Aussies . . . Anyone heard of Supergene evaluation system
- Thread starter Keren
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No joke zingaah!
Its part of their asessment system, aparantly its another sign of fertility or tenderness or some b@#%y thing.
Another way to explain this part is "pointy" ears. In real life it is a sure sign of bad bad temperament. They are the ones in the mob that stick their heads in the air and take off to the other end of the paddock when you open the gate!!!!!!!
Its part of their asessment system, aparantly its another sign of fertility or tenderness or some b@#%y thing.
Another way to explain this part is "pointy" ears. In real life it is a sure sign of bad bad temperament. They are the ones in the mob that stick their heads in the air and take off to the other end of the paddock when you open the gate!!!!!!!
I'm not sure if the Supergene evaluators give extra marks for tippy ears but they downgrade any animal with hairy ears in contrast to clean ones. It is a demonstration of the type they prefer. According to the evaluators the more an animal looks like a milking cow the better and I have heard some of their Red Polls referred to as Red Jerseys and that is appropriate for the Supergene type when you look for meat yield which is what we get paid for.
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Keren
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no-one will ever be able to explain to you the point score system Peter Chilcott uses, because he wont explain it properly to anyone ... the idea is that we lowly cattle farmers dont understand it, so he has to come out and grade your herd every year ... hey if we could do it ourselves he wouldnt make any money now, would he? he assures his security by being the only person who can grade cattle according to the supergene system ...
I can shed some light on the assessment system.
But firstly I will apologise as I havn't done a "refresher" corse or taken part in an actual assesment !!!!!!! :lol: :roll: :lol: BUT I guess I should be ashmed to admit that I do understand how the system works.
As beef cattle breeders we all should know what beef animals are suposed to look like!!
From what I can see he has four groups. These are easy to follow. Group 4 being a beef type, group 3, group 2 and group 1 which he claims to be the best type. The group 1 cattle are a very dairy type, fine boned, narrow back ends, lack any constitution. To a beef breeder these cows would be automatically culled !!
He condemms group 4 and 3.
The AA are meant to meant the fertility, and the 7 is the tender score which ranges from 1 to 7. 1 being tough and 7 being most tender (aparantly)
Heres an example. (Group1 AA 7) This is the highest rank you can get for an animal and the photo's that have been PM'd around are good examples of this rank.
So a (Group4 B 1) is meant to be infertile and tough as old boots.
But I will also note that the system seems to change if they find out you have got genetics that they don't approve of. It could also change if they find out the animals have supergene approved genetics in the animals. Funny ae :lol:
When they ascess the animals they pinch the skin mainly but also do something with the ribs. Think its to do with how flat they are.
A high chine, greasey or wet spine, tail length are meant to be checked too I think.
P C used to breed good cattle. Many many years ago but well before my time, then he imported a bull from another country that I will not name and it left all narrow fine boned dairy types so instead of admitting a mistake he sarted promoting the falts of the imported bull as good points. Then he bred his cattle in the opposite direction and his followers did the same.
Well thats about all I know. There is a diagram of the 4 groups floating around somewhere. I beta track it down.
Hope this helps but let me warn everybody "Do not go there if you want your beef herd to get anywhere"
But firstly I will apologise as I havn't done a "refresher" corse or taken part in an actual assesment !!!!!!! :lol: :roll: :lol: BUT I guess I should be ashmed to admit that I do understand how the system works.
As beef cattle breeders we all should know what beef animals are suposed to look like!!
From what I can see he has four groups. These are easy to follow. Group 4 being a beef type, group 3, group 2 and group 1 which he claims to be the best type. The group 1 cattle are a very dairy type, fine boned, narrow back ends, lack any constitution. To a beef breeder these cows would be automatically culled !!
He condemms group 4 and 3.
The AA are meant to meant the fertility, and the 7 is the tender score which ranges from 1 to 7. 1 being tough and 7 being most tender (aparantly)
Heres an example. (Group1 AA 7) This is the highest rank you can get for an animal and the photo's that have been PM'd around are good examples of this rank.
So a (Group4 B 1) is meant to be infertile and tough as old boots.
But I will also note that the system seems to change if they find out you have got genetics that they don't approve of. It could also change if they find out the animals have supergene approved genetics in the animals. Funny ae :lol:
When they ascess the animals they pinch the skin mainly but also do something with the ribs. Think its to do with how flat they are.
A high chine, greasey or wet spine, tail length are meant to be checked too I think.
P C used to breed good cattle. Many many years ago but well before my time, then he imported a bull from another country that I will not name and it left all narrow fine boned dairy types so instead of admitting a mistake he sarted promoting the falts of the imported bull as good points. Then he bred his cattle in the opposite direction and his followers did the same.
Well thats about all I know. There is a diagram of the 4 groups floating around somewhere. I beta track it down.
Hope this helps but let me warn everybody "Do not go there if you want your beef herd to get anywhere"
Ive been away for a while but i can assure Keren and Zingaah that there is a system the "Supergene" people use. Ive got a copy but can't locate it at present time but Red Poll52 is correct when he says it is split into four sections.
For Two thousand Aussie Dollars anyone can be taught how to evaluate any cattle on the "Supergene" system and you get invited to go on refresher courses from time to time but I've never heard of anyone who has done this.
It all looks a bit like a "Ponzi" scheme, they were the cunning plans used by some people who are either in jail or heading that way after all the trouble they caused in the finance world. At least with this outfit the only ones to be ruined are those silly enough to follow the crazy ideas.
One thing I do know is that it takes a really good con man to succeed using such schemes but eventually they get caught up with.
For Two thousand Aussie Dollars anyone can be taught how to evaluate any cattle on the "Supergene" system and you get invited to go on refresher courses from time to time but I've never heard of anyone who has done this.
It all looks a bit like a "Ponzi" scheme, they were the cunning plans used by some people who are either in jail or heading that way after all the trouble they caused in the finance world. At least with this outfit the only ones to be ruined are those silly enough to follow the crazy ideas.
One thing I do know is that it takes a really good con man to succeed using such schemes but eventually they get caught up with.
Australian
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redpoll52 you summed it up well. I seen some beautiful South Devon cows that Mr Supergene assessed back a few years ago, they were good beefy cows that were assessed as lowest in his scale. I bought one of them, she went onto produce some of my better cattle. The cattle that were retained by the breeder were light boned and very dairy type which the SD breed had been trying to get away from for years. Needless to say that good beefy herd is no longer in existence. So be very careful.
ShuterSunset
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Redpoll52, can you pm me those pics as well. We raise Red Polls over here in the USA and am always interested in what is going on in the other countries with Red Polls.
Yes thats right Malter. And they are claiming its because their meat is so tender and tasty !! Im sure !!! :lol: :lol:
Its common knowlege that old cull cows all go for manufacturing beef, ie. Mince, sausages etc. Not good prime stock.
Whats happened to their $52/kg meat I wonder?
Australian, I didn't realise South Devons were having the same trouble with Chilcotts followers as we are. :frowns: Most that Ive seen in NZ have been good ones. Our Royal show usually has a good line up and one stud in particular have really top stock. They come from Nelson/Blenheim area. Thats the top of the south island, NZ. The group 3 and 4 cows are always an assett to any herd. Well done for getting one, I bet she will leave you some good calves.
From what Ive seen and heard here, any Red Polls that Chilcott has chucked out have gone straight to the works, and never offered to others
We still have a handfull of proper beef breeders though and one has bought in some good semen in the last couple of years
Its common knowlege that old cull cows all go for manufacturing beef, ie. Mince, sausages etc. Not good prime stock.
Whats happened to their $52/kg meat I wonder?
Australian, I didn't realise South Devons were having the same trouble with Chilcotts followers as we are. :frowns: Most that Ive seen in NZ have been good ones. Our Royal show usually has a good line up and one stud in particular have really top stock. They come from Nelson/Blenheim area. Thats the top of the south island, NZ. The group 3 and 4 cows are always an assett to any herd. Well done for getting one, I bet she will leave you some good calves.
From what Ive seen and heard here, any Red Polls that Chilcott has chucked out have gone straight to the works, and never offered to others
We still have a handfull of proper beef breeders though and one has bought in some good semen in the last couple of years
Good call Malter :lol:
We have just had the annual competition trying to find New Zealands best "Pie".
Funny how Supergene didn't win, or even get a mention. Maybe they are not proud of the fact they "aparantly" have the best pies around. Or maybe they are quietly ashamed that their cattle are only good for "Pies".
From $52/kg for their supergene asessed meat one minute, to promoting "Pies" the next minute. :?
Thats good marketing skills SUPERGENE followers !!! :clap: (not)
We have just had the annual competition trying to find New Zealands best "Pie".
Funny how Supergene didn't win, or even get a mention. Maybe they are not proud of the fact they "aparantly" have the best pies around. Or maybe they are quietly ashamed that their cattle are only good for "Pies".
From $52/kg for their supergene asessed meat one minute, to promoting "Pies" the next minute. :?
Thats good marketing skills SUPERGENE followers !!! :clap: (not)
The pasrty would be very enjoyable I think. Yes you could probably give the meat to the dogs after it had been slow cooked for a few days. I still remember the supergene steak I once ate. Neva again, it was totally the opposite to their claims. :lol:
I have been connected with Supergene from the start around 21 years through every stage I know more than all of you in how it works and what I have found on this site is that if you don't understand everything that is shown to you I feel this means you are living in the days when they used draft houses and cooked with dripping
So if you haven't been and haven't seen and don't really know what you are talking about what gives you the right to judge a system that works for others or is it to hard to look at a change in how you do things :cboy:
So if you haven't been and haven't seen and don't really know what you are talking about what gives you the right to judge a system that works for others or is it to hard to look at a change in how you do things :cboy:
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I've been to a couple of his seminars years ago. Hear very little about Peter now. I liked some of the things he said they were old ways of seeing things in various animals.I've never ever seen a herd that was evaluated by him and that are still using his principles many years down the track. Can you enlighten us and others on the board as to where we might see a herd that was evaluated a long time ago and still using the system. To be truthful it has more going for it than Breedplan.
Bear in mind everyone is entitled to their opinions good or bad.
Bear in mind everyone is entitled to their opinions good or bad.
Hi a little about Supergene
Peter in 1989 came to me and said would I like to do some work for him I said ok I didn't know anything about farming so I was as green as the grass I was shown every thing from the start
I went from the farm to owning my own meat business Super Lean and Tender which I still have a connection with
Then I worked with Global Keys meat company as a Executive Manager
Now I use Peters Grading to grade people to put them in the positions that will be more productive Yes I use the Grading system for people with a lot of success
I am a Personal consultant and a Security crowd control Agent Safe Street Security Tasmania
If every one that knocks what Peter is doing could see with a open mind what I have see and been involved in it may change how they breed
With who still uses the system I have only just started to get strongly involved with the system again because things are getting bigger I have been asked to work again I will be in Sydney next month
So it comes down to this some will get involved others will miss out it doesn't bother me what others do :tiphat: :clap:
Peter in 1989 came to me and said would I like to do some work for him I said ok I didn't know anything about farming so I was as green as the grass I was shown every thing from the start
I went from the farm to owning my own meat business Super Lean and Tender which I still have a connection with
Then I worked with Global Keys meat company as a Executive Manager
Now I use Peters Grading to grade people to put them in the positions that will be more productive Yes I use the Grading system for people with a lot of success
I am a Personal consultant and a Security crowd control Agent Safe Street Security Tasmania
If every one that knocks what Peter is doing could see with a open mind what I have see and been involved in it may change how they breed
With who still uses the system I have only just started to get strongly involved with the system again because things are getting bigger I have been asked to work again I will be in Sydney next month
So it comes down to this some will get involved others will miss out it doesn't bother me what others do :tiphat: :clap:
