That's how we do it for most of the paddocks. But some are just too far and lanes would block access to a bunch of other places that need work. An aerial map is real handy for figuring out where to put water and how to route the cows to and from it.Banjo":dlvnnjq1 said:
water troughs for rotating
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BC
Well-known member
You might want to watch this, it covers MIG and getting water to paddocks :
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G1NY2iw ... 221C3B5B6F
I went with some producers to a field day at this place back in the late 1990's.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G1NY2iw ... 221C3B5B6F
I went with some producers to a field day at this place back in the late 1990's.
artesianspringsfarm
Well-known member
Banjo":3tklt1lj said:
Just like almost anything, I'm not sure there is a "Best Way" that fits every scenario. I can say for us, we practice MIG with daily rotation7-8 months a year, and we use an always flowing line from an artesian well. We have over 2500' of black PVC laid out going to multiple pastures and daisy chained together with various floats and at the the end of the main stem is always a water tank that is constantly flowing and overflowing. We could certainly handle 100 head with our water flow and yes, we do know how blessed we are. That being said, I would think that even in the situation of a drilled well up here, doing something similar to our scenario is doable.
jedstivers
Well-known member
Underground pipe and tire tanks.Bigfoot":wnef5efz said:
Simple, easy, cheap, tough.
Will last a lifetime.
In the summertime here 80 cows can push 4,000 gallons a day.
Thanks for the feedback guys. I think for my place lanes to the pond will work best for the majority of my place. I can use a tank for some of the farther away areas I will graze. My co verb with using tanks is how high my water bill would run. I don't have a well. I've drawn it out and have to account for a lane to the water as well as giving them access to the west property line every day also for shade. I have morning shade on the east side and afternoon shade on the west. There is nothing at all to provide any in the pasture.
Ebenezer
Well-known member
Big deal is distance to trough and far reaches of the pasture. 800' is the breaking point if cows drink as individuals or drink as a herd. Exceptions are strip grazing where cows all eat at one time and larger %s go to the trough on the first few groups to the trough after a move. But not major. Shade needs to be away from troughs. Minerals need to be away from the trough and best to locate them in the most under utilized portion of the pasture. Drinking space is something to watch. I don't remember but about 24" to 30" per cow and volume is key if you have a lot of animals and a low yield well or system.
Lucky_P
Well-known member
What Ebenezer said....
If they ALL go to drink at once, you'd better have a really big tank or one that refills as fast as they can drink it.
Imagine yourself, in 100 degree weather, standing over a slowly refilling tank with a big stick, keeping the cows beat back so that it can refill enough that they drink and don't destroy it. Think you'd ever get thirsty enough to drink out of the cows' tank? No? Are you sure?
If they ALL go to drink at once, you'd better have a really big tank or one that refills as fast as they can drink it.
Imagine yourself, in 100 degree weather, standing over a slowly refilling tank with a big stick, keeping the cows beat back so that it can refill enough that they drink and don't destroy it. Think you'd ever get thirsty enough to drink out of the cows' tank? No? Are you sure?
talltimber
Well-known member
My neighbor has a lot of that black plastic pipe ran down through the field, fittings every so often (can never remember the name, but similar to fuel hose fittings, with the wings/levers), and drags his skid to the first position, uncouples pipe, couples in water tank. When it's time to move, uncouples tank, couples pipe back together, pulls tank (and mineral feeder, on same skid permanently mounted) to next position, repeat. I think when it gets cold he just turns them loose and they water at waterers. The black plastic stays out year round, so I'm told. I would assume he would drain it, but he might not. lol Idk how much UV that pipe can stand either. It's something I've thought about to reach a spot here that otherwise would require a lane with another fence if the creek didn't have water.
We have a couple thousand feet of black polypipe feeding a couple of distant water points. It's been out there just laying on the ground, sometimes with water in it sometimes not for 8-9 years. Never have any issues unless I don;t see it and have the brushhog blade to low.talltimber":3qleljub said:
M-5
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I would guess there were 5 miles of black poly pipe on my place at one time . the same 4" well I use now ran all of it. It was all layed on top ground , I still find it everywhere in pasture and woods that are 3/4 mile from well. It fed about 30 hog water troughs. Every pen had a trough and they had to be scooped out every day. It was used this way for 30 + years
It's almost a mile to the back of my place. I haven't fiddled with numbers, but we're talking some serious cash, not to mention labor to do that job. Labor, that at the moment I don't have time for.
My place was divided 5 ways last year. I've worked my tail off all winter, running 4 strand barbed wire to make more pastures. I don't think I'm going to be up to 9 fields by the true green up. I can't divide any further than that, with out water. These "lanes" running to ponds, with electric fence wire. I don't know if it's just my hard head, or the truth, but that's not going to work for me. I'll fool with an electric fence for about 90 days a year to keep my bulls where they belong. After that, I don't really want to mess with them. Now I could split fields with a solar charged wire. That may not be too bad. I can see the deer dragging it off every night though. So, I guess I'm limited by how much electric fence I'm willing to contend with.
I did kinda tamper with a spring. I fixed it to gravity flow to a tote, just to see how long it took to fill it. It was about 3 hours to move 270 gallons. I thought I might could just let it run, continuously filling 1 of 2 1000 gallon tanks. That all seems like a big PIA though, although it wouldn't be something I'd have to do all summer. Just something I'd do whale cattle are in a field with no pond.
My place was divided 5 ways last year. I've worked my tail off all winter, running 4 strand barbed wire to make more pastures. I don't think I'm going to be up to 9 fields by the true green up. I can't divide any further than that, with out water. These "lanes" running to ponds, with electric fence wire. I don't know if it's just my hard head, or the truth, but that's not going to work for me. I'll fool with an electric fence for about 90 days a year to keep my bulls where they belong. After that, I don't really want to mess with them. Now I could split fields with a solar charged wire. That may not be too bad. I can see the deer dragging it off every night though. So, I guess I'm limited by how much electric fence I'm willing to contend with.
I did kinda tamper with a spring. I fixed it to gravity flow to a tote, just to see how long it took to fill it. It was about 3 hours to move 270 gallons. I thought I might could just let it run, continuously filling 1 of 2 1000 gallon tanks. That all seems like a big PIA though, although it wouldn't be something I'd have to do all summer. Just something I'd do whale cattle are in a field with no pond.
Most of my fencing except for exterior fences is single strand high tensile fence about 30 to 32 inches high with a steel post and insulater about every 50 to 60 feet. All my lanes are fenced like this. At any point along the way I can make a temporary gate for cattle by going to one of the Tposts and raising it up and resting it on a 3 to 4 ft. pvc pipe notched on top, the pipe slips down over the Tpost...cattle go in and out under the wire. When its time to move on I put the wire back down in the insulator and take the pvc pipe off and go to another one.
We people talk of lanes...it can be more than just a 30' lane from one end to the other...the lane can encompass a pond, some woods....anything or place that is a common area.
I know it can be hard to wrap your mind around sometimes.
I only use polywire for my daily moves
We people talk of lanes...it can be more than just a 30' lane from one end to the other...the lane can encompass a pond, some woods....anything or place that is a common area.
I know it can be hard to wrap your mind around sometimes.
I only use polywire for my daily moves
aaroninga
Well-known member
Banjo":12wb4kut said:
I agree.....lanes so they can get to water. They learn and remember where it is just like they remember the taste of electric fence.
I rotate and am fortunate to always have woods access and a watering spot.
I carried water all winter, what a chore, but can water from my hose again after taking my neighbors bull back home.
Mine were drinking about 300 gallons a week.
It's odd that my herd of 8 will not come under wire 5 ft off the ground, not even for feed. I disconnect it pull it aside and here they come. In a way I guess it's good that they respect it that much incase my battery goes dead or I forget to turn it back on.
LRTX1
Well-known member
I bought a set of cows one time that must have been really broke to electric fence. I had a few fiberglass post running across a small lot that I didn't get around to pulling up. Wire was put away, only the posts about every 30 feet. Them cows wouldn't cross that line of posts to save their life.
We've had the same pronblem, even without the posts still being there. They would run down towards what had been the side of a lane and slam on the brakes and just mill around. Felt like an idiot having to push them along the no longer there fence to the old opening area and them running like mad up within the lines that had been the lane.LRTX1":fyz87rog said:
The first year I Started IRG I had a few cows that wouldn't go under the wire at first, one in particular wouldn't go under for a long time. Eventually they all got used to going under it. Now its old hat to em. Maybe moving them everyday got them used to it quicker, I don't know. They seem to be more herd oriented than they were under conventional grazing where they were more sprawled out.
One good thing about keeping my own heifers is they are already trained to electric. Occasionally, I get new bull that's never seen electric .....but it don't don't take him long to decide he wants to be where the cows are.
One good thing about keeping my own heifers is they are already trained to electric. Occasionally, I get new bull that's never seen electric .....but it don't don't take him long to decide he wants to be where the cows are.
machslammer
Well-known member
Make all of your paddocks accessible to the pond. .. they don't like cows using the pond but easier that way. .. make a circle around the pond with fencing and gates of some kind blocking each paddock. . Then just use those gates as your field transition gates and only leave the gate open to the field that the cows are currently in. .problem fixed and no carrying water
Lucky_P
Well-known member
After about 10 years of moving polywire fences, we finally got a pretty good idea of where semi-permanent division fences needed to be... cut the 100 or so acres of pasture up into ~5-acre paddocks.
Most have a big tractor/combine tire waterer in them - those few that don't, don't mainly 'cause I've not gotten around to installing 'em - and I just let 'em have two paddocks at a time(one with tank, one without), or there's a waterway with standing water in the middle of the paddock.
Probably well over a mile of 160psi black plastic waterline supplying the tire waterers, gravity-fed, from a deep (17ft, my neighbor says) upland pond... First 1300 ft or so, running downhill to the pastures, is 1.25", but necks down to 3/4 for the bulk of the runs to the tanks.
All on top of the ground, and I have no intention of burying it. Yes, it freezes in winter, and will occasionally blow apart at joints.
Bigfoot, have a look here: http://24.154.167.53:8888/owenlea/sub09.html
It's old... but still worth reading... for fellers like us that have to do it 'economically'.
FWO was big on them, but if somebody wants Hudson valves - let me know, pm me... I've got a bunch that I'll be glad to let go at a very reasonable price... they may work fine for well water... but too much trash coming out of my pond... kept the screens clogged up ALL the time.
Most have a big tractor/combine tire waterer in them - those few that don't, don't mainly 'cause I've not gotten around to installing 'em - and I just let 'em have two paddocks at a time(one with tank, one without), or there's a waterway with standing water in the middle of the paddock.
Probably well over a mile of 160psi black plastic waterline supplying the tire waterers, gravity-fed, from a deep (17ft, my neighbor says) upland pond... First 1300 ft or so, running downhill to the pastures, is 1.25", but necks down to 3/4 for the bulk of the runs to the tanks.
All on top of the ground, and I have no intention of burying it. Yes, it freezes in winter, and will occasionally blow apart at joints.
Bigfoot, have a look here: http://24.154.167.53:8888/owenlea/sub09.html
It's old... but still worth reading... for fellers like us that have to do it 'economically'.
FWO was big on them, but if somebody wants Hudson valves - let me know, pm me... I've got a bunch that I'll be glad to let go at a very reasonable price... they may work fine for well water... but too much trash coming out of my pond... kept the screens clogged up ALL the time.
jallen":1rjqnark said:
Now your talkin. The water bill won't be that bad if you do water them with city water.
More importantly ......why are you giving 16 hd plus calves an acre a day with daily moves? I've got one group of 70 cows that i'm only giving an acre a day now that the grass is comin on. I'm doing that acre with 2 to 3 daily moves.
At the very most I wouldn't give yours over a half acre a day and probably more like a 1/4 acre/day if you have decent grass.
I know the argument...... moving them around every 21 or 22 days will keep the grass vegetative and all that. Unless you plan on mowing it every week or two its going to head out.....regardless. That's the whole nature of a plant....to reproduce.....so why not let it?
Short rotations....3 to 4 weeks will work in the summer, if you don't mind feeding hay all winter. Short rotations will keep ur grass short and will almost assuredly make sure you have no grass this winter......assuming you have cool season grasses like fescue and orchardgrass or even ryegrass.
The major benefit to IRG is saving money buy not feeding as much hay in the winter.
Waterway65
Well-known member
Put your tank on a four wheel trailer chassis along with a smaller lower tank four calves. It will be easy to move so that cattle don't tromp the grass out.
