something to ponder

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rockridgecattle

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I read a few posts tonight and now I am having a soap box moment.

So rather than get all flustered and write something that did not make sense, I took a shower to warm up cause it's cold outside and I got real wet and frozen. In the shower, I tried to work out what I wanted to say. It came out so eloquent. Now, I can not remember how I worded it. So I will try not to offend anyone or make what I have to say clear as mud.
As a cattle farmer or rancher we have some responsibilities to bear, such as feeding, mineral supplement and animal husbandry. One of the other responsibilities is doing things we do not like to do. For example, getting a calf to suck, assisting in problem birthing, treating foot rot, pneumonia, and anything else that comes up.
Along with this responsibility comes the need to have safe facilities to do these things. We need to keep in mind the safety for the animals, but most importantly safety for us the owners of these beasts. The facilities do not need to be expensive, or elaborate. But they need to keep us safe so we can do our job. 1000# to 2000# animal can cause a lot of damage if not restrained properly.
Here is yet another bee keeping analogy. We know a commercial beekeeper who is also a honey broker. He defines hobby and commercial beeks this way. Not by the number of hives, but by how they work with their bees.
A hobbyist will only work with their bees in the sunshine. It will not matter if there is a time crunch or not, they will only work with the sun shining.
A commercial keeper will work sun or cloud. If the timing is crucial, and it is cloudy, the job will get done.
Maybe the same can be applied to hobbyist and cattle ranchers. It's not numbers that define what we are but how we handle our cattle and keep ourselves safe.
A cattle rancher/farmer could be defined as one who is prepared for most eventualities. They have some sort of facilities to work with animals when the need arises, doing what it takes to keep the animals healthy. Note that I did not say expensive or elaborate, just something to keep us safe and get the job done
A hobbyist is a farmer who figures everything will be a bed of roses. No trouble will occur and all we need to do is feed them, they will give us a calf and all will be well.

If we are unwilling to do what needs to be done because we do not have the facilities to restrain a dangerous animal, maybe we need to look at goats.
And so ends the soap box moment!

RR
 
Good post, Rockridge, and I think you're dead on! The only thing I would argue with is that goats need proper facilities as well. I learned this little lesson while attempting to assist Priscilla the Hun deliver triplets - the first kid being breech. She kicked, she bunted, she bit, she stomped around bellowing fire and brimstone, and was completely uncooperative! I would have killed for a headgate, and a chute at that particular moment - as it was, I had to resort to calling for help, and holding her (my assistant was not able to perform that particular function), while my assistant corrected the problem and delivered 3 beautiful kids. Never underestimate the need for facilities - regardless of the species you're dealing with! ;-)
 
Just another perspective.
A pro knows how to handle the cattle regardless of the facilities, and is responsible. A hobbiest thinks he has to have everything to be a pro., and is not responsible.
 
your right everyone needs good working pens.my dad always worked cattle with what he had.if we had to pull a prob calf.we would put the cow in the dairy an pull it.been kicked stomped an bounced off the barn wall doing it.as well as ran over a few times.then i got made an put in a 32 by 32 steel corral.an that sure helps when we have a prob.but i always like pulling calves in the pasture.thats alot easier less you have a major prob.
 
novatech":3moypdmv said:
Just another perspective.
A pro knows how to handle the cattle regardless of the facilities, and is responsible. A hobbiest thinks he has to have everything to be a pro., and is not responsible.
Well said novatech.
I have said before and will say again, many a time real cowmen have had elaborate facilities called a rope. You do what you got to do with what you got.
 
Ryder":2z86om7s said:
novatech":2z86om7s said:
Just another perspective.
A pro knows how to handle the cattle regardless of the facilities, and is responsible. A hobbiest thinks he has to have everything to be a pro., and is not responsible.
Well said novatech.
I have said before and will say again, many a time real cowmen have had elaborate facilities called a rope. You do what you got to do with what you got.

Good posts.
 
Wewild":2lx9dxd4 said:
Ryder":2lx9dxd4 said:
novatech":2lx9dxd4 said:
Just another perspective.
A pro knows how to handle the cattle regardless of the facilities, and is responsible. A hobbiest thinks he has to have everything to be a pro., and is not responsible.
Well said novatech.
I have said before and will say again, many a time real cowmen have had elaborate facilities called a rope. You do what you got to do with what you got.

Good posts.

Yes you have to use what you have. but safety comes first. Now adays alot of the wives are working with the cattle. Gotta say i would not be so willing to stick my hand up the backside of a cow not squeezed to save a calf. I would be even less impressed on trying to get a stuborn calf to suck and get kicked in the head or hand or arm. I'm not saying a bells and whistles system but something where your are safe, your wife is safe, your kids are safe when handling cows. As well, something in which you are comfortable assisting a cow or bull when duty calls for it to be done.
 
rockridgecattle":1zdwvf54 said:
Yes you have to use what you have. but safety comes first. Now adays alot of the wives are working with the cattle. Gotta say i would not be so willing to stick my hand up the backside of a cow not squeezed to save a calf. I would be even less impressed on trying to get a stuborn calf to suck and get kicked in the head or hand or arm. I'm not saying a bells and whistles system but something where your are safe, your wife is safe, your kids are safe when handling cows. As well, something in which you are comfortable assisting a cow or bull when duty calls for it to be done.

My wife and girls don't help me work cattle. I never was taught to let women and girls around that sort of thing. There definitly ain't any worring that may take my mind off the job and get me hurt. i'm not saying its wrong if you do.
 
I've seen the term "hobbyist" used on here a lot and it always seems to be used in a negative way. I might be opening up a can of worms, but I'd be curious to know how folks on here define a hobbyist.
 
skyline":34qzz3zk said:
I've seen the term "hobbyist" used on here a lot and it always seems to be used in a negative way. I might be opening up a can of worms, but I'd be curious to know how folks on here define a hobbyist.

Hobbyist can afford cattle for entertainment and enjoyment. A "real" rancher needs to make money off his cattle. I think a lot of "real" ranchers are just jealous of hobbyists and so hold them in a bit of contempt. Of course there is also the feeling of superiority of folks with lots of knowlege and experience over beginners.
 
skyline":2s99wkll said:
I've seen the term "hobbyist" used on here a lot and it always seems to be used in a negative way. I might be opening up a can of worms, but I'd be curious to know how folks on here define a hobbyist.

I see a hobbyist as someone who sees cows in a paddock (sp) pasture and the cows are either grazing or resting as the hobbyist figures that looks easy enough i can do that. And does. But he/she does not see the work that goes on behind the scenes to get the animal to that stage.
I also see a hobbyist as a person who thinks that cows are real pets, or entertainment. If they have a calf and need help, "well she lets me scratch her anytime so she won't mind me assisting with no protection".
a rancher, no matter if they have 1 or 1000 cows knows that the behind the scenes work is just as if not more important than ideal picture of a cow out on pasture. No matter what they know the job needs to get done, and even if they are afraid to do it, get someone who knows how to help, or does it him/herself.

I don't see the definition of hobbyist or rancher defined by numbers.
 
Glad to have a set of definitions to understand the hobbist handle....after getting the gals though the chute for some routine maintenance, the pens have six inches of mud in them and a few of the cows were just being plain unconsiderate for all the good I was doing. I am seriously considering going to a small feeder operation, just enough to feed the family and supply a few dozen of our best customers and then take it easy for awhile.
We'll see how the hay prices are this year and work the numbers over very carefully to see if all the aggervation is worth it....of course I would like to rebreed our new bull to some select cows as his calves are real sweet and I want to see how they turn out the second time around....retirement will probably be delayed again.
Anyway, becomming a well equipped hobbist with good facilities and a few head is looking better with each winter.
And that's my two bits worth...asked for or not....DMc
 
The hobby farmer of ranchermaybe has the money to buy all the fancy stuff, but probaly not all of them. Around her we have some newcomers once in while that really blow and go for a while and then they figure out it was more work than they really wanted to do.Then we have people that grew up on a farm and just want a few cows to mess with. They know what they are doing and just do because they like it. Then you got the ones that get a litle peice of land and are going to be cattle breeders , they no all there is to no and what ever breed they choose to buy is the only breed alive. You can,t tell them any thing, until they get in trouble.And then some off them still want listen. The other one are the ones that want some animals just happens to be cows some times but they truly do want to treat there animals the best they just don't no how, but are willing to learn.
 
There are also professionals that I tend to call very bad managers, and fairly knew hobbiest that are doing a great job. I have both types of them close to my ranch. So much for who is the responsible one.

The pro has 150 head at a pasture up the road and rarely checks em or feeds em. He has cattle spread all over the County and is well known. The cattle near me are allways starving, and there is a great # of round bales over there. The grass is dormant all winter as it is Bermuda. :mad: :mad:

The other guy has 50 head and does a great job. I even AI some of his cows. He claims he is a hobby farmer. :)
 
hold it guys lolol.the real rancher wont spend his money on caorrals squeeze chutes an the like because he is to tight.where as the newcomer hears you gotta have nice pens squeeze chutes an fancy trucks an trailers.i was always taught to make do with what you have.an wont spend the money less i really have to have something.
 
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