Mineral tubs

[gcreekrch]

Do you use any canola meal Dave? I'd imagine there is plenty of that up your way. I know around here it is the cheapest of all the protein supplements at the moment. I have my little silo full of it at the moment but fortunately haven't had to use it in spite of the dire forecasts for summer. it keeps well though.

Ken

I have a friend in Saskatchewan that has developed a "Bossy Bloomer" mix of canola meal, canola oil and salt that he feeds in tubs on hard grass winter range to give cows added protein. When I priced it a few years back it wasn't competitive enough with the tubs to make worthwhile.
Freight is a huge issue for us when the nearest canola fields and processing operations are 14 hours away by truck one way. Depending on trailer configuration, trucks are anywhere from $190 per hour for a 53 ft. single drop hay trailer to $250 per hour for a super b set of hopper bottom grain trailers.

 

[gcreekrch]

These beast can get into anything. Neighbors feeder.
View attachment 38168View attachment 38170View attachment 38171
Bottom two pictures in my pasture.
Trap stays set year round.

You eat many of them or are they not good?

 

[Travlr]

We buy pea screenings pellets by the 44 metric ton bulk load after we start feeding and go through 7 or eight loads in a winter. We buy them through a broker at a delivered cost. They are 18 to 22% protein and 5 lbs of them take the place of 8 lbs of our hay. 5 lbs of pellets are very close to the same daily cost as the tubs are and something goes into their stomachs other that a bit of molasses.

Out of general interest, where would the closest cotton field be to the western Canadian border?

I've seen cotton growing in the southeast, so a Long way from you. People grow it in Kansas, about one percent of what's grown. I suspect that would be the closest to you. Otherwise California or New Mexico...

 

[Caustic Burno]

I've seen cotton growing in the southeast, so a Long way from you. People grow it in Kansas, about one percent of what's grown. I suspect that would be the closest to you. Otherwise California or New Mexico...

Cotton seed is a world wide commodity traded on markets.
I'm surprised that it's not available in all dairy markets.

 

[Travlr]

Cotton seed is a world wide commodity traded on markets.
I'm surprised that it's not available in all dairy markets.

That's not what he asked.

 

[Caustic Burno]

That's not what he asked.

I gathered that!
Wheat is not raised in this area and is readily available.
You have to go to the Midwest to find serious corn farms.
It's trucked in daily to the mill.
In today's world lot of commodities aren't local and readily available.
California or Missouri would probably be the closing producing states.

 

[Silver]

Do you use any canola meal Dave? I'd imagine there is plenty of that up your way. I know around here it is the cheapest of all the protein supplements at the moment. I have my little silo full of it at the moment but fortunately haven't had to use it in spite of the dire forecasts for summer. it keeps well though.

Ken

Interesting stuff. A quick Google search shows that canola meal has nearly double the crude protein of the WCS. Canola is grown here but processed elsewhere. I've had canola meal added to my ration for replacements in the past and they did really well. Wouldn't say it was cheap.

 

[gcreekrch]

Interesting stuff. A quick Google search shows that canola meal has nearly double the crude protein of the WCS. Canola is grown here but processed elsewhere. I've had canola meal added to my ration for replacements in the past and they did really well. Wouldn't say it was cheap.

I think the Birch Hills Colony has a press, they add canola oil to my rolled barley to bump protein and eliminate dust.

 

[gcreekrch]

I gathered that!
Wheat is not raised in this area and is readily available.
You have to go to the Midwest to find serious corn farms.
It's trucked in daily to the mill.
In today's world lot of commodities aren't local and readily available.
California or Missouri would probably be the closing producing states.

CB, Google Anahim Lake BC Canada and then let's talk availability and freight costs.

 

[StrojanHerefords]

We have cottonseed in California but it is priced to high for beef cows, it is very good dairy cow feed. I think any sort of oilseed meal or distillers grains would work for beef cows.

 

[Mountaintown Creek Ranch]

That is excellent info EXCEPT the price. That article is a little old. At least the references were were old.

Old is gold...right ?

 

[mickroos65]

What type feed?

my hay I get from a very reputable guy and my cows love his hay. When I had goats they ate it also. He fertilizes his hay hood and has about 300 acres of it n one field. It's coast Bermuda and he also has it tested . I'll ask him on next load He brings in. He has a trailer design to haul 9 bales at s time and he just drives up where I want it and less than 5 minutes he is gone after another load. Also what I get is barn kept but not after I get it. I have to pay $70 a bale delivered. I get 27 bales at a time and he delivers. Good or bad price wise, that's what it is. At the end of my 6 trips he makes I start off with 54 bales of hay. If I need more in April or before , he will deliver me nine more st same price. I buy about a ton and a half+ Of cotton seed to supplement feeding about twice a week. Maybe I don't need the protein tubs. Where do I get my hay tested? I may have it done so I'll know for sure.

Check with your county extension office they should be able to get your hay tested

 

[Mountaintown Creek Ranch]

Check with your local feed store ??
ours will test your hay for free.

 

[Lucky_P]

Protein tubs are, perhaps, the most expensive protein supplement you can spend your money on... but they are 'easy' to feed.

If you're not testing your hay, you have no idea what level of nutrition it's providing.
If Crude Protein is less than 7%, there's not enough N available for the rumen microherd to break it down... so the cows fill up on that indigestible residue, and it just sits there, undigested; dry matter intake decreases, as it takes longer for rumen contents to move through... the cows have to start catabolizing body fat and protein stores.
I've seen - during far too many winters - cows essentially starving to death with a rumen full of 2-3%CP hay... They have big, distended abdomens, and if the producers are not really LOOKING at the cows, they think they're OK... but they come to necropsy with a BCS of 2-3, no body fat stores, but a rumen full of crappy hay.
Back in 2013-2014, a rumor was going around here that there was some sort of 'pathogen in the hay'... no pathogen... there just was insufficient feed value in what was being fed... thus high morbidity/mortality rates in adult cattle and calves.
Last guy we bought hay from was all excited over the ADF/NDF values on his hay... but the 4% CP meant we had to feed twice as much DDG as usual, especially for our lactating cows.

I can't imagine what it would have cost us if we'd been buying protein tubs to make up the difference, vs $120/Ton DDG (Wow! It's at $218/T now!), with 28% CP/5%Fat/8%Fiber).

 

[EasTex]

I use the liquid feed when I'm feeding hay or in a 2 year drought like we've been in. They stay in pretty good BCS under the circumstances. The tubs did not pencil out for me. But there are a convenience if you do not have access to liquid protein.

 

[gcreekrch]

Protein tubs are, perhaps, the most expensive protein supplement you can spend your money on... but they are 'easy' to feed.

If you're not testing your hay, you have no idea what level of nutrition it's providing.
If Crude Protein is less than 7%, there's not enough N available for the rumen microherd to break it down... so the cows fill up on that indigestible residue, and it just sits there, undigested; dry matter intake decreases, as it takes longer for rumen contents to move through... the cows have to start catabolizing body fat and protein stores.
I've seen - during far too many winters - cows essentially starving to death with a rumen full of 2-3%CP hay... They have big, distended abdomens, and if the producers are not really LOOKING at the cows, they think they're OK... but they come to necropsy with a BCS of 2-3, no body fat stores, but a rumen full of crappy hay.
Back in 2013-2014, a rumor was going around here that there was some sort of 'pathogen in the hay'... no pathogen... there just was insufficient feed value in what was being fed... thus high morbidity/mortality rates in adult cattle and calves.
Last guy we bought hay from was all excited over the ADF/NDF values on his hay... but the 4% CP meant we had to feed twice as much DDG as usual, especially for our lactating cows.

I can't imagine what it would have cost us if we'd been buying protein tubs to make up the difference, vs $120/Ton DDG (Wow! It's at $218/T now!), with 28% CP/5%Fat/8%Fiber).

I was told once that Malnutrition is a terrible disease, it gets the big ones and the little ones too!

 

[Warren Allison]

What type feed?

my hay I get from a very reputable guy and my cows love his hay. When I had goats they ate it also. He fertilizes his hay hood and has about 300 acres of it n one field. It's coast Bermuda and he also has it tested . I'll ask him on next load He brings in. He has a trailer design to haul 9 bales at s time and he just drives up where I want it and less than 5 minutes he is gone after another load. Also what I get is barn kept but not after I get it. I have to pay $70 a bale delivered. I get 27 bales at a time and he delivers. Good or bad price wise, that's what it is. At the end of my 6 trips he makes I start off with 54 bales of hay. If I need more in April or before , he will deliver me nine more st same price. I buy about a ton and a half+ Of cotton seed to supplement feeding about twice a week. Maybe I don't need the protein tubs. Where do I get my hay tested? I may have it done so I'll know for sure.

Call the county agent.. You can take samples to him, or send them to UGA. Might can ABAC, too. It isthesame place you send your soil samples in each year to see what fertilizer you need. In addition to the Nitrogen, Phosphorous, and Potassium you need, that rep[ort will also list al the mineral levels, and include instructions on how much to add to your fertilizer. Loose minerals and salt should be all you will ever need. Use loose, not blocks. A horse or cow either one can not lick a block enough to get any value from it.

 

[Brute 23]

With any thing you have to look at the cost of the product and the labor to use or install the product. Tubs and hay are good examples of that even though they are really two different tools for two different jobs.

Hay for example is a lower price up front for the volume but is very expensive on the labor and equipment side.

Tubs are expensive per pound but are very cheap on the labor side. You can pull up with a lawn mower trailer, an suv, or a $1000 beater farm truck and they will load you up and you pitch it off.

Liquid feed is another example. Might be more than hay per pound but they deliver it and you just have to make a phone call.

I ran in to this at work a few years back while trying to build production facilities faster and cheaper.

A separator package may cost $100K vs the separator alone only costing $20K and then having people come out and hook it up and it's all all the gadgets. I could have all the bells and whistles put on in a building and shipped to me cheaper than the labor in the field to install it. We actually saved money and it was faster to use the $100K skid package.

You have to look at ALL the costs associated with a feed to really decide if it is right for you application.

 

[Travlr]

A horse or cow either one can not lick a block enough to get any value from it.

Has anyone had a cow or horse have health issues because they didn't lick a salt block enough? I mean... REALLY?

I've used blocks and nothing else my whole life and every rancher in my early days did too, and I certainly never heard anyone complaining because their animals were having health issues. They all bred and dropped a calf as well or better than the cattle today.

And if I was back in the business I wouldn't be inclined to do anything different today. It's kind of funny how every generation has some kind of "essential" sold to them as a "big improvement" and it's just marketing to wring money out of a wallet.

(This is not to say that there aren't legitimate areas of the country with poor soil (selenium comes to mind) but you can get inexpensive salt blocks for that too.

 

[Brute 23]

Some thing I find funny is I have thrown salt blocks in a trough right next to lose salt just for the fun of it, the cows still licked the block.