Now I'm sweating....

[redluv]

Never have figured it all out but according to the 2008 across EPD table a 2.7 Hereford BW is the equivilent to 0 in angus

http://beefmagazine.com/images/0711epdtable.pdf

From what I understand, you add 2.7 to the 3.6 BW EPD on the Hereford to compare it across breeds, so he would have a 6.3 BW EPD.

On the table, where there is a negative in front of the numbers, you subtract that from the animal's EPD, and the positive numbers you add.

 

[Frankie]

Yikes. You do know that a 3.6 lb Hereford EPD is comparable to an Angus 6+ BW EPD? Good luck with them....

The current avg BW for Herefords is 3.5 (I stand corrected by Dun, I was looking at data a little old). The current Angus BW (current sires) is 2.2. My old clean up bull BW is 0.1 above the average, can you help me understand how a bull that has a BW of 6+ or 3.8+ over breed average is comparible?

I'm not trying to defend my bull, he has long since grown wheels and I'm sure long since been slaughtered. He was nothing more than a one season clean up bull that I raised and didn't have to pay $2K for he did what he was meant to do, catch the cows I missed (a lot), put calves on the ground (with luck) and pay for himself when I shipped him. I don't think the sky is falling... but I'm smart enough to know tht you never know.

Thanks,
Alan

And I'm not condemning your decision or bull. Breed averages change with each National Cattle Evaluation (NCE) and sire summary. The BASE for EPDs doesn't change. Frankly, in my limited experience with Herefords, they're not a calving ease breed. And that's not to say you can't find easy calvers in the Hereford breed. On the other hand, I believe Angus is a calving ease breed, but you can find hard calvers, too.

Across breed EPD chart:
http://www.ars.usda.gov/sp2UserFiles/Pl ... 08News.pdf

 

[CPL]

3.6 BW is not what I'd consider high at all for a hereford. Frankie- angus have chased the extreme in BW, which is evident in alot of Angus AI sires phenotype. I do have to give credit though, it seems like there are more and more angus sires coming out with a good amount of muscling.

I was told, that the cow probably has more than 50% influence on what the BW will be- and although I'm not entirely convinced yet, I am seeing it. This past year we used a 774 son that was supposed to be pretty easy calving. I used him on my mature cow and my heifer. The cow had a 92 lbs calf- which is slightly higher than what she's produced in the past, and my had a 72 lbs calf which is 13 pounds lighter than what her adj bw is. I think it really just depends.

I'm also a firm believer that shape has more to do with calving ease than weight. Its kind of like the square peg, round hole thing.

How was the shoulder structure of you bull Alan?

 

[dun]

I'm also a firm believer that shape has more to do with calving ease than weight. Its kind of like the square peg, round hole thing.

How was the shoulder structure of you bull Alan?

And that is the reason for Calving Ease EPDs. When the accuracy gets there they are a better estimate of calving difficulty/ease then BW

 

[Alan]

How was the shoulder structure of you bull Alan?

His shoulders are fine IMO, even his 103 lber appeared come without trouble. I found him early in the morning (7 am) he was already cleaned up and dry, moms teats were clean so I knew he had fed (which he did again after I let him go). Mom was doing fine, grazing,but eager to eat some hay I gave her. So all the signs I saw was that it wasn't a difficult birth. As of today mom seems happy not to be packing him around any more.

Alan

 

[S&S Farms]

Alan

Where is the weight in this calf by that I mean is he really stout or is he any longer than your other calves. We had a cow that averages in the mid 80's over six calves had one this year at 120 I knew the calf looked a week old when I found him navel still wet. The cow was fine the calf has been fine. I never worry about birth weight if the calf is shaped for calving.

I dont know how to set a standard to measure the length of a new born but I know I have had some this year that look picture perfect from head on but weigh much more than they look but they go for ever between the legs. I figure more middle meat down the road for someone. I have used bulls with a 5.6 bw on heifers and been fine. I would just keep an eye on your heifers and good luck. Just out of curiosity how big are your heifers weight wise.

Jeff

 

[Alan]

Jeff,

He is a very long calf, my first thought when I found him was he looked a week or two older than a new born. So is why I thought he might have been a week or so over due. Both calf and cow are doing great, calf is very strong with lots of vigor, mom didn't miss a beat. I would guess the heifers at around 1100 lbs. I'm fairly confident that they have plenty of size to handle calving.

Thanks for your post.
Alan

 

[Herefords.US]

For the last six years, I've used a bull with a 6.0 BW EPD (Actual BW 90 lb.) on heifers with minimal problems. This year I stacked another 5.9 BW EPD (Actual BW 82 lb.) on his daughters and initially it appears that I may have found yet another "calving ease bull" whose high initial BW EPDs were "unreliable".

Personally, I think calving problems are related to management as much or more than the genetics. But I realize that my cattle are in an environment much different than many on here.

George