Time

[Clodhopper]

Margo, I'll be the one to go off subject here, feel free to berate me as you wish! I threw the insulting comment at you, and your response was much more dignified than my comment. That is an admirable quality. Hats off to you, sir!

 

[Margonme]

http://www.popsci.com/science/article/2012-09/book-excerpt-there-no-such-thing-time

bball. That is a good one.

 

[Margonme]

Margo, I'll be the one to go off subject here, feel free to berate me as you wish! I threw the insulting comment at you, and your response was much more dignified than my comment. That is an admirable quality. Hats off to you, sir!

Thank you. I thought you considered my comment too far off subject. That is why I took it to another thread. I don't think your comment was unreasonable.

My minor was Geology. The subject of time is fundamental to historical geology. Your opening comment illustrated how different humans view time relative to earth history.

I appreciate your response.

 

[lavacarancher]

In the post you referred to, I used the term "the end of time". I was not necessarily being literal with the term. I would tend to believe that time is infinite. However, it is hard to wrap a finite mind around infinite matters, and although I am fairly well educated and well read, I don't pretend to have even a fleeting grasp on some of the deeper subject matter. I don't have the time to research many interesting subjects enough to even make an educated guess on them, part of the downfall of having limited time here on this earth. I will say, however, nothing is more valuable than time, it is one thing that you cannot buy more of, at least not yet.

lavacarancher, I don't know what your issues are, but I wish you all the best.

No issues that I know of and thanks for your concern. Just sayin' one can't live forever and I'm on the downhill slope. Trying to be pragmatic about "time". I think this is the deepest subject that has ever been posted here and it's kinda funny that a bunch of farmers and ranchers are given a challenge like this when all I've ever done was contemplate my belly button. :lol:

 

[Bestoutwest]

I would say that the human being is the only animal to record, document and acknowledge TIME.
Also the only animal to recognize a deity or higher power.
Perhaps both are because the human being is the only animal that has to live with knowing, someday , without a doubt. It will die.

How do we know this, though? We can't communicate with animals. I can tell you that my cows know 'what time it is' because every day I feed at ~6AM and ~5:30PM. They are there standing and waiting for me every time. I know they don't know it's 6AM or 5:30PM but there's some sort of indication to them as to what time it is. Same with the cats. They are outside every day at the same time waiting for food. Last night we were watching TV and the dog started begging to go outside to play at the same time she does every night (which she has been doing before and since the summer solstice). I think we give humans a lot of intellectual credit and deny it to animals. Elephants have burial grounds. Dolphins hold their sick up to the surface to breath. Some animals abandon their sick because it benefits the herd. I could go on. I think as humans, we just tend to think we're so much smarter than animals, and I believe animals just don't care about the 99% of the CRAP that we care about.

And, I'm not trying to be argumentative here, just having a conversation.

 

[Bestoutwest]

One more thought: I have a 6 y/o. He has absolutely no concept of time. None. I have learned a lot from him on how much better life can be when you have no concept of time, nor care to have one. On other days it's frustrating, but some days it's absolutely wonderful.

Kids are great.

 

[Boots]

I agree that what goes on inside a animals head is pure speculation. Absolutely agree.
I also agree that animals have mental capacity that we don't give them credit for.
I think however that a dog eating at a certain time every day is simply conditioned to that.
Like a deer coming to the feeder, or fish feeding in the evening when the bait is on the surface. It's not a good example of recognition of time.
A good example of the human idea of time would be lavacaranchers post.
Can you imagine the freedom of not knowing that someday you will die?

 

[dun]

One more thought: I have a 6 y/o. He has absolutely no concept of time. None. I have learned a lot from him on how much better life can be when you have no concept of time, nor care to have one. On other days it's frustrating, but some days it's absolutely wonderful.

Kids are great.

I know adults that are the same way. If they show up within an hour of when they said they would I figure they're on time.

 

[Bestoutwest]

One more thought: I have a 6 y/o. He has absolutely no concept of time. None. I have learned a lot from him on how much better life can be when you have no concept of time, nor care to have one. On other days it's frustrating, but some days it's absolutely wonderful.

Kids are great.

I know adults that are the same way. If they show up within an hour of when they said they would I figure they're on time.

Yeah, it doesn't really work so well in the employment sector. And some people wonder why they're constantly looking for a job.

 

[dun]

One more thought: I have a 6 y/o. He has absolutely no concept of time. None. I have learned a lot from him on how much better life can be when you have no concept of time, nor care to have one. On other days it's frustrating, but some days it's absolutely wonderful.

Kids are great.

I know adults that are the same way. If they show up within an hour of when they said they would I figure they're on time.

Yeah, it doesn't really work so well in the employment sector. And some people wonder why they're constantly looking for a job.

Reminds me of the older fella that got a new job. He was always late. One day his boss asked him about what his previous employer had said when he came in late. The guy replied "Good Morning general"

 

[TexasBred]

And here I am still trying to figure how far is "up".

Vatican City is governed as an absolute monarchy with the pope at its head. The Vatican mints its own euros, prints its own stamps, issues passports and license plates, operates media outlets and has its own flag and anthem.

Actually this is not 100% factual. The Pope is elected but does not make all rules, laws, writings etc. of the entire Roman Catholic Church which consists of so much more than Vatican City.

 

[Bestoutwest]

I agree that what goes on inside a animals head is pure speculation. Absolutely agree.
I also agree that animals have mental capacity that we don't give them credit for.
I think however that a dog eating at a certain time every day is simply conditioned to that.
Like a deer coming to the feeder, or fish feeding in the evening when the bait is on the surface. It's not a good example of recognition of time.
A good example of the human idea of time would be lavacaranchers post.
Can you imagine the freedom of not knowing that someday you will die?

But how do we know that animals don't know that? We had a cat that we put down last year. I had had her since she was a kitten, and I know her personality like the back of my hand. When she was close to death, she laid down and seemed to accept her fate. Was it because she was too sick to move? Or was it that she had just decided it was time? I happen to think that animals are a lot more intelligent, intuitive and inquisitive than we give them credit for. However, that being said, I'm not advocating for becoming a vegan.

 

[Margonme]

And here I am still trying to figure how far is "up".

Vatican City is governed as an absolute monarchy with the pope at its head. The Vatican mints its own euros, prints its own stamps, issues passports and license plates, operates media outlets and has its own flag and anthem.

Actually this is not 100% factual. The Pope is elected but does not make all rules, laws, writings etc. of the entire Roman Catholic Church which consists of so much more than Vatican City.

Richard, that statement also applies to the Office of the President of the US. The point is that Catholicism has achieved the highest degree of political status of any religion.

 

[ropinranger]

Margo, can you first explain how scientists have proven the "big bang"? And, what are the odds, calculated "scientifically", that all of the worlds plants, animals, insects, etc., came from this "nothingness" that was created from the bb? Looks to me, with a few numbers punched into the old calculator, that if you factor a starting point dna "map", then multiply by the number of "living" things here; then multiply by the "odds" the dna somehow altered itself (which the odds on this vary, much like everything scientists theorize/pontificate about), you get a fairly small chance of this happening. Somewhere around the odds of finding one specific grain of sand in a swimming pool of sand on the first attempt, perhaps? Do you have that info?
The reason I ask, is because, like most things that scientists do, they make an "assumption", then they set out to prove it. You know, things like--is coffee bad for you? Well, scientists "proved" it was, and then, well, they "proved" it wasn't. Or, how about when environmental scientists "proved" how bad cows/ranchers/farmers were for the environment/soil/atmosphere - yes, they are all bad, oh, wait, it seems other scientists "proved" that cows/ranchers/farmers actually improve our environment. Finally, how about when scientists "agreed" on global warming, and then they crawfished and "agreed" on climate change? So, as you have probably surmised, I disagree with your premise on when time started, so I really can't answer your questions, as asked, from that starting point given for time.
So, I will, for now, give some musings I have on Time. Here is what I think...it goes by faster now than it did, for me, anyway. I don't know if that is because I am older now, and nearer to the end. Or, something else. I do believe where there is a beginning, there is an end. So, I do believe time, at least here on earth, will end some day. Also, it seems there is never enough time to give to those we love, when we should, or when they need it. And, sadly, we will surely regret those decisions not to "use" our valuable time with them later on, in time. :2cents:

 

[Margonme]

Ropinranger:
I could give you a book about an invisible man who was a Wizard. One day he waved his big arms and the Universe was created.

Then you say, "How do I know this?"

I say, "Faith".

Science don't work like that. Research work must be demonstrated. Until it can be duplicated and verified, it is a THEORY.

Beginning in the hallowed dawn of antiquity, mankind has sought for his own answers. Many find it easier to follow the book. Others like Aristotle and his breed, put their great minds to the task of explaining the natural wonders of the world. The body of knowledge although staggering is inept at providing answers to all man's wonders. Is that reason to whine, throw up your hands and live in a fantasy?

 

[TexasBred]

And here I am still trying to figure how far is "up".

Vatican City is governed as an absolute monarchy with the pope at its head. The Vatican mints its own euros, prints its own stamps, issues passports and license plates, operates media outlets and has its own flag and anthem.

Actually this is not 100% factual. The Pope is elected but does not make all rules, laws, writings etc. of the entire Roman Catholic Church which consists of so much more than Vatican City.

Richard, that statement also applies to the Office of the President of the US. The point is that Catholicism has achieved the highest degree of political status of any religion.

Ron there was a time when every "ruler" insisted on the church having this position in their kingdom. The Pope is primarily still a pastor. That being said for 2000 years the church has always had a heirachy. Jesus set it up that way.The only democratic vote recorded in scripture the people chose Barrabas over Jesus.

 

[Craig Miller]

Ropinranger:
I could give you a book about an invisible man who was a Wizard. One day he waved his big arms and the Universe was created.

Then you say, "How do I know this?"

I say, "Faith".

Science don't work like that. Research work must be demonstrated. Until it can be duplicated and verified, it is a THEORY.

Beginning in the hallowed dawn of antiquity, mankind has sought for his own answers. Many find it easier to follow the book. Others like Aristotle and his breed, put their great minds to the task of explaining the natural wonders of the world. The body of knowledge although staggering is inept at providing answers to all man's wonders. Is that reason to whine, throw up your hands and live in a fantasy?

The bang used to be taught as a theory and now it's taught as fact. Why is that? It seems to me we both believe in a theory that neither of us can prove so we are both living on faith.

 

[Margonme]

Ropinranger:
I could give you a book about an invisible man who was a Wizard. One day he waved his big arms and the Universe was created.

Then you say, "How do I know this?"

I say, "Faith".

Science don't work like that. Research work must be demonstrated. Until it can be duplicated and verified, it is a THEORY.

Beginning in the hallowed dawn of antiquity, mankind has sought for his own answers. Many find it easier to follow the book. Others like Aristotle and his breed, put their great minds to the task of explaining the natural wonders of the world. The body of knowledge although staggering is inept at providing answers to all man's wonders. Is that reason to whine, throw up your hands and live in a fantasy?

The bang used to be taught as a theory and now it's taught as fact. Why is that? It seems to me we both believe in a theory that neither of us can prove so we are both living on faith.

Not so Craig. Still a Theory. If someone is teaching it as a "law" then they are doing it outside the "scientific method". If you can find it referenced as a law like say gravity, then you found a fool.

 

[Rafter S]

Ropinranger:
I could give you a book about an invisible man who was a Wizard. One day he waved his big arms and the Universe was created.

Then you say, "How do I know this?"

I say, "Faith".

Science don't work like that. Research work must be demonstrated. Until it can be duplicated and verified, it is a THEORY.

Beginning in the hallowed dawn of antiquity, mankind has sought for his own answers. Many find it easier to follow the book. Others like Aristotle and his breed, put their great minds to the task of explaining the natural wonders of the world. The body of knowledge although staggering is inept at providing answers to all man's wonders. Is that reason to whine, throw up your hands and live in a fantasy?

Some of us are living in a fantasy. Others are not. It remains to be seen which group is correct.

 

[Margonme]

Ropinranger:
I could give you a book about an invisible man who was a Wizard. One day he waved his big arms and the Universe was created.

Then you say, "How do I know this?"

I say, "Faith".

Science don't work like that. Research work must be demonstrated. Until it can be duplicated and verified, it is a THEORY.

Beginning in the hallowed dawn of antiquity, mankind has sought for his own answers. Many find it easier to follow the book. Others like Aristotle and his breed, put their great minds to the task of explaining the natural wonders of the world. The body of knowledge although staggering is inept at providing answers to all man's wonders. Is that reason to whine, throw up your hands and live in a fantasy?

Some of us are living in a fantasy. Others are not. It remains to be seen which group is correct.

Some are living a fantasy. Others seek information and knowledge employing the best methods possible, SCIENCE.

We should not leave out a big crowd that don't care one way or the other.
:banana: