The United EPA of America

[Shanghai]

Worth reading
The EPA's green agenda, regulating everything and the proposed governing ALL WATERS is something to think about.

http://www.rangemagazine.com/features/s ... ed-epa.pdf

 

[RoanDurham]

I have mixed feelings about this. I see water as a common good and the capitalist mode of production doesn't do a very good job of efficiently allocating common-goods. There's a country in south America that just went through a similar tale-- all the water rights were privatized and a few obviously very wealthy people bought ALL the nations water supply. It was at their discretion who would receive water and how much they could receive. Or if any water would be extracted at all. Same with oil-- if you have oil on your property, most could care less if their neighbor has running water much less fuel. Surely you can see this same outcome is possible w/ water; individuals hoarding water to manipulate prices all while exploiting their neighbor of what should be the commons.

 

[John SD]

I saw Mark had posted this same link. I am too computer stupid to deal with pdf files. Can anyone translate the link or do a cut/paste?

 

[sim.-ang.king]

I have mixed feelings about this. I see water as a common good and the capitalist mode of production doesn't do a very good job of efficiently allocating common-goods. There's a country in south America that just went through a similar tale-- all the water rights were privatized and a few obviously very wealthy people bought ALL the nations water supply. It was at their discretion who would receive water and how much they could receive. Or if any water would be extracted at all. Same with oil-- if you have oil on your property, most could care less if their neighbor has running water much less fuel. Surely you can see this same outcome is possible w/ water; individuals hoarding water to manipulate prices all while exploiting their neighbor of what should be the commons.

Common Good, eh?
So pretty much take all property away from the citizen, even oil, and the rain that falls on their ground.
Hooray for communism!

 

[RoanDurham]

The sad state of affairs when the youth of our nation are unable to distinguish between a mixed economy, socialism, and communism.


Yes, a common good. With the general education level around here being so slow, I wouldn't expect many to be familiar with the tragedy of the commons but if you're interested in venturing outside your shell, take a few moments to familiarize yourself.

What your simpleton mind fails to take into consideration are the perils that follow privatizing the commons. When, because I'm wealthy and I can, I buy all the water rights around you, and because I don't like you -which I don't- I refuse to extend water service to you and your family, what are you going to do?

Privatizing the commons is extremely lucrative for a few. The question is, if you're concerned with the progression of the US that is, what is in the best interest of the American people. Is clean, safe, easily-accessible, inexpensive drinking water in the best interest for us all? or is inflated prices due to artificially reducing the quantity supplied in the best interest of the American people?

Resources in the US have always been abundant. Step outside your bubble and examine the negative repercussions and the exploitation of the people that is going on in other countries. Water scarcity is no joke-- and preserving it-- efficiently allocating-- has nothing to do w/ communism.

 

[novatech]

When you give someone the power to control they will control. Never mind who it hurts or helps. They get little stars next to their name for screwing things up.
The EPA will have the power to control what you plant, where you plant. Can all of us afford to loose a stock tank or even put one in? Can we afford to regrade our pasture to control runoff to whatever specs. they come up with?
If you don't believe it, just look what has happened since 2008.

 

[CottageFarm]

The sad state of affairs when the youth of our nation are unable to distinguish between a mixed economy, socialism, and communism.


Yes, a common good. With the general education level around here being so slow, I wouldn't expect many to be familiar with the battle of the commons but if you're interested in venturing outside your shell, take a few moments to familiarize yourself.

What your simpleton mind fails to take into consideration are the perils that follow privatizing the commons. When, because I'm wealthy and I can, I buy all the water rights around you, and because I don't like you -which I don't- I refuse to extend water service to you and your family, what are you going to do?

Privatizing the commons is extremely lucrative for a few. The question is, if you're concerned with the progression of the US that is, what is in the best interest of the American people. Is clean, safe, easily-accessible, inexpensive drinking water in the best interest for us all? or is inflated prices due to artificially reducing the quantity supplied in the best interest of the American people?

Resources in the US have always been abundant. Step outside your bubble and examine the negative repercussions and the exploitation of the people that is going on in other countries. Water scarcity is no joke-- and preserving it-- efficiently allocating it more efficiently-- has nothing to do w/ communism.

Good lord, talk about simpleton thinking....if that's what your MBA taught you, you was robbed :roll:
Really, I'd seek a refund based on the breach of an implied contract.

Here's a newsflash for you that won't be included in those progressive talking points you seem to use for reference material.
The EPA, nor any other branch of the gov't, has done absolutely nothing to ensure the security of the nations water resources. To the contrary, they have gone out of their way to squander those resources at every opportunity. They have shown time after time they are more concerned with birds, slugs, tortoises, useless fish, and urban lawns than anything of real importance.

Why you feel the Fed gov't should have primacy over the states in dictating the use of their own resources in absolutely incomprehensible.

 

[RoanDurham]

Everybody, I have alot of things to discuss, mainly commies! Them no good swindlers. Them and their wide nose breathin up all the white man's air. Makes me sick! America's at war with Al-Canada! But we're still losing the war at home against AAAAAALLLLLLL... SHARPTON! Now, lemme tell ya somthin, If I had the money, I'd buy up all them there water rights around your place and make a point just to exclude you from consuming it. Why? because this is 'merica and In 'merica we can do biznas with who we want and we don't need no govt tellin me who I can or cannot discriminate against. Listen here nagger, I worked for that money, its mine, if I want to exploit you and charge you $20/ gallon for water then that's my constitutional right. God said so. It's right there in Genesis. And once I gouge the folks in southern IL to death with water prices, I'm gonna expand my here operation throughout the state and country till I own all the water. White power! This is capitalism son- what they there you say is good for the nation is all good and jolly and but this here, this gouging yiou folks for water is capitalism and I'll take what I can. You hear me, nagger. God said so. 'Merica.




Let's talk about Chinese people! With their kung-fu and their silly ching-chang-chong talk! We can't understand you! Go back to yer country! White power

 

[CottageFarm]

Well, that was.... interesting. I hope you feel better now that you've gotten that off your chest.

Ummm....of course.... you still have not addressed why YOU feel the fed gov't should have primacy over the states regarding their own water resources. And why should anyone else want that, when the fed gov't has shown that they will give priority to the habitat of a migratory bird over that someone who grows food.

 

[Red Bull Breeder]

Massey just about the time you make me think you are smarter than than the village idiot you prove me wrong.

 

[RoanDurham]

Well, that was.... interesting. I hope you feel better now that you've gotten that off your chest.

Ummm....of course.... you still have not addressed why YOU feel the fed gov't should have primacy over the states regarding their own water resources. And why should anyone else want that, when the fed gov't has shown that they will give priority to the habitat of a migratory bird over that someone who grows food.

I don't recognize state's rights. I'm an American. I pledge allegiance to the United States of America; not Texas. It's not the 'state's resources'-- they are collectively the resources of the American people. We can obtain food nearly anywhere. Once wildlife is extinct, there is no going back. I find it ironic that topics such as sustainability, preservation, and conservation seem to be such foreign concepts amongst rural-residing residents. An objective outsider would think those individuals would be at the forefront of the issues-

 

[Shanghai]

I think for the most part everyone has their heart in the right place, not all mind you, but a common sense seems to be lacking.
It's one extreme or the other.
A middle of the road agreement that would solve the problem doesn't appear to be a choice

 

[Shanghai]

CottageFarm
The EPA, nor any other branch of the gov't, has done absolutely nothing to ensure the security of the nations water resources. To the contrary, they have gone out of their way to squander those resources at every opportunity. They have shown time after time they are more concerned with birds, slugs, tortoises, useless fish, and urban lawns than anything of real importance. Why you feel the Fed gov't should have primacy over the states in dictating the use of their own resources in absolutely incomprehensible.

Until people get hungry that's going to be the MO

 

[CottageFarm]

So, just for the sake of clarity, you do not recognize nor accept the constitution of the country to which you pledge your allegiance?
That too is very interesting....
Sooo...just out of curiosity why do you consider yourself an American if you reject the constitution and that we are a republic.
That you don't recognize the rights of the states, does not make them go away.

 

[Red Bull Breeder]

The EPA is not doing this for the good of the people, its for control of the people.

 

[RoanDurham]

The EPA is not doing this for the good of the people, its for control of the people.

The EPA 'is' the people.

 

[RoanDurham]

So, just for the sake of clarity, you do not recognize nor accept the constitution of the country to which you pledge your allegiance?
That too is very interesting....
Sooo...just out of curiosity why do you consider yourself an American if you reject the constitution and that we are a republic.
That you don't recognize the rights of the states, does not make them go away.

What's that in Article 6 about 'supreme law' ? and who is, again, that's 'bound' thereby? I think it even goes on to say any law that conflicts w/ supreme law... wait for it... wait...... is notwithstanding :banana:

 

[novatech]

I don't recognize state's rights. I'm an American. I pledge allegiance to the United States of America; not Texas. It's not the 'state's resources'-- they are collectively the resources of the American people. We can obtain food nearly anywhere. Once wildlife is extinct, there is no going back. I find it ironic that topics such as sustainability, preservation, and conservation seem to be such foreign concepts amongst rural-residing residents. An objective outsider would think those individuals would be at the forefront of the issues-

So you give the US government total control of your water and I promise you they will tax you into poverty so they can buy more votes. By the way, the water in Texas is not controlled by the state. In our county we voted against water control and we do not have it. Other counties voted for the control. Capitalism made this country what it is today. Even with it's faults there has not been a better system found.

 

[TerraceRidge]

Well, that was.... interesting. I hope you feel better now that you've gotten that off your chest.

Ummm....of course.... you still have not addressed why YOU feel the fed gov't should have primacy over the states regarding their own water resources. And why should anyone else want that, when the fed gov't has shown that they will give priority to the habitat of a migratory bird over that someone who grows food.

I don't recognize state's rights. I'm an American. I pledge allegiance to the United States of America; not Texas. It's not the 'state's resources'-- they are collectively the resources of the American people. We can obtain food nearly anywhere. Once wildlife is extinct, there is no going back. I find it ironic that topics such as sustainability, preservation, and conservation seem to be such foreign concepts amongst rural-residing residents. An objective outsider would think those individuals would be at the forefront of the issues-

"The powers not delegated to the United States by the Constitution, nor prohibited by it to the States, are reserved to the States respectively, or to the people." - The Tenth Amendment to the United States Constitution

 

[TennesseeTuxedo]

Well, that was.... interesting. I hope you feel better now that you've gotten that off your chest.

Ummm....of course.... you still have not addressed why YOU feel the fed gov't should have primacy over the states regarding their own water resources. And why should anyone else want that, when the fed gov't has shown that they will give priority to the habitat of a migratory bird over that someone who grows food.

I don't recognize state's rights. I'm an American. I pledge allegiance to the United States of America; not Texas. It's not the 'state's resources'-- they are collectively the resources of the American people. We can obtain food nearly anywhere. Once wildlife is extinct, there is no going back. I find it ironic that topics such as sustainability, preservation, and conservation seem to be such foreign concepts amongst rural-residing residents. An objective outsider would think those individuals would be at the forefront of the issues-

"The powers not delegated to the United States by the Constitution, nor prohibited by it to the States, are reserved to the States respectively, or to the people." - The Tenth Amendment to the United States Constitution

A fact that is too often overlooked by our benevolent federal government.