Favorite Hereford Bull, past 20 years

[LFF]

Matt, have you tabulated the responses to this poll and compared them with all the other previous polls you've posted for favorite Hereford bull? Has the forum opinion changed in the 3(at least) years you've been taking these polls? Are any bulls coming up stronger or dropping in public opinion over the last 3 years?
If any bulls have markedly changed, + or -, in public opinion, please post those results.

Chris, you know, I have noticed in the past three years that 517 has dropped in interest to some breeders, that is the only down fall to him. The other bulls on that list are still doing well and holding a great name.

THG

517 has decreased because he has sons in production that are better than he is. A true testimony to the value of his genetics.

 

[THG]

Matt, have you tabulated the responses to this poll and compared them with all the other previous polls you've posted for favorite Hereford bull? Has the forum opinion changed in the 3(at least) years you've been taking these polls? Are any bulls coming up stronger or dropping in public opinion over the last 3 years?
If any bulls have markedly changed, + or -, in public opinion, please post those results.

Chris, you know, I have noticed in the past three years that 517 has dropped in interest to some breeders, that is the only down fall to him. The other bulls on that list are still doing well and holding a great name.

THG

517 has decreased because he has sons in production that are better than he is. A true testimony to the value of his genetics.

Of all the sons of 517, I believe that World Class takes home the trophy, that is my opinion. But again, 517 isn't my favorite bull, just not enough of a performance bull, but World Class sure has a lot more than his sire.

THG

 

[THG]

What also makes me wonder is, 46B was another one of the greatest bulls to grace the pastures at McIvers and Mohicans and was from the Remitall Program. He only got 1 vote, I mean, Mohican and McIvers built a cowherd around that bull, maybe I am blind, but I thought he was very impressive and sired some of teh greatest females in the Hereford industry along with his sire 20X.

THG

 

[ollie?]

Grant , where's U81's rock? I assume your vet clinic is on the old falklands farm or did enforcer die at your clinic?

I wish I knew if/where U81's rock was. My grandfather worked for Mr. Falk for 52 years. U81 and 107H were the "big name" bulls when I was growing up. When Mr. Falk had this stone made, I believe he placed it somewhere by the "big house". After awhile it made its way to a small private human cemetary on the farm. When Mrs. Falk sold the farm (after Mr. Falk died) a local church took over the cemetary and didn't want it there. It was in the weeds at the new owner's gift shop for years and I had my eye on it for years. I finally obtained it from the new owners of the farm and "brought it home". It has a lot of sentimental value for me. I didn't have enough "pull" with my wife to put it in her flower beds, but have it in a small lot coming in the driveway. Man, I loved that place.

Grant

Nice story. Congratulations on obtaining the rock for 107H. U81 might have never had a stone.

 

[1848]

What also makes me wonder is, 46B was another one of the greatest bulls to grace the pastures at McIvers and Mohicans and was from the Remitall Program. He only got 1 vote, I mean, Mohican and McIvers built a cowherd around that bull, maybe I am blind, but I thought he was very impressive and sired some of teh greatest females in the Hereford industry along with his sire 20X.

THG

or.........maybe some of us are just voting in a way to make you wonder.... ;-)

 

[leeshy]

I think the bull that has done better than Online is KCF Bennett 3008 M326. Wouldn't you all agree?

THG

No way, If you took 10 random cows bred 5 of them to anything you want and 5 to online. The five by Online would out weigh them and out sell them. Bottom line is we sell cattle by the pound.

 

[1848]

I think the bull that has done better than Online is KCF Bennett 3008 M326. Wouldn't you all agree?

THG

Then why didn't include 326 in your "Hundreth Anniversary Survey"?

 

[LFF]

Matt, have you tabulated the responses to this poll and compared them with all the other previous polls you've posted for favorite Hereford bull? Has the forum opinion changed in the 3(at least) years you've been taking these polls? Are any bulls coming up stronger or dropping in public opinion over the last 3 years?
If any bulls have markedly changed, + or -, in public opinion, please post those results.

Chris, you know, I have noticed in the past three years that 517 has dropped in interest to some breeders, that is the only down fall to him. The other bulls on that list are still doing well and holding a great name.

THG

517 has decreased because he has sons in production that are better than he is. A true testimony to the value of his genetics.

Of all the sons of 517, I believe that World Class takes home the trophy, that is my opinion. But again, 517 isn't my favorite bull, just not enough of a performance bull, but World Class sure has a lot more than his sire.

THG

NO WAY. What about Mr. Felt 3008? He would be my choice of 517 off spring. His only short comings that I am aware of is his ribeye area and his frame score. He is a very good sire to use on cattle that have large ribeyes. I'd like to find semen from him to breed to some of my herd, but it is almost impossible to locate any that can be purchased. I have to settle with some of 3008 sons. I've used Schular 5N , Huth Propsecter N065 , and still am considering Bennett M326, but I just hate the sway back that M326 has.

 

[Brandonm2]

I think the bull that has done better than Online is KCF Bennett 3008 M326. Wouldn't you all agree?

THG

No way, If you took 10 random cows bred 5 of them to anything you want and 5 to online. The five by Online would out weigh them and out sell them. Bottom line is we sell cattle by the pound.

They are both trait leaders in the growth traits so I don't see any significant difference there. Bennett has better calving ease and birth weight numbers and a whole lot better marbling. That is not enough to declare Bennett the better bull; but he is making it competitive.

http://www.herfnet.com/online/cgi-bin/i ... 2&9=525D5B

 

[oakcreekfarms]

I have seen m326 in person before, sway back never came to mind. Structurally he seems to be correct

 

[THG]

I think the bull that has done better than Online is KCF Bennett 3008 M326. Wouldn't you all agree?

THG

No way, If you took 10 random cows bred 5 of them to anything you want and 5 to online. The five by Online would out weigh them and out sell them. Bottom line is we sell cattle by the pound.

Hey, you sell them bu the pound, well, get this, M326 was gaining on test over 5lbs a day with the best IMF score ever recorded at KCF in all there existence in the hereford breed. So, ho wcould you go wrong with not using M326 to add pounds? Another thing, Bennett doesn't have any genetical defects, Online on the other hand, has bad feet, sons have bad feet, testicle problems, sons have had testicle problems, so again, which bull do you want to use? I think your nuts for using Online, I wouldn't. Maybe a steer jock, but heck, he isn't keeping the nuts on those bull calves, so he has nothing to worry about.

M326, may no tbe the biggest bull or won a lot of awards, but his success is in the pastures leaving his mark on many females and herd bulls, and not one has had a genetic defect, but its another world with Online bulls and females.

THG

 

[THG]

LFF, again, M326 is not swayed back, I have had my hands on the bull when KCF sold him in 2003 sale for $12000, he is not sway backed at all. Big top, not the biggest bull in the world, but one thick package.

THG

 

[leeshy]

You guys must opf been born in a foreign land if you think M326 can breed with Online. I dont care if the bull could of gained 10 lbs a day. He never came close to weigh as much as Online did at 205 or a year. So if your bulls weighs about 200 lbs less at weaning what makes you think his calves will weigh more? Second of all If you would of went to the Split Butte sale this past fall It would have been very easy for you to pick out all of the smallest and poorest calves there, they were all by a KCF Bennett 3008 M326 son. In fact if you want to buy a Bennett son I here he is for sale. In would dare say the price would be very reasonable. My last point is lets see how many M326 win at Denver. My bet is on Online.

 

[Brandonm2]

You guys must opf been born in a foreign land if you think M326 can breed with Online. I dont care if the bull could of gained 10 lbs a day. He never came close to weigh as much as Online did at 205 or a year. So if your bulls weighs about 200 lbs less at weaning what makes you think his calves will weigh more? Second of all If you would of went to the Split Butte sale this past fall It would have been very easy for you to pick out all of the smallest and poorest calves there, they were all by a KCF Bennett 3008 M326 son. In fact if you want to buy a Bennett son I here he is for sale. In would dare say the price would be very reasonable. My last point is lets see how many M326 win at Denver. My bet is on Online.

These are both proven veteran bulls with 100++ progeny in the database. I don't really CARE what they actually weighed themselves at this point. There are plenty of bulls who weaned at less than 600 pounds who are growthier sires than 700+++ lb bulls. It is what their calves do, not what they did that matters. When you don't have actual performance you look at predicted EPDs. When you don't have progeny you look at actual performance and predicted EPDs; but once you have progeny the only thing that matters is the EPD and the EPDs tell us that there is NO significant difference between Online and M326 in the growth EPDs. I also don't give a rip about who would beat who in Denver. M326 has A LOT more pigment and A LOT less white than Online which means he will sell more commercial bulls to the people that matter....the bull buyers not the dog and pony show people. From the glamour photos I do find Online's topline to be more desirable though. Then you add in the fact that M326 is a Hereford with IMF.

 

[oakcreekfarms]

Not only does he have a high IMF, but he has retained good REA growth while building upon those high marbling genetics. Something that other sires have had a problem doing. He also has maintained a decent BW while developing a very adequate spread. Since his average frame score is right at a frame 6 his calves carry more meat in a smaller package than online might offer. He is by far the better commercial bull producer. Does everyone know who the runner up bidder on ONline was?

 

[Herefords.US]

Does everyone know who the runner up bidder on ONline was?

I do. I believe he told me that he later used Online in a flush but he doesn't currently have any Online genetics in his herd.

George

 

[ollie?]

Grant , where's U81's rock? I assume your vet clinic is on the old falklands farm or did enforcer die at your clinic?

I wish I knew if/where U81's rock was. My grandfather worked for Mr. Falk for 52 years. U81 and 107H were the "big name" bulls when I was growing up. When Mr. Falk had this stone made, I believe he placed it somewhere by the "big house". After awhile it made its way to a small private human cemetary on the farm. When Mrs. Falk sold the farm (after Mr. Falk died) a local church took over the cemetary and didn't want it there. It was in the weeds at the new owner's gift shop for years and I had my eye on it for years. I finally obtained it from the new owners of the farm and "brought it home". It has a lot of sentimental value for me. I didn't have enough "pull" with my wife to put it in her flower beds, but have it in a small lot coming in the driveway. Man, I loved that place.

Grant

Kish did your grandad own a little set of cows there close to the falks? When did your grandad pass away?

 

[THG]

Oak, well, I do know who was the runner up on Remitall Nation Wide and also I know who was runner up on the Remitall Marvel 102N cow that sold to Larsons and I also know who was the runner up on a few others in that Remitall Sale when Online was sold, along with the majority of the other big time donor cows and herd bulls.

THG

 

[redfornow]

Oak, well, I do know who was the runner up on Remitall Nation Wide and also I know who was runner up on the Remitall Marvel 102N cow that sold to Larsons and I also know who was the runner up on a few others in that Remitall Sale when Online was sold, along with the majority of the other big time donor cows and herd bulls.

THG

:roll:

 

[THG]

Oak, well, I do know who was the runner up on Remitall Nation Wide and also I know who was runner up on the Remitall Marvel 102N cow that sold to Larsons and I also know who was the runner up on a few others in that Remitall Sale when Online was sold, along with the majority of the other big time donor cows and herd bulls.

THG

:roll:

What are you rolling your eyes about? You want me to tell you who those certain breeders were on Nation Wide or 102N? Nation Wide, when he was sold the first time, not in the last sale that Remitalls had in the Fall of 2007, but when Nation Wide was on the show circuit. Dave Nelson, ND and McIvers Happy Acres, MN, were runners up on Nation Wide. 102N, was purchased by Larson's Polled Herefords for $33,500 and the runner up bidder on 102N was DeShazer Cattle Co, TX.

THG