Old School Shorthorns

[Big Bucks]

Does anyone raise the old fashioned shorthorns - smaller framed, deeper bodied, thicker version of todays shorthorns? I am thinking of adding some shorthorns to my herd of grass-fed cattle and dont think the modern version would work so well. Would really like to find some semen from the old school kind. Thanks

 

[Muddy]

Hasn't seen these types around, other than clubby, solid reds and commercial types. Unfortunately shorthorn isn't one of these dominant breeds in United States and that club calf industry has ruined the breed. Perhaps they're in Canada?

 

[Aaron]

Saskatchewan is your source for quality ranch-style Shorthorn cattle. Saskvalley and Muridale. 'Coyote' used to be on here a fair bit and he could shed light on some good Shorthorn genetics. Randiliana knows him.

http://muridale.com/index.html
http://saskvalleyshorthorns.com/index.html

 

[Coyote]

Thanks Aaron
We don't breed Show cattle and get disappointed when we win a first place ribbon, lol.
We have a bull sale ( Who's Your DaddyBull Sale)with two other breeders , Saskvalley Shorthorns and Bell M Farms on April 7 in Saskatoon , Sask
We dabble a bit in some old genetics, the red bull is sired by a bull from the 1960's and has worked real well on heifers.
.

The roan bull is Saskvalley Bonanza and we have quiet a few daughters in our herd.

A daughter of Saskvalley Bonanza

 

[Aaron]

Oh good, you are lurking around. I've got a question for you, what route do you go in marketing your feeder cattle? Do you feed right out or into a custom feedlot? Wondering if your able to avoid the dreaded Shorthorn/Roan dockage.

 

[JHH]

Thanks Aaron
We don't breed Show cattle and get disappointed when we win a first place ribbon, lol.
We have a bull sale ( Who's Your DaddyBull Sale)with two other breeders , Saskvalley Shorthorns and Bell M Farms on April 7 in Saskatoon , Sask
We dabble a bit in some old genetics, the red bull is sired by a bull from the 1960's and has worked real well on heifers.
.

The roan bull is Saskvalley Bonanza and we have quiet a few daughters in our herd.

A daughter of Saskvalley Bonanza

REALLY REALLY LIKE THAT COW. Just wish she had a touch more bone. Bulls aren't bad either

 

[Supa Dexta]

I really like those roans. Shame they don't have more presence in the industry.

 

[kickinbull]

They have done the same to the dairy cattle.

 

[Muddy]

They have done the same to the dairy cattle.

What do you meant by done the same to the dairy cattle? There is three large dairy farms, runs milking shorthorns near us.

 

[Lucky_P]

You don't say where you're located. Lots to like about those Canadian Shorthorns at Saskvalley, Muridale, etc. Would have used Bonanza in a second...if not for the roan deal - I take a big enough hit on solid red calves... the buyers here would kill me on roan or spotted calves - even though they'd likely be better than any straight black going through the ring here that day.

In the US, I'd recommend, the following, as they likely have the sort you're looking for:
Kaper Cattle, in IL - http://www.kapercattle.com
Rob Sneed Shorthorns, in MO - http://robsneedshorthorns.org
YLazyY in MT - http://www.yydurhamcattle.com/index.html
Probably some others, but those are programs I'm familiar with.

Have a look at Cattle Visions... there will be semen available from some old-school bulls - or sons of those old boys- in their offerings - but you'll have to sort them out from the showring stuff. Several Saskvalley, Muridale, Diamond bulls there, DRC 101VM(Dover), Coalpit Creek Leader 6th, couple of Sneed-bred bulls(I love my RS '034' daughters!).

Have used mostly Waukaru SH bulls over the past 5 years or so (but some of those listed above); have been VERY pleased with the growth and performance of the steers out of Angus & SimAngus cows. Halfblood ShorthornXAN females just now really coming into production in sufficient numbers for me to begin to get an idea how they're gonna perform. Several Waukaru bulls available at ORIgen, through your ABS rep... may have more 'performance' than you may be looking for... but they've worked well for us.

 

[Muddy]

I wish the sale barn buyers can change their mind about shorthorns. But the heavy dock on them is the reason I no longer had a herd of roan shorthorns cows and they didn't even bring much $$$ as a bred cow at the sale barn. I do not know why these particular people continue breeding shorthorns, sell the calves at same sale barn every year only get lowest price for them. I didn't know how these particular people survived without going broke with the shorthorns.

 

[Big Bucks]

Thanks Aaron
We don't breed Show cattle and get disappointed when we win a first place ribbon, lol.
We have a bull sale ( Who's Your DaddyBull Sale)with two other breeders , Saskvalley Shorthorns and Bell M Farms on April 7 in Saskatoon , Sask
We dabble a bit in some old genetics, the red bull is sired by a bull from the 1960's and has worked real well on heifers.
.

The roan bull is Saskvalley Bonanza and we have quiet a few daughters in our herd.

A daughter of Saskvalley Bonanza

I actually found your website before you posted and your roan bull is my favorite of the shorthorn bulls I have looked at thus far. I really like his depth and muscling in the hind quarter. The roan coloring is why I like the Shorthorns. Since we are marketing grass-fed beef direct to the consumer I dont need black cattle and in fact black is my least favorite color. I want functional cattle that will do what I need them to but with some eye appeal in regards to color. Having Shorthorn crosses in the cow herd really interests me.

What is the frame score of your roan bull? Are you, or do you know of anyone using his offspring in a grass-fed operation? Thank you

 

[Aaron]

I wish the sale barn buyers can change their mind about shorthorns. But the heavy dock on them is the reason I no longer had a herd of roan shorthorns cows and they didn't even bring much $$$ as a bred cow at the sale barn. I do not know why these particular people continue breeding shorthorns, sell the calves at same sale barn every year only get lowest price for them. I didn't know how these particular people survived without going broke with the shorthorns.

Shorthorn dockage is eliminated around here by retaining ownership until at least a year of age. After that point, color almost completely goes out the window in terms of price.

 

[Muddy]

I wish the sale barn buyers can change their mind about shorthorns. But the heavy dock on them is the reason I no longer had a herd of roan shorthorns cows and they didn't even bring much $$$ as a bred cow at the sale barn. I do not know why these particular people continue breeding shorthorns, sell the calves at same sale barn every year only get lowest price for them. I didn't know how these particular people survived without going broke with the shorthorns.

Shorthorn dockage is eliminated around here by retaining ownership until at least a year of age. After that point, color almost completely goes out the window in terms of price.

Only if you have extra hay bales and extra pens to hold them thru the winters. Here you're better off with selling them as fats because even unfinished yearlings can get docked too.

 

[shortybreeder]

I wish the sale barn buyers can change their mind about shorthorns. But the heavy dock on them is the reason I no longer had a herd of roan shorthorns cows and they didn't even bring much $$$ as a bred cow at the sale barn. I do not know why these particular people continue breeding shorthorns, sell the calves at same sale barn every year only get lowest price for them. I didn't know how these particular people survived without going broke with the shorthorns.

Shorthorn dockage is eliminated around here by retaining ownership until at least a year of age. After that point, color almost completely goes out the window in terms of price.

From an accounting perspective, roan shorthorns are probably one of the most profitable calves to retain ownership in because of the reduced opportunity cost at feeder weights.

 

[Muddy]

I wish the sale barn buyers can change their mind about shorthorns. But the heavy dock on them is the reason I no longer had a herd of roan shorthorns cows and they didn't even bring much $$$ as a bred cow at the sale barn. I do not know why these particular people continue breeding shorthorns, sell the calves at same sale barn every year only get lowest price for them. I didn't know how these particular people survived without going broke with the shorthorns.

Shorthorn dockage is eliminated around here by retaining ownership until at least a year of age. After that point, color almost completely goes out the window in terms of price.

From an accounting perspective, roan shorthorns are probably one of the most profitable calves to retain ownership in because of the reduced opportunity cost at feeder weights.

Profitable? The only I see is extra feed so how it is profitable to hold them till they're a year old?

 

[Bigfoot]

I think he's talking about retaining ownership, but sending the calf on. Getting paid on yield/grade.

 

[Aaron]

I know roans are the most profitable to background. Cheap, cheap to buy and sell with everything else after they have some age on them.

 

[Muddy]

I know roans are the most profitable to background. Cheap, cheap to buy and sell with everything else after they have some age on them.

Yup, they're cheap calves to buy for backgrounding alright. Great for the background guys, bad for the breeders. I don't agree with how the sale barns did to the shorthorns, even its obviously the buyers can tell the difference between shorthorns and longhorns. It's sad that high prices didn't even apply to shorthorns last year and two years ago.

 

[shortybreeder]

From an accounting perspective, roan shorthorns are probably one of the most profitable calves to retain ownership in because of the reduced opportunity cost at feeder weights.

Profitable? The only I see is extra feed so how it is profitable to hold them till they're a year old?

Opportunity cost is what you lose by not selling them as feeders. Since the shorthorns take such a hit at feeder size, there is less opportunity cost to be factored in at the end. When a breeder retains ownership, they are essentially "buying" their own calf, and that's a cost that needs to be factored in when deciding whether or not to retain ownership. It may not have a cash transaction involved, but opportunity cost is a real expense that should be factored in when determining profitability.