Get rich farming

[denoginnizer]

Good discussion. I am glad everyone has stayed civil .

 

[aplusmnt]

I think I could argue both sides of this issue, maybe that is why it is not cut and dry. I think from what it sounds like some of the crop subsidies are hard to understand, the paying for someone to do nothing. But then again I am sure this plays a big part in keeping cost of groceries lower for the consumer, and if crops brought what they should for the farmer to make a fair profit then things would be a lot higher for Americans at the grocery store, then in the end it would have an affect on the poverty level and would result in people on Welfare or just those with low income getting food stamps. In other words the government is going to be helping someone most likely might as well be helping the farmer I guess.

As far as this help with fences, pastures and water. I say let our tax dollars go to those that are working hard to better themselves. So much of our tax dollars go to help those that do not want to work, get an education and even look for a better job. It is refreshing to see someone get tax dollars, that in doing so is creating extra work for themselves, more fences, more cattle more work, versus welfare which is less work. For me I think I will view it as a tax rebate check. Not the same as some worthless lazy person getting a free ride.

 

[JHH]

Some of that money recieved falls under the EQIP program. For those that dont know the county agents office handles the money and give it out on a cost share basis. A farmer can chose from a variety of things like new ponds, cross-fencing, reseeding a field, buffer strips and so on. They usually pay 50-75% but you have to have the job completely done and they will come out and inspect it and then cut a check. So you cant just go out and blow the money on whatever you want.

Yes they hand it out to those who farm 6-7000 thousand acres and not to those that might actually use it for the betterment of the land. We have been (signed up) for 4 years for a pond project, The system doesnt work as far as I can see.JHH

 

[J&T Farm]

I promise that I dont have 6-7000 acres and I got money for my projects. Some times it will take a few years to get picked the first time but once your name comes up you will be more likley to get it every year after that. It kinda works on a points system and depends on how much money your county is alotted each year.

 

[Brandonm2]

I favor getting rid of the EQUIP program, CRP, and any other goofy programs like that. I do like the government propping up grain producers because grain is the key to everything else, finished beef, milk, chicken, pork, etc and I think a lot of people, both producers and the less affluent public, benefit from cheap grain. How many people in the third world DIE if we see $4 a bushel corn and $7 wheat???

 

[cypressfarms]

About Jhh's comments,

I've added more than two cents to this discussion, but here comes two more:

I have a "new" farm tract, 70 acres right behind my house. I heard about the equip program, and applied. It IS based on a point system, and to better my chances I went to two classes given by the USDA. The first was a conservation class, and the second (which isn't complete yet) is a Master Cattleman's class. I have learned more in these two classes, which in turn will make me a more efficient and environmentally sensitive farmer.

I was passed over the first time, but the other parishes in my state had excess money, so on the second go around I was approved, and the points that I earned from the classes pushed me in front of other people. Another words, those that just sat back and thought that they would get a handout didn't get approved this year.

Then came the hard work. Building everything to govt. spec.s hasn't been easy, but in the end it will be worth it. My farm will be more productive.

Maybe some of you don't like the EQUIP program, and that's your choice, but compared to some of the other programs, this one does seem to offer something of value to the farmer, the govt., and the taxpayer. YES, I said the taxpayer. I live in Louisiana, and coastal erosion is a huge problem. One of the classes that I went to was a conservation (with emphasis on soil) class. The amount of money the federal govt. is about to spend to restore the coastal area of LA is enormous. I can't help but think that if there would have been more programs like Equip around in the 40's to 70's, we wouldn't be in the mess that we're in.

Sorry for the long wind, but my chest was full....

 

[born2run]

My boss is on there, as well as a lot of other people I know.

 

[RainMan]

While all the replies from those receiving these subsidies may have some merit, I wholeheartly disagree with you receiving them while other business owners are tossed aside without a thought. For every reason you come up with to justify your actions, I can come up with another for why it shouldn't be. You keep telling yourself something long enough it will eventually become the truth whether it's a fact or not. No wonder other countries dump stuff on us. They know we don't have a leg to stand on. It's time for the welfare to end in my opinion. CW

 

[farmer4620]

theres a differnce in welfare and subsidies. The farmers are busting there butts to do something highly productive and trying to keep america the country that is feeding the world but are spinning there wheels. I am currently working on my costs for next year and its gonna be tough without major yields and excellent prices. 560 dollar a ton anhydrous, 150 dollar a unit seed corn, 3 dollar diesel, cash rent, the list goes on...Im NOT complaining I chose to do those and I love it but inless we go back to the 70's and get paid to leave land fallow we cant afford to just not raise crops and if we did other countries like brazil would just step up and then it would be just like oil industry wed be importing everything and be at the hands of 3rd world countries and the rest of the world. Imagine the shipping cost on corn from Brazil to feed cattle. Hate to see the cost to feed cattle then...wouldnt be cheap...pay now or pay later...money might as well stay in the U.S.

 

[cypressfarms]

Rainman's entitled to his opinion, even if it's wrong.

Seriously, I hear all of this talk about business, but is anyone safe from this type of criticism? How many businesses receive tax breaks and other incentives, be it from the local govt. or federal. If what I receive through EQUIP is welfare, than all of the those type businesses, and anyone who recieves any govt benefit of any kind is on welfare.

 

[Brandonm2]

Rainman's entitled to his opinion, even if it's wrong.

Seriously, I hear all of this talk about business, but is anyone safe from this type of criticism? How many businesses receive tax breaks and other incentives, be it from the local govt. or federal. If what I receive through EQUIP is welfare, than all of the those type businesses, and anyone who recieves any govt benefit of any kind is on welfare.

I despise most of these programs; but this is a business like any other. IF a governmental entity is willing to give you incentives I think you have to cash the check, even though the thought of dealing with those people makes my skin crawl. I don't think there is anything immoral about it. Alabama paid big time money to lure Mercedes, Honda, and Hyundai here. I oppose that kind of thing as well; but don't fault the corps that take the money. As a taxpayer, I want garbage programs like EQUIP, CRP, quail restoration, the govt. financing kids' show steers, or anything paying people NOT to produce shut down immediately!!!

 

[farmer4620]

Just thinking out loud here but when they paid those companies to come there it was because when they got there wouldnt they add huge amount of money back to alabama govt through taxes they paid and the taxes of the people they employed.

 

[Brandonm2]

Oh we made money off of the deal and unemployment here is now 3.8% which is amoung the lowest in the Nation and we have led the nation in new jobs creation. Still as a matter of public policy I don't like charging some Senior citizen 9% sales tax on her groceries, charging a burger flipper 5% of his gross pay in state income tax, charging higher diesal taxes than Georgia, releasing 5,000 felons because we won't build new prison space, and and prorating the schools budget 3 years in a row in order to give out hundreds of millions of dollars of incentives to lure private corporations here.

 

[Farmhand]

Some of that money recieved falls under the EQIP program. For those that dont know the county agents office handles the money and give it out on a cost share basis. A farmer can chose from a variety of things like new ponds, cross-fencing, reseeding a field, buffer strips and so on. They usually pay 50-75% but you have to have the job completely done and they will come out and inspect it and then cut a check. So you cant just go out and blow the money on whatever you want.

Yes they hand it out to those who farm 6-7000 thousand acres and not to those that might actually use it for the betterment of the land. We have been (signed up) for 4 years for a pond project, The system doesnt work as far as I can see.JHH

Our dirt business relies on cost share programs. We build terraces, waterways, and dams primarily. Most cost share is 50%. Sometimes 75%. It is real easy to rack up a big bill, real fast putting in terraces. Terraces around here usually go in for about $1.00 - 1.50 a foot. Most terrace jobs require 2,000 - 6,000 ft. Have seen quite a few 10,000 - 15,000 feet jobs. Without cost share most farmers could not afford or be inclined to spend that kind of money. In 10 years I have only seen 2 people say I'll put terraces in even if I don't get cost share. They had money behind them though. Farmers pay so much into the government that there is nothing wrong in having them help pay for something they require to be done. Cost share has nothing to do with how many acres you have. It has everything to do with the erosion factor of your land. How steep are the hills? What soil type is it? Is it highly erodible or not? How much upland treatment is in place already? Counties are allocated X amount of money each time. They of course want to get the most amount of erosion under control they can for that money. So the higher erosion factor you have, the better chance you have of receiving money. This means that someone who needs terraces or waterways will receive money before someone who needs a pond or a dam. Then there are also different cost share programs. Some are for wetlands, some for terracing, some for wind breaks, etc, etc, etc. Each program is given different amounts of money based on primary problems for each area. Some are more wet so wetland cost share gets more. Some have a lot of highly erodible cropland so terracing gets more, etc, etc, etc. The headaches involved with each project is sometimes more than one can bear. Each job has a ream of paperwork, construction doesn't always go the way it should, checkouts are a pain in the you know what, having to move back onto a job site because "they" shot a spot 1/10th off, the farmer who doesn't want all those crooked lines on his hilly ground (he wants terraces built straight across fence to fence so he can continue farming like he always has), the billings, the list goes on and on and I have already been too windy here. My point is - cost share programs are a good thing. They help more people, in more ways than one can imagine. I have never seen a case of "lazy farmer welfare" in the cost share programs. There's too much work involved.

 

[cypressfarms]

Brandonm2,

Please don't take offense, but if you think the EQUIP program is paying anyone to NOT produce, you don't understand it.

 

[polledbull]

I think most of you are forgetting that the goverment understands that the farmer must remain in business, and that the price of commidities ( corn,wheat and beans ) must remain low for the other sectors that reley on them for thier industry.Thus this is part of the reason for the subsidy. Imagine $4.50 corn , $9.00 beans and $4.50 wheat . That would bankrupt almost every other industry that depended on it. Rather than help every other industry that is using these commidities because they are priced to high , they choose to help the farmer who produces it and ensure that the grain remains low enough that all other industries can remain in business. Only .05% of the population are farming the land . It is of the upmost importance that they are able to remain in business and the price of grain and other commidities remain at a low price as to not offset the whole scale of the agriculture industry.Also the cost of equipment per dollar of gross income is alot higher in the grain producing end of agriculture than any other business . For example it takes a $250,000 combine to harvest grain, but it sets parked under a shed 10 months of the year. Name me any other business that has to invest in capital debt for equipment like that , that can only get 2 months per year use from it. There isnt one. So dont look at it as a hand out , or freeloders taking advantage of the goverment , Its there for a reason.I dont think any of us want to get more dependent on imports than we already are , espically for food and grain.

 

[Brandonm2]

As a taxpayer, I want garbage programs like EQUIP, CRP, quail restoration, the govt. financing kids' show steers, or anything paying people NOT to produce shut down immediately!!!

Brandonm2,

Please don't take offense, but if you think the EQUIP program is paying anyone to NOT produce, you don't understand it.

I did not say that! I listed all of the programs whom I know the names of that I am asking the govt. to axe (and I have applied for EQUIP in the past) and added "or anything paying people NOT to produce" to the end of the list. The govt is spending well over a $trillion a year and buy your votes programs like EQUIP is the kind of PORK which needs to be GONE!!! before we get to the heavy lifting like cutting aid for starving African kids, cutting Seniors' COLAs, or cutting Medicare benefits though those are all coming soon. If you want cross fences, a pond, water troughs, whatever you should have to pay for them yourself. I am not saying those are not good things for you to have or that this is the DUMBEST thing the federal govt. wastes it's money on; but it makes the list. The CRP is my personal favorite public enemy #1.

 

[cypressfarms]

As a taxpayer, I want garbage programs like EQUIP, CRP, quail restoration, the govt. financing kids' show steers, or anything paying people NOT to produce shut down immediately!!!

Brandonm2,

Please don't take offense, but if you think the EQUIP program is paying anyone to NOT produce, you don't understand it.

I did not say that! I listed all of the programs whom I know the names of that I am asking the govt. to axe (and I have applied for EQUIP in the past) and added "or anything paying people NOT to produce" to the end of the list.

Brandonm2,

How about a 180 degree turn???

I mis-read your statement. I actually agree with you about cutting programs that pay people not to produce. I just went to the website you linked on your very first post and made a startling discovery.

I actually "clicked" on several farmers that I knew, and then on the details of their payments. The largest recipient of subsidies in our parish has received well over 1 million dollars from 1995 to 2004. What got me is not the fact that he drives in a huge F250 new diesel, or any of his other lifesyle choices, but that he received $32 for SUNFLOWER SUBSIDIES. What in the world would someone apply for a $32 SUNFLOWER SUBSIDY for. What even bothers me more is that he uses these "subsidies" to bait doves for him to hunt. (Don't get me wrong, I'm a hunter also) But Jesus, I think that he could afford to go and buy $32 worth of sunflower seed to plant. I would be embarrassed to have that beside my name. I'm tempted to send him $32 and ask him to plant it next year on me. He works hard, there's no doubt, but I do too. I actually have two jobs if you include the cattle that take more of my time than my real job.

So there's the 180. Whew.

 

[Beefy]

i didnt realize you could click on the name and get all that information. i dont think i like that. but whatever.

 

[denoginnizer]

I dont think most people are aware of the amount of money we are talking about. It is millions in many cases. Million here and a million there -- adds up after awhile ;-)