What are the different Angus lines known to produce?

[Square_Dancer]

Hey everyone,

I was hoping some of the brilliant minds here could help explain what some of the different Angus bloodlines are known for producing (e.g. calving ease, weight gain, marbling, fertility, etc.). Tons of SAV, GAR, Sitz, etc. bulls out there, many of which are raved about and others not so much, but I was just wondering if anyone could provide a general overview about some of these lines. I know bloodlines are not 100% guarantees in outcomes, but I know certain lines have propensities to produce certain traits. Thanks for your time.

 

[Dave]

Pretty general question so I will give you a general answer. Hoover Dam.

 

[jschoolcraft86]

Forgive me Dave but I have heard the name Hoover Dam quite a bit but I don't know much about him. I'm looking at EPDs on him now and he sure has some high accuracy numbers (I think anyway?) so obviously people like him. What would you say is his calling card?

Also, while looking at the EPDs is it better to be low or high? I assume 1% is better than 99%?

 

[wbvs58]

GAR have high carcase EPD's like marbling, REA. They can be hard doers just on grass. SAV tend to snub their nose at EPD's and will generally have lower marbling figures, not to say they don't eat well. They tend to go after thick, easy fleshing, feed efficient cattle. I've used semen from both and have been very happy. I often use one over a cow from the other. I like some Sitz bulls but don't know enough about that operation to generalise.

Ken

 

[Ebenezer]

Since none of the major operations linebreed, they have the range of choices. The range of choices leaves you grasping at straws. You need to study pedigrees to know what you are buying. If not you'll think that what is old is new and what is new is old from their talk. There are a lot of smoke and mirrors in promotion. At the end of the day, you'll have a lot more cows than you will bulls that will either make money or lose money. So my advise is to define your environment and planned management and find a source or two that has similar pluses and minuses. Then focus on the functional cow for you in spite of herd prefix.

And not trying to be a naysayer, but a majority of bought in genetics will never quite hit the mark. Some will fail, most will be so-so and I honestly believe that only 15% will be the herd builder type. If you get a good one, don't sell unless you have to. I saw an internet guru talking yesterday about the problem with old cows being 2 or 3 generations inferior. If a cow can make it to 12, 14 or more YO, produce a calf each year, not be a nut or have problems then you have just defined more than longevity in years or time. A cow like that defines proper joints, proper endocrine system, lack of flaws to cull her at an earlier age and not just "making time". To me she is a gem rather than junk. Any calf I can get may not wean as heavy but it had the opportunity to increase her functional traits into the future. And by that time I know what works the best in breeding her.

 

[Stickney94]

Hoover Dam is sire that does a lot of things well. Not extremes on EPDs, moderate size, good maternals, attractive animals, and from my experience very good end product merit.

It's wise not to generalize, but if you look at GAR marketing they are definitely looking at end product merit. Not as familiar with SAVs marketing, but I tend to think they market on function first and foremost.

Those are just two different ways to market. If you sell feeder cattle you may like SAVs genetics because they create attractive feeder cattle and you don't care how the animal grades. If you retain ownership and sell on the grid perhaps GAR genetics are appealing.

As Ebenezer says, you raise cattle long enough you will learn to appreciate a cow that stays healthy, raises good calves, and gets bred on time over and over.

 

[Stickney94]

Also, while looking at the EPDs is it better to be low or high? I assume 1% is better than 99%?

It depends. Top 1% for foot or angle scores has a different ramification than say Top 1% for $B. Both are "extremes" on one end of the spectrum. But do they fit your specific needs? Top 1% for a functional item like angle may be more widely useful than a high $B that indicates an animal that may sacrifice functional qualities in favor of terminal qualities (carcass/marbling/growth).

For example, BW EPD -- top 1% is nearly a Negative 4 lb birthweight. Is that better than the 70th percentile of +2? That's up to you as the cattleperson.

I have some mature cows that I plan to breed to a 95th percentile BW bull this breeding season. Is that a risk? Yes. But I'm willing to try it because the other qualities of that bull fit my marketing needs.

 

[jschoolcraft86]

Thank you for the explanation.

 

[greggy]

I was gonna say calves.....anyways, carry on....