We have raised hundreds of dairy calves, we buy them from brokers about 30 at a time. Day 3 to 8 after they arrive is a critical time for us. Does anyone have any wonderful ideas for scour prevention and treatment and other problems besides the obvious such as sanitation. We vaccinate as soon as we get them for everything.
Dairy calf help please!!!!
- Thread starter rcnjcn
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Vicky the vet
Well-known member
Depending on the age of the calf when you receive them, and what and how you're using it, that could be entirely useless. How old, how and what are you giving them?rcnjcn":36umt8jr said:
Ron Bible
Member
You may or may not have used these suggestions.
When I get new calves, as soon as possible, I do these things:
1- give them intra-nasal spray of tsv-2 for quick immunization for IBR and a long term injection for this also.(virashield etc)
2- Worm shot or worm pill. (this will have to be repeated)
3- They should be put in a dry, warm, place...good hay to eat with clean water(I add chlorine bleach {1 cup per 80 gal} to drinking water for every other time I fill water tank.) ....gradually reduce this... but clean water is important. MUST give them an injection of a good 7 or 8 way vaccine. [for prevention of black-leg and scours]
If pneumonia is suspected ( not eating, red nose, slobbering) give 7 cc's NUFLOR along with scour tablets and pennecillen.
If not eating, but no slobbering or red nose, give scour tablets, penecillen, worm them. If the calf is still not eating, his breath stinks like hell, worm him, give him pro-biotics, or a couple of beers down his throat does the same thing, (his stomach bacteria isn't working. (antibiotics sometimes kill the natural bacteria. Lots of calves have died when a couple of budweisers would have saved them. R.B. ...........PS ....ALWAYS keep a handfull of sweet feed before them to get them started.
When I get new calves, as soon as possible, I do these things:
1- give them intra-nasal spray of tsv-2 for quick immunization for IBR and a long term injection for this also.(virashield etc)
2- Worm shot or worm pill. (this will have to be repeated)
3- They should be put in a dry, warm, place...good hay to eat with clean water(I add chlorine bleach {1 cup per 80 gal} to drinking water for every other time I fill water tank.) ....gradually reduce this... but clean water is important. MUST give them an injection of a good 7 or 8 way vaccine. [for prevention of black-leg and scours]
If pneumonia is suspected ( not eating, red nose, slobbering) give 7 cc's NUFLOR along with scour tablets and pennecillen.
If not eating, but no slobbering or red nose, give scour tablets, penecillen, worm them. If the calf is still not eating, his breath stinks like hell, worm him, give him pro-biotics, or a couple of beers down his throat does the same thing, (his stomach bacteria isn't working. (antibiotics sometimes kill the natural bacteria. Lots of calves have died when a couple of budweisers would have saved them. R.B. ...........PS ....ALWAYS keep a handfull of sweet feed before them to get them started.
Selling our Dairy a few years back, we decided to raise feedlot Holstein steers. We buy most of our bull calves from sucessful dairy's where we know that the momma was properly taken care of and the calves all received colostrum.(sp?). I have often came across the same predicament as you.
Our program for bring in calves is as follows:
1) every calf that comes onto the property gets a drench called BATTLE (for a mimimum of 2 days). That stuff is the bomb! It gives them a extra boost of energy and gives them an awesome appetite, kinda puts a "lion in their tank"!
2) all calves on milk replacer gets 2cc of corrid 1x a day until they are weaned.
3) you have to remember that theses calves come onto your property in a very stressed out condition, the calves that don't react to the BATTLE the way I'd like get something called Livestock Stress Formula. This works really well, too. It's rather expensive, but I've had excellent results. There's also an electrolyte that works quite well called bluelyte. Not quite as expensive, works good, but not as well as the Stress Formula. If I do buy calves from a sale barn, all calves get the BATTLE/LSF, for a mimimum of 5 days, no matter what!
4) using the BATTLE and LSF/Bluelyte works really good on the scours. I've had some pretty sick calves who seem to make a pretty good recovery, out of the last 74 calves we've brought in in the last few months, we've only lost 5.
5) if they are showing signs of pneumonia, I prefer to use Nuflor with SMZ (sulfa) boluses. Sometimes I'll also give them a shot of Banamine or Dextramethsone (sp?) both relieve pain and are anti-inflammatories, if they are in pretty bad shape.
We don't vaccinate these young calves at all, I've find that it's a waste of time and money that could be spent doing other things. When they are due for their second implant, I generally vaccinate at that time. I try to stay away from penicillin unless they appear to have a joint infection, mostly due to not using iodine on their navels at birth, some get infections through their navels.
This is just in my opinion, it works best for us. Other things work better for other operations.
Linda
p.s. That "beer" thing sounds like a good idea, I'll have to try it sometime.
Our program for bring in calves is as follows:
1) every calf that comes onto the property gets a drench called BATTLE (for a mimimum of 2 days). That stuff is the bomb! It gives them a extra boost of energy and gives them an awesome appetite, kinda puts a "lion in their tank"!
2) all calves on milk replacer gets 2cc of corrid 1x a day until they are weaned.
3) you have to remember that theses calves come onto your property in a very stressed out condition, the calves that don't react to the BATTLE the way I'd like get something called Livestock Stress Formula. This works really well, too. It's rather expensive, but I've had excellent results. There's also an electrolyte that works quite well called bluelyte. Not quite as expensive, works good, but not as well as the Stress Formula. If I do buy calves from a sale barn, all calves get the BATTLE/LSF, for a mimimum of 5 days, no matter what!
4) using the BATTLE and LSF/Bluelyte works really good on the scours. I've had some pretty sick calves who seem to make a pretty good recovery, out of the last 74 calves we've brought in in the last few months, we've only lost 5.
5) if they are showing signs of pneumonia, I prefer to use Nuflor with SMZ (sulfa) boluses. Sometimes I'll also give them a shot of Banamine or Dextramethsone (sp?) both relieve pain and are anti-inflammatories, if they are in pretty bad shape.
We don't vaccinate these young calves at all, I've find that it's a waste of time and money that could be spent doing other things. When they are due for their second implant, I generally vaccinate at that time. I try to stay away from penicillin unless they appear to have a joint infection, mostly due to not using iodine on their navels at birth, some get infections through their navels.
This is just in my opinion, it works best for us. Other things work better for other operations.
Linda
p.s. That "beer" thing sounds like a good idea, I'll have to try it sometime.
semen demon
Well-known member
I like the idea of beer, I'll have to try that one.
I use Anchor 7 and Tsv-2. In my opinion, you can very easily over do a vaccination program trying to prevent this problem. I think the real source of scours comes from a mediocre post calving regime. If you are getting the calves at about a week old, you are already on the uphill fight. The best you can hope for is to minimise your losses caused by it.
Nuflor and Excenel both work great. I have had alot of luck using a one time dose of Baytril even though it is not recommended for this particular problem. Also keep them hydrated. with electrolytes. I've had zero luck with boluses, i think they pass through the system way to fast under these conditionds to do any good.
I use Anchor 7 and Tsv-2. In my opinion, you can very easily over do a vaccination program trying to prevent this problem. I think the real source of scours comes from a mediocre post calving regime. If you are getting the calves at about a week old, you are already on the uphill fight. The best you can hope for is to minimise your losses caused by it.
Nuflor and Excenel both work great. I have had alot of luck using a one time dose of Baytril even though it is not recommended for this particular problem. Also keep them hydrated. with electrolytes. I've had zero luck with boluses, i think they pass through the system way to fast under these conditionds to do any good.
Ron Bible
Member
One of the posts stated that scour boluses don't seem to do any good. It may seem this way but they actually DO. Let me explain: If a calf is scouring, you give it a good scour bolus...the next day the calf is dead....{i experienced that}.you conclude that the bolus was not effective. What happens in this case is that the bolus DID kill scour bacteria in the intestine.....but by this time, very small holes have developed in the intestine, contaminating the blood stream. (boluses do not help this)........that is why a good heavy dose of penecillen is a MUST when giving a scour bolus. this cleans up the blood.........There are different things that have different symptoms...(worms, pneumonia, stomach bacteria killed by antibiotics) and others, but penecillen should ALWAYS be given with a scour bolus.......worm them again!!!
tapeworm
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I dont think you know what your talking about..scour pills dont jsut work in the gut...there absorbed into the blood to. Peopel have used em for years without following your orders of giving pen as a MUST. And you just waste your money giving virashield andblackleg vacine to a baby calf like you said was a MUST. and how many stomach worms do you really thinka baby calf is gunna have?? jeez...why not just throw money at em and hope it worksRon Bible":1aukqo66 said:
Ron Bible
Member
your answer to my post was so idiotic, it doesn't deserve a reply, No, Its obvious you haven't raised very many calves. I buy mostly from 2 months on. Even baby calves can die from IBR .....Sulfa drugs aren't the complete answer to the scour
problem either. I've raised about 500 from a very young age up...lost very few of them. I've experimented on enough of them with different treatments to find out what works best.
I know what i'm talking about. I'm glad you weren't around to advise me. wannabe farmers like yourself do nothing but confuse people who are looking for accurate info in raising thier calves.
No more replys for me.
problem either. I've raised about 500 from a very young age up...lost very few of them. I've experimented on enough of them with different treatments to find out what works best.
I know what i'm talking about. I'm glad you weren't around to advise me. wannabe farmers like yourself do nothing but confuse people who are looking for accurate info in raising thier calves.
No more replys for me.
tapeworm
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Hello ronny..were you calling me an idiot?? thats not very nice but i can take it. LOL Now you say you buy mostly form 2 months on?? well the rest of us were talking about baby calves ronny...if you want to talk about 2 months and older I wont argue with vacinating and worming em. But we were talking about babies...but dont worry...I had trouble staying with the class in school to and still finsihed high school. I really like the part where you say "I know what i'm talking about " Yessiree I always have to beleive somebody when they tell me that. And the part about raising 500 calves?? maybe that makes you the cowboy with the fastest stick horse where you come from but out here in cow country only a 4h kid woujld brag about that
I want these new peopel to save money everwhere they can ronny...so they have a chance to make it. If you say to vacinate babies with killed vaccine like vshield or to vaccinate babies with blackleg i wish you would tell me all you know about imune response in baby calves..tell me what you know about that response if they got colstrum or if not. and also tell me all you know about the lifeof stomach worms since you think peopel shold worm their babies. Teach us all you know cowboy so maybe we can ride a fast stickhorse to
I want these new peopel to save money everwhere they can ronny...so they have a chance to make it. If you say to vacinate babies with killed vaccine like vshield or to vaccinate babies with blackleg i wish you would tell me all you know about imune response in baby calves..tell me what you know about that response if they got colstrum or if not. and also tell me all you know about the lifeof stomach worms since you think peopel shold worm their babies. Teach us all you know cowboy so maybe we can ride a fast stickhorse to
Ron Bible
Member
It's not bragging, doofus......it's a fact.
You can't teach people that refuse to listen(you)
like I said, your posts don't deserve a response.Your many posts show you don't have time to spend w/calves anyway.
I rest my case Wannabe.
You can't teach people that refuse to listen(you)
like I said, your posts don't deserve a response.Your many posts show you don't have time to spend w/calves anyway.
I rest my case Wannabe.
We buy ours at two or three days old. Two months old is a horse of a different color all together. If you can get them to two weeks old you've crossed a pretty good hurdle. After two months old they are pretty much planning their own families by then. I don't have much if any problems after two months. Maybe an occasional case of grass scours. But thats about it. 8)
Ron Bible":2i701kcg said:
I looked hard - and found nothing about sulfonamides in general NOT being absorbed into the blood stream, and nothing about any other antibiotics (ie penicillin) that SHOULD or MUST be given in conjunction with a sulfonamide.
Sounds questionable to me.
I get the majority of my calves with 24 hours of age, and as I'll take them as soon as they've had their second feeding of colostrum, I have taken them as early as 12 hours of age. It's from then to weaning (2 months) that they're at the most risk for infections/diseases. Once I've weaned them, that's when everyone else wants them - they're easy to raise from then on. :lol:
Ron Bible":2fhdj2rk said:
I'm going to have to chime in here, too. Never have we ever given penicillin with scour pills and we haven't lost a calf to scours in a more years than I can remember. I call a BS flag to this, as well.
TR
Well-known member
Here are 2 home remedies for scours posted here a while back. I think Cattle Annie posted the first one, and Ollie the 2nd. Just throwing them out there for additional info, as I haven't had to use them and can't personally attest to their effectiveness.
1.5 Litres (just over a Quart) Warm Water
2 TBSP Brown Sugar
1 TBSP Salt
1 Raw Egg
1 TBSP Javex Bleach
Mix well and administer by tubing.
Here's how it apparently works:
The sugar, salt, water mixture is the equivalent of electrolytes (keeps the calf from dehydrating and provides energy).
The egg coats the stomach wall (and possibly provides some protein).
The bleach kills the scours bacteria.
And:
1.5 Litres (just over a Quart) Warm Water
2 TBSP Brown Sugar
1 TBSP Salt
1 Raw Egg
1 TBSP Javex Bleach
Mix well and administer by tubing.
Here's how it apparently works:
The sugar, salt, water mixture is the equivalent of electrolytes (keeps the calf from dehydrating and provides energy).
The egg coats the stomach wall (and possibly provides some protein).
The bleach kills the scours bacteria.
And:
Ollie":lb53aeeb said:
