What's it gonna take...

[shortybreeder]

to get an A.I. stud to carry a shorthorn bull? Now before we go on a tangent about colors and discounts and showiness and etc., I'm asking what are the traits that would make a shorthorn bull desirable enough to be listed by a commercially-oriented AI stud such as Genex? What are commercial producers currently looking for in their sires? Shorthorns down in Australia are hard-working, production machines, so why can't we bring some of their genetics up here to work in the United States? You'd be hard-pressed to find a tougher environment, so I'd expect the cattle to thrive around here.

I guess the main question that I'm looking for a thread to form around is this: If you had the opportunity to travel down into Australia and look for the "Ideal" commercial bull, what traits would you be looking for? I believe in order for the commercial industry to accept him in this country, he would have to be solid red. Beyond that, I want to hear opinions from the commercial side--if you don't use A.I., for the sake of this thread, let's assume you breed every cow/heifer at least once A.I. per year.

Go!

 

[Nesikep]

Solid red would be a definite requirement in my books (still getting rid of chrome, even though I like it)...
Other than that, MEAT and not too much frame would be other things I would be scrutinizing.. that's apart from the basics of calving ease, etc. Fellow I worked for years ago was the president of the BC shorthorn association... we got our first bull from him, and followed up with another from further north (he didn't work out for long). We got some good cows from the first one, top producers, and the granddaughters are pretty darned good too.

 

[Muddy]

He better be solid red and not a single white hair, low birth weight, good calving ease and moderate frame. Also he better be good at producing retainable daughters while the sons sell well at the sale barn.

 

[cow pollinater]

ABS markets Origen product and origen has several good commercial shorthorn bulls.

 

[bball]

He better be solid red and not a single white hair, low birth weight, good calving ease and moderate frame. Also he better be good at producing retainable daughters while the sons sell well at the sale barn.

I love the SH female's crosses I have.. just wished they crossed better with Angus (less heterosis)...as the majority of commercial cattle in US are AN influenced. I think this is what hurts them most here.,so that's what I would like to see.

 

[Nesikep]

Crossed with GV they make some nice cows.. a little smaller and stouter with more meat.. if you want a taller cow Limo is a nice cross too, but the jury is out for me on how they'll produce as cows

 

[Muddy]

He better be solid red and not a single white hair, low birth weight, good calving ease and moderate frame. Also he better be good at producing retainable daughters while the sons sell well at the sale barn.

I love the SH female's crosses I have.. just wished they crossed better with Angus (less heterosis)...as the majority of commercial cattle in US are AN influenced. I think this is what hurts them most here.,so that's what I would like to see.

I got a F1 ShorthornPlus heifer calf here out of Shorthorn cow and a black Angus bull. She looks like very promising calf as replacement but I'm a little disappointed that she didn't get any boost from heterosis. But I'm hoping that a Simmental bull will take care of that problem when she's enough old to breed.

 

[Workinonit Farm]

I'm wondering if they companies feel that there isn't enough demand for the SH semen.

Just a guess.

 

[Nesikep]

Does it really cost that much to stock some? Is there such a short expiry date on it?

They just don't want to lift a finger to help anyone.

 

[muleskinner]

Bull Barn has a good number Shorthorn bulls listed.


http://bullbarn.com/shortprice.asp

 

[shortybreeder]

Bull Barn has a good number Shorthorn bulls listed.


http://bullbarn.com/shortprice.asp

From what I understand Bull Barn is just a middle man that coordinates sales, doesn't really stock semen just communicates orders to the breeder. Could be wrong though :hide:

 

[shortybreeder]

Does it really cost that much to stock some? Is there such a short expiry date on it?

They just don't want to lift a finger to help anyone.

There really is no expiration date, but genetics do go "out of fashion" and I agree, they don't want to lift a finger to help anyone-especially a breed that could potentially end the black reign if breeders made a coordinated effort to improve the commercially-accepted qualities of a breed alongside a company with enough semen marketshare to push the ideas and improvements to the large commercial guys. :2cents:

 

[M.Magis]

Now you're getting into conspiracy theories, ones that don't even make sense. Why would any AI company care about ending the "black reign"? They sell what people want, they have no reason to care what color. Until the commercial market changes to where a shorthorn cross can offer advantages over angus based, and I'm not sure how that happens, AI companies will continue to carry fewer shorthorn bulls. To be honest, there are numerous breeds that have a lot to offer, but I don't see shorthorn as the one to take over the market no matter what "coordinated effort" is made. And to be clear, I'm a big fan of shorthorns.
And as already mentioned, there is already semen available from good quality shorthorn bulls.

 

[Jake]

Now you're getting into conspiracy theories, ones that don't even make sense. Why would any AI company care about ending the "black reign"? They sell what people want, they have no reason to care what color. Until the commercial market changes to where a shorthorn cross can offer advantages over angus based, and I'm not sure how that happens, AI companies will continue to carry fewer shorthorn bulls. To be honest, there are numerous breeds that have a lot to offer, but I don't see shorthorn as the one to take over the market no matter what "coordinated effort" is made. And to be clear, I'm a big fan of shorthorns.
And as already mentioned, there is already semen available from good quality shorthorn bulls.

:clap: :clap:

Semen companies aren't here to do anything other than make money. They have no reason to "lift a finger" to help promote any breed over another. They are going to house and collect bulls that have enough demand to make them a profit.

 

[muleskinner]

Bull Barn has a good number Shorthorn bulls listed.


http://bullbarn.com/shortprice.asp

From what I understand Bull Barn is just a middle man that coordinates sales, doesn't really stock semen just communicates orders to the breeder. Could be wrong though :hide:

Shorty Breeder Be honest I do not know how they operate. All's I know is that this spring they had semen on a bull that had just died and the Main semen company did not have any. It was stored at there facility. Other than that I don't know.

 

[turning grass into beef]

Try this
http://issuu.com/semex2010/docs/beefcat ... 9/10572413
pages 62 - 65
We have commercial bull customers that only buy roan bulls. Black hide does not always mean british blood anymore. Our customers want the buyers to know that there is britsh blood in their calves.
I you are lookng for a solid red bull with performance feel free to contact me personally. We have semen in the U.S stored at Hawkeye Breeders.
In response to your question about what traits that you would look for that would depend on what your objectives are for you calf crop. For us, we believe that shorthorns are a maternal breed. Thus when we use a shorthorn bull fertility, fleshing ability, calving ease, docility, udder quality, and correct structural conformation are all equally at the top of the list. (As we get older and are not as mobile, docility is staring to become even more important). Color is not even a factor. If we happen to get performance out of a shorthorn bull, then that is a bonus. A shorthorn bull is designed to sire honest, hard working mother cows. Period. There are lots of breeds out there that the commercial cattemen can use to get extreme performance.
By the way, the customers mentioned above are using roan shorthorn bulls mostly on charolais and simmental cross cows.

 

[Muddy]

By the way, the customers mentioned above are using roan shorthorn bulls mostly on charolais and simmental cross cows.

That's quite disappointing, given the fact that majority of commercial cows are Angus influenced.

 

[Son of Butch]

Try this
http://issuu.com/semex2010/docs/beefcat ... 9/10572413
pages 62 - 65
if you are looking for a solid red bull...

That is a lot of bulls to page through... to find only 1 out of the 7 shorthorns is solid red.

 

[Son of Butch]

Crossed with GV they make some nice cows...

Yes, GVs make nice cows.

 

[shortybreeder]

Now you're getting into conspiracy theories, ones that don't even make sense. Why would any AI company care about ending the "black reign"? They sell what people want, they have no reason to care what color. Until the commercial market changes to where a shorthorn cross can offer advantages over angus based, and I'm not sure how that happens, AI companies will continue to carry fewer shorthorn bulls. To be honest, there are numerous breeds that have a lot to offer, but I don't see shorthorn as the one to take over the market no matter what "coordinated effort" is made. And to be clear, I'm a big fan of shorthorns.
And as already mentioned, there is already semen available from good quality shorthorn bulls.

I apologize for making this sound conspiracy theory-ish, that was not my intent and to avoid the "It's Sir Loin again!" Fiasco I retract that statement about the "black reign". And I know there are a few production shorthorns out there, but a vast majority are showy shorthorns. I guess the reason I brought this up, is because my family has been using Genex since it was 21st Century, and in the past year or so they took all of the Shorthorn sires off their website, and they've never been in the catalogs (except maybe in the "Added Attractions" section). I have a passion for Shorthorns and I've always been a proud Genex customer, but now it seems I can't be both, so I wanted to see what it would take to get them back in the Genex line-up.