Is there a difference in the Fleckveih Simms and the black or red Simms of today as far as marbling? Cattleman mentioned that some of the Red & White Simms carry a diluter gene. So I guess if you used a Fleckveih that carried it, combined with the 1 diluter gene form the Charolais, you;d have a lot morse chance of a yellow and white, right? Where as using a red Simm, you'will most likely get a deeper red calf than what the mommas are?
If smokies, whites, and reds get hit the same, I stand by my statement. Might as well be standing ready to make up for the hit in weight.I agree. Simm or Fleck ,same genetics really. I didn't suggest black because I am not sure how much impact that CHar dilute gene would have in a 25% Char. Smokies get hit as hard or harder than white and red here, and in most other places, other than a small region in Oregon where they alledgedly outsell even black!The same man that bought Dan's Red Angus x Charbary heifers and the red Brangus x Charolais heifers, is also buying all the Char heifers that just calved to a red angus bull, and that Dan is going to AI to the red Brangus bull. Given all of that I guess he is going to use Red Brangus to breed all of these back with. Just thought I would see what people thought of other crosses.
I was string jerking.... But that aside I have one experience with Charolais. I had just acquired this 80 with a decent fence on one end and side.
Dunno who all can see it, but 4 votes for Fleck, 10 for Simm, 1 for black and 1 for "other Brahma composite}. 3 said "other" but only one person, Coach, named what they would use., He said red Angus.
So the answer is no, you never had any RA X CHar to calves, right? These are Red Brangus x Char, but the color variables would be the same as far as their calves go.
my herd is Fleckvieh. I'm in Canada
Yes! Hereford would be a good choice More genetic diversity than another Continental, or another Brahma composite or another Angus . When the Char and Simms first came down here, the infamous " cow killer bulls", there was some of the little bitty hereford and Angus we had down here that actually survived birth and the Herefords calved pretty calves that looked like a yellow hereford, Same Herford markings just yellow instead of red. People started crossing their Chars with Simms back then, and those were yellow and white as well. Marked just like the original red & white Simms, but yellow instead of red. They grew a little bigger than the char x herf, and damn did they raise some big calves. and that is what the owners is wanting to..bred for a terminal cross. 23 of these heifers are not red Brangus x Char, they are red ANGUS x Charbray. So, Hereford would be a better choice than red angus, as far as heterosis. Hereford, simm or Fleckveih would all work . Surprised no one picked Braunveih.
Many of the original Sims carried the diluter gene. Here in US, we mostly bred it out of our cattle. You cannot tell if a red cow carries a diluter. Black automatically got diluted.
Looks like most agree with red Simm as best choice ....3 times more at 12, then the 2nd place tie, 4 Flecks and 4 blacks. 1 "other red brahma composite" 3 "Other" and those were 1 red angus, 1 red Brangus, and 1 Horned Hereford. I was surprised Braunveih got 0 votes. I think if I was this man, for what he wants to do with them ( mash scales) I woul also pick red Simm. Unless there was a way to know if these cows will throw dilutes. If they don't, or just do it occasionally, then I would use black Simm.
If the cows are out of a white charolais bull (Homozygous Diluter) then they all carry 1 diluter gene. If you bred them to a homo black bull, you could expect about half of the calves to be diluted to grey.
Correct, but if he breeds them to a red, they will all be red. Evidently, there is a bigger discount in his area for grey/ mousy colored.
If you look at it from a consumer's current financial (purchasing power) point of view, can't it be said that lower cost (quality) cuts are in pretty high demand? I pay attention to what is in short supply at a grocer as well as what is in good stock and in my part of the world, the cheap cuts are flying out of the meat cases.
Braun are a beef version of Brown Swiss. LIke with the dual-purpose Shorthorn..some breeders concentrated on breeding for milk production, while others concentrated on developing the for meat production. Now there are 2 varietis with 2 registries Shorthorn and Milking shorthorn. . When Simms first got to GA in the late 60;s they were red &white. Hereford colored red just had red goggles ahd/or brockled faces. and a lot bigger than the Herefords of the 60's and 70's. Then in the 80's, when people started turning Contienetal cattle black,people started calling the traditional red & white Simms Fleckveihs. That wagy u is an interesting cross I hadn't thought of. I think I will mention it to him. Thanks, greybeard.
No, wagyu wouldn't fit with what this man is doing. This man is a heart surgeon, not exactly broke. He grew up on a dairy, that toward the end turned into a beef cow-calf operation. He knows cattle..unlike some gentlemen farmers..he doesn;t have a farm manager. He runs the operation and directly instructs his employees/ Like most down here, he doesn't cojndition or wean calves, feed them out and stuff. he trailer weans steers at 6 mos. The sale barns he uses don't have the 18 wheeler load buyers, but most f the sale barn owners do conditioning at their place, where they cut, vaccinate etc. and get them eating. Then when they have truklod of similar size and kind, they will call a buyer to come get them. One carries to a feedlot in Oklahoma for himself and neighboring sale barn owners wo do this. He does wean and raise heifers, but they are mostly sold private treaty, like he is buying these redbranhgus x char and red angus xcharbray from Dan. I agree with you and the majority, his best bet would be red Simm. He should have some scale-mashing steers and some good replacement heifers.
