BioPryn?

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You guys that use the syringe, seems like it would be harder. When the vacuum needle enters the caudal vessel the vial fills in a second, literally. You don't have to poke, pull, poke, pull.

With a syringe you are not going to know when you are in the vessel unless you pull back on the plunger. Seems harder. Any comments? Ok, promise not to hit this mule again but just saw another post above of someone who prefers the 3 cc syringe.
 
I'm just an old dinosaur, I guess.
Never, ever used one of the vacutainer needle holders... always tail-bled with a needle and syringe...been doing it that way for 35 years...usually with a 6 or 12 cc syringe, because I was usually going for more blood than I'd need, just to make sure there was plenty if I needed to request additional tests. 3cc syringe... even smaller and easier to manipulate.
Folks working at the diagnostic labs are good at their jobs, but you've gotta have enough sample for them to work with.

BF - call or PM me if you have more Qs.
 
Lucky_P":2qtfrej4 said:
I'm just an old dinosaur, I guess.
Never, ever used one of the vacutainer needle holders... always tail-bled with a needle and syringe...been doing it that way for 35 years...usually with a 6 or 12 cc syringe, because I was usually going for more blood than I'd need, just to make sure there was plenty if I needed to request additional tests. 3cc syringe... even smaller and easier to manipulate.
Folks working at the diagnostic labs are good at their jobs, but you've gotta have enough sample for them to work with.
What gauge needle are you using?
 
We got our testing kit from jeffers, all expenses included with the purchase of the kit( excluding shipping to the lab). We used the vacuum tubes and as stated above it gets messy after a few. I insert the needle first to find the artery and then puncture the tube once I have blood coming out.
 
inyati there's really not much difference. I have used both but just seem to like the syringe method. I buy a box of 100 syringes from Air-Tight products that have a 18ga x 1 1/2" needle already attached. Cost less than .25 each with freight. You really don't need a needle that long but thats the way they come. I pull the plunger back about 1/4"inch before I giver her a poke and you will see blood enter the syringe when you hit the vein. Pull it on back and it quickly fills. Air-Tight also sells the vacutainers.
 
bird dog":3inucys1 said:
inyati there's really not much difference. I have used both but just seem to like the syringe method. I buy a box of 100 syringes from Air-Tight products that have a 18ga x 1 1/2" needle already attached. Cost less than .25 each with freight. You really don't need a needle that long but thats the way they come. I pull the plunger back about 1/4"inch before I giver her a poke and you will see blood enter the syringe when you hit the vein. Pull it on back and it quickly fills. Air-Tight also sells the vacutainers.

Bird dog. Thanks. I hope this is not annoying because if there is a better mouse trap, I plan to employ it. Do you mean you pull the plunger back just after breaking the skin? Because if you pull it back before the poke, a vacuum is not created. Please explain. I might be missing a simple point.
 
I pull the plunger back just enough to break the seal and give some room for some blood to flow in before it pierces the skin. Usually 1/4 to 1/2 inch. Then I push it in where I think the vein is at. If I miss, I don't usually pull it completely out, just move it around to find the vein.
One of my problems when I started was pushing all the way through the vein. In a lot of animals it is barely under the skin so your needle is running parallel to the tail if you are holding the tail straight up. The little three ml syringes don't take much to pull back and I have learned to hold it with my thumb and first two fingers and pull back the syringe with the ring and pinky finger while the other hand holds the tail.

I really wouldn't think this way is better, it just allows a little more room for error when leaning how to do it. If you miss, push the plunger back to the starting point and try again.

One thing I have learned is that it easier to do with just a head gate and chute if you can stand on the edge of the chute to elevate yourself somewhat. It makes it much easier on the back to hold the tail with one hand and bend over the top rail to access the back of the cow. You also don't get $hyte on so much.
Another is that it is not 100% accurate. I had a nice young second calf cow that tested open but luckily I liked her enough to move her with the bull. She calved about 7 months later.

In one group I did last year, the technician said that one cow was a "weak" pregnancy. I didn't know what that was so I emailed him. He said in a lot of cases, its when Ia cow aborts a very young fetus shortly before you tested her. Sure enough he was right as it took about 10 months after that for her to calve. Its a good management tool that doesn't cost much.
 
It saves you more than it cost. How long you gotta feed/maintain an open female until she's cost ya $5?
 
bird dog":2n0demfq said:
I pull the plunger back just enough to break the seal and give some room for some blood to flow in before it pierces the skin. Usually 1/4 to 1/2 inch. Then I push it in where I think the vein is at. If I miss, I don't usually pull it completely out, just move it around to find the vein.
One of my problems when I started was pushing all the way through the vein. In a lot of animals it is barely under the skin so your needle is running parallel to the tail if you are holding the tail straight up. The little three ml syringes don't take much to pull back and I have learned to hold it with my thumb and first two fingers and pull back the syringe with the ring and pinky finger while the other hand holds the tail.

I really wouldn't think this way is better, it just allows a little more room for error when leaning how to do it. If you miss, push the plunger back to the starting point and try again.

One thing I have learned is that it easier to do with just a head gate and chute if you can stand on the edge of the chute to elevate yourself somewhat. It makes it much easier on the back to hold the tail with one hand and bend over the top rail to access the back of the cow. You also don't get $hyte on so much.
Another is that it is not 100% accurate. I had a nice young second calf cow that tested open but luckily I liked her enough to move her with the bull. She calved about 7 months later.

In one group I did last year, the technician said that one cow was a "weak" pregnancy. I didn't know what that was so I emailed him. He said in a lot of cases, its when Ia cow aborts a very young fetus shortly before you tested her. Sure enough he was right as it took about 10 months after that for her to calve. Its a good management tool that doesn't cost much.

Great description. Thank you. I wonder if you broke the seal, pierced the skin and then pulled the plunger back if you could create a small vacuum that would pull in the blood much like the vacuum created by the vacutainer.
 
I have pulled THOUSANDS of tail blood samples! I used to work on the research study where the research company was trying to get, I think, Cystorelin approved (it was a cystic ovary study, dairy cattle in CA were prone to cysts). My job working for the research company was to pull blood samples on thousands of dairy cattle. I was told what dairy, and what time the string would be caught in the feeding stanchions (in CA) and my job was to show up, pull a blood sample on the entire string, and label the tubes. Needless to say, I have pulled more than I care to ever count. We NEVER used a needle and syringe, that would have been cost prohibitive! Our vacutainer tubes and needles never got dirty, but our needles had a rubber end on them, like this.
2077td0.jpg

The rubber on the end prevented the blood from dripping out, until you pushed the tube up on the needle. No blood, no mess. We could not afford cross contamination when collecting the samples. It was really quite simple; lift the tail, poke with the needle, push the tube on the needle, wait a few seconds for it to fill half full, then pull out and hand off the tube to the person to label while I move to the next cow and load the next vacutainer.
 
We send ours to SEK Gentics here in Kansas. My husband has a guy from his work that goes down that way couple times a month, so he just took the samples down for us on testing day. pulled blood sunday night, through in the fridge till Tuesday morning. Got the results Wednesday or maybe Thursday. $2.50 per test.
 
We are going to try these just for convenience. So for those that do it how long do you wait after exposure to test? I was thinking give them enough time to have had 2 heats since the bull was put in plus the 28 days they say they have to be bred to show a positive. Am I thinking wrong? If so it would not be the first time.
 
According to the company 28 days on heifers (we have pulled blood on day 29) and 28 days on cows plus 70 days post calving. So far they are 100% accurate for us on pregnancies.

We sent the test out on Monday to the Florida lab and had results Wednesday afternoon of the same week.
 
jscunn":2yivbts1 said:
According to the company 28 days on heifers (we have pulled blood on day 29) and 28 days on cows plus 70 days post calving. So far they are 100% accurate for us on pregnancies.

We sent the test out on Monday to the Florida lab and had results Wednesday afternoon of the same week.
I guess I am asking how long after exposure? I was thinking give them 2 heats cycles plus the 28 days so at least 70 days since turning in with the bull.
 
Pulled our samples Saturday, out in the mail Monday and got results today. Overall fairly quick I thought, did out our convenience. Will probably do again, pulling the blood was easy on some and hard on others. A few of them probably felt like pin cushions.
 
How long can I leave a blood sample in the fridge? I have 4 different herds I want to pull. Can I pull some tonight and wait till wed. Morning to take them too the lab?
 
Tbrake":2tobbn8r said:
How long can I leave a blood sample in the fridge? I have 4 different herds I want to pull. Can I pull some tonight and wait till wed. Morning to take them too the lab?

Yes I thInk that would be fine. I have done them on Friday's and waited till Monday to send them before. I always put mine in the refrigerator until I send them
 
pricefarm":2wqv3053 said:
Tbrake":2wqv3053 said:
How long can I leave a blood sample in the fridge? I have 4 different herds I want to pull. Can I pull some tonight and wait till wed. Morning to take them too the lab?

Yes I thInk that would be fine. I have done them on Friday's and waited till Monday to send them before. I always put mine in the refrigerator until I send them

I've waited that long and had no problems.
 

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