited about Piedmontese breed. Be sure you have a market for the double muscled animals before you get in too deep. "Montana Range" is a branded beef program that looks for Pied-influenced calves. It's also one of the things that put Leachmans out of business a few years ago, but you might want to look into it. I think Laura's Lean Beef also pefers Piedmontese calves. Good luck and remember there's always a market for Angus.

 

[MikeC]

Since there are varying degrees of "double-muscling", the slight or lesser muscled ones should do well.

Some ill-informed members of this board think of double muscling as those Belgian Blue bulls posted from time to time with the look of almost abnormalcy.

Not true.

We could all use cattle with more muscling.

 

[Chuckie]

Frankie,
I do understand. As long as the buyer controls what we do, I can handle a heifer or two. Right now my pocket book will not let me think about a bull since it is a large percentage of the calf crop. We just bought another Angus bull about two three weeks ago. We have three pastures, so that gives us three unrelated bulls We are trying to get our carcass values up. We are all Angus except for four Charolais at this point.

Piedmontese have a lot to offer the meat market. For those who have never tried a Piedmontese steak, I hope that you have a chance to do so.

Seems the Piedmontese Assn has had a chance to jump start their product a time or two, but never joins in. Just as Frankie says, when Mr. Leachman called attention to the breed.


I read about Mr. Leachman, and was wrote that he had a brilliant mind when it came to the cattle world, genetics, etc..... but he was horrible when it came to paying his bills and keeping his books. Maybe that is a kind way of saying "crook."
The way it was described, it was like waiting in line for a ride. When the sale was over, the first group of people were paid, then they left and the next group of people lined up and waited in line for the next sale to get paid. Creditors, lawyers, investors etc...... he owed the world. Where is he now? I read where they still had not paid the bill on the postage on the books sent out on the last books sent out on the Leachman sale.
I would be able to go to sleep if I knew I wrote a bad check. I can't imagine being able to sleep knowing that so much was owed and so many people would be calling tomorrow and the next, and soon it would become a mud slide.
Chuckie

 

[Frankie]

Leachmans always seem to land on their feet. They've split up the operation and now there are two Leachman cattle companies. They had several problems. The people who funded the Montana Range beef program actually expected to receive dividends on their investment and sued when they didn't. One of the Leachmans got divorced and his wife expected some cash in the settlement. They exported millions of dollars of semen to foreign countries and either didn't get paid or the exchange rate turned on them. And those are the things that got made public. Who knows what else went on. It's a shame that so many people got hurt, but today there are still people who will be glad to be cooperators for their program. :???:

 

[spoon]

Chuckie you missed the chance of a lifetime earlier this month. I attended a Piedmontese sale in Paris, Tn and the prices were very reasonable.

 

[Chuckie]

I am familiar with Paris and know a bit about the Yoders. They were talking to people to raise Piedmontese for them, then they stopped talking about it. I have looked at their website, and they have done a good job with it.

Do people not check into who they hire? Does anyone not go behind and check the people keeping the books or the secretary? Seems the answer now is, "Well, everybody else is doing it!"
Chuckie

 

[Frankie]

Please don't advertise on the Disccussion Boards.

 

[Red Bull Breeder]

Get you one Chuckie. Should make a muscled up black calf if you cross with angus bull. Best looking black bull i about ever saw was angus X romanola good looking bull. I am sure i did not spell rom right. As for a market you are in Laura's Lean beefs back door.

 

[spoon]

I'd like a pm on that too. I'm still kicking myself for not being prepared to buy when I went to the auction. I'd be interested in talking to them as well. After whatsupdoc3 has his chance first of course. :tiphat:

 

[Chuckie]

I did not know about the sale in Paris. I am less than 60 miles from Paris. I have had several things going on here. I have had a freezer full of Piedmontese. I would not be blowing my horn so much if I had not of eaten so much of it. I have been around the animals and I have nothing but good to say about them. I sure wish I had known about the sale.

I hope to hear from a man today if he has a heifer for sale.

What kind of blood do they think that was crossed with the Piedmontese? I have been trying to understand the genetics of the breed.
Can they pass different degrees of the muscling to their offspring or do they pass the whole gene or none at all?
Chuckie

 

[ANAZAZI]

Let us say you have an ordinary cow. Mate that cow with a pure piedmontese bull. The bull is homozygous (ie carries two copies) of the special muscle gene. Then every calf in the progeny will be heterozygous(and carry one copy); they will have far more muscle than mum and far less than dad, they will also be consistent. If you for the next generation will mate with another homozygous bull; then half the progeny will be like dad (homozygous), and half like mum(heterozygous)

 

[Chuckie]

What I said, didn't come out like I wanted it to. When the DNA was thought to have been tainted with other blood, what kind of blood did they think it was from?

But now that you brought that up, I was also asking that too. So you can water down the gene a bit each time you cross breed the next generation with another breed?
Chuckie

 

[Red Bull Breeder]

You can water the gene with out crossing, just look at what 30 years in the US. has done to fullblood Limis.

 

[Frankie]

In a recent test done here is some test data.

smallest adj ribeye largest adj ribeye adj marbeling actual backfat
pied sired calves 13.1 19.90 3.002 0.083
herford sired calves 7.98 12.04 3.326 0.214
angus sired 8.80 14.80 4.040 0.310
charolais sired 9.96 14.66 3.055 0.155
simmetal sired 10.2 15.27 3.450 0.223

33 pieds tested

13 herfords tested

97 angus tested

54 charolais tested

47 simmetal tested.

Heres some more info from this test

highest daily gaining bull pied #119 angus #230
av daily gain 4.1 lbs 4.7 lbs
frame 7.7 5.5
actual backfat .008 .035
actual marbling 2.67 3.08
adj marbling 3.0 3.11
actual ribeye 16.6 13.
adj ribeye 17.3 13.2
adj 365 day wt 1277.6 1259.25
birth wt 98 lbs 106 lbs
wean wt 760 636
test start wt 794 762
test end wt 1250 1284
birth date 03/14/07 02/26/07


Which bull is gaining fat and which is gaining meat? this was a very wet and muddy test due to a cold and wet winter notice the minimal ammounts of difference in marbling above.

OK. Would you please post a link to this test data? Were the calves crossbred or purebred? How long was the test? Were BIF recommendations used in adjusting weights, etc? Why only 33 Pied calves as compared to all other breeds?

You may think that "minimal" amount of marbling may not matter, but it doesn't take much to move from Select to Choice or Select to Standard.

Personally, I think my Angus are looking pretty good: better gain, better marbling, higher test end weight, moderate frame and decent ribeye. And that's if you accept these figures at face value.

 

[Frankie]

birth weights 106 lb angus calf 98 lb pied then select is bringing more than choice.. notice you did not comment on feed conversion and how much more it costs to grow fat. Them backfat figures are not minimal :???:

Im happy with what I RAISE AND KNOW WHERE THE MARKET IS HEADED.

And notice that you offer no link to back up your data. Perhaps it's just something you heard at a coffee shop?

From NAPA:

The NM and DM carcasses were not different in maturity (Table 1). However, the NM carcasses had significantly higher marbling scores and quality grades than did DM carcasses. Quality grades for the NM cattle averaged low choice, while the DM carcasses averaged high standard. This again emphasizes the overall reduction in fat content of carcasses from DM cattle.

http://www.piedmontese-napa.com/Calpain ... scling.htm

This chart shows Standard takes an average $13.44 discount to Choice. Now if he's a YG1, he gets a $2.71 premium. That hardly makes up the difference, does it? Then there's the almost $20 discount if he hangs a 1,000+ carcass.

http://www.ams.usda.gov/mnreports/lm_ct155.txt

From the USDA Training Manual for meat grading:

"Double-Muscled" animals are included in the Inferior grade.

http://www.beefbasis.com/portals/1/feed ... rading.pdf

I'm happy with what I'm raising, too. There are several reasons Angus dominate the US beef industry. And there are several reasons double muscled breeds haven't been well accepted in the US beef industry. Marbling is only one of them.

 

[Frankie]

I notice you are shying away from the feed conversion. Lets see it cost well over 90 cents to put on a pound of fat which angus are well known for. Then pieds are well known to acheive 73 percent retail cuts compared to 60 what to angus then whats the angus feed conversion ratio. AND YES I HAVE CAN BACK UP THE DATA just baiting a little trap here so be real carefull what you say. Pieds are consistently number one in retail cuts and feed conversion. Then lets not forget least backfat and eddible ribeyes that dont need converted to beef jerky.

I'm not shying away from feed conversion. Your unreferenced feed test didn't measure feed conversion. The Angus had a better ADG, so I'd expect they were better feed converters. Since you won't offer any links, it's all just hot air anyway.

read this about your marbling.

Detroit free press 03/06/08
Resturant review of the MGM GRAND SPOT offering 3 types of beef- imported kobebeef, USA KOBE BEEF AND PIEDMONTESE. THE 18 OUNCE PIEDMONTESE DRY AGED BONE IN RIB EYE AT $46 DOLLARS WAS EVEN MORE PLEASURABLE ITS MELT IN YOUR MOUTH MARBLING AND DEEP BEEFY FLAVOR WILL MAKE YOU WANT TO EAT EVERY BITE.

Now isnt kobe beef the highest marbling highest cost beef there is . Only with a pied. :tiphat: :banana: :banana: :lol2:

An unreferenced advertisement? What's that supposed to prove?

 

[glover36]

is there any peidmontese breeders in southern ontario