something to ponder

[skyline]

gerard what I was talking about was that miserable 1% that makes all of us look bad.
I was NOT lumping you in that 1%. If you raise and care for your animals well and even better then the guys who have alot of animals then good for you. Be proud of what you do even if it is a hobby for you.
Ok to address the tension. When you meet someone and tell them that you raise cattle you are now representing the entire cattle industry. Now if these people, who do not know anything about raising cattle, come to your place to visit and see well fed cattle and a great place they "see" the cattle industry. Now if theses same people visit another persons place where the cattle have no grass are thin and look terrible then they "see" the cattle industry.
We are all lumped together no matter how we differ in the care of our animals.


Now onto the working facilities.
It is always good to have facilities that work for you and you can afford. Not alot of us can afford a brand new $6000.00 hydraulic sqeeze chute, but can buy a used head catch and make it work on an older squeeze.

Excellent post that I agree with. I'd like to see us all represent the cattle industry in a positive light. When we come across someone who doesn't, whether they be newbies, hobbyist, full-timers, part-timers, professionals, ranchers, farmers, large scale operators, small scale operators, or whatever tag someone wants to hang on them, then let's work together to educate them and encourage them to do right.

 

[TexasBred]

That miserable 1% wouldn't even qualify for the title of hobbiest. Even a "hobbiest" is passionate about his hobby. These folks are usually just pricks that happen to have a few cattle making their own way on their property.

 

[dieselbeef]

hobbyist is one who didnt inherit enuff land to make enought to live offa his cattle

 

[Phil in Tupelo]

I wish there was an easy answer but there is not.

Another side to this is what are two important factors in our operations? The government and the consumer! The government can mess us over with rules and regulations that make no sense and only cost money and doesn't make a positive contribution. However once in a blue moon they do soemthing that turns out to be positive. The consumer is the final word. She or he is the one who pays for our product!

In many ways the government and the consumer lump all cattlemen/women in the same group.

Now this is where it gets tough.

If I have 25 cows in MS, another has 25 in FL, another 25 in NY, another in MO, another in TX, another in AZ, another in CA or in any of the other 50 states, the government and the consumer looks at us all in the same way. But in reality all of us are doing our own thing and though these operations all have 25 cows, they are likely so different (at least in the eyes of individual cowmen/women) some would say these operations are as far apart as the East to the West or daylight vs dark. So it is so hard to define something that has the same product, beef, yet is so different as to how it gets to the point of putting beef on the consumers table.

So, try if you wish to define hobbist vs professional cattlemen/women, when I am unsure if there is a true definition of cattleman/woman when all of us seem to have very different operations.

 

[dieselbeef]

why does it matter? were all dealin with a bovine animal are we not...big or small only matters at braggin time..benchracing stuff

 

[KSJerseys]

So many of you have said such good things. In my opinion, however, I must agree with hippierancher and others previous to him with similar points of view. By definition a "hobby" is a spare-time or recreational pursuit (see Wikipedia on-line). Perhaps there should be another definition. The reason I say this is that I am currently learning what I can in order to provide a safe and happy home for a few head of cattle. I would be considered a "hobbyist" according to what I have previously read. However, I have horses and have raised a few previously, and I love them. Because I only have a few, does not mean I do not care for them as much as anyone else who has many or anyone else who makes a living from them. I provide food and shelter, plus as much roaming and grazing room as possible and even move them to alternate pasture when their own is grazed over. I would not hesitate to call upon an expert (either a veterinarian or a neighbor ranchor) if necessary. Why? Not because I make anything from the horses, but because I care about their health and comfort. Can we say there might be a need for a different definition other than commercial or hobbyist? I will tend my cattle come rain or shine, just as I do my horses, and just as you full-time ranchers will do, if needed. Yet I will probably not tend them full time. But if it necessary, I would. Nevertheless, I do make their health and happiness a priority! And I joined this website so that I might get information and assistance that makes it possible for me to keep my livestock healthy. I make all my animals into pets. Please don't define "hobbyist" by the size of the herd. If there is a definition for someone who wants only a small number of animals to provide for themselves or close family and friends, please understand that we don't consider it a hobby. We are devoted to our animals no matter how much time it may take. We are willing to provide as much time and effort as may be required, even though we are not doing this to earn our living. We don't consider it less important for the animals. I'm not very good at expressing myself, but I hope this makes sense. What I'm saying is: you all have valid points; let's please come together to help each other. I hope I didn't misunderstand the whole discussion; this is my opinion. --Heidi

 

[alftn]

I was a hobby farmer 15 years ago when I had six cows, I am still a hobby farmer today with 40 head.. I guess I could have a 100 head if I wanted.. My work has allow a poor country boy to buy land, land makes me a grass farmer, cows cut my grass. I make a profit, and I eat well.I love my cows , I am proud to be a Hobby farmer, I do it for love, not because I have to. If I had to make money and feed my family off the farm that would be stress full , glad I do not have the presser...

 

[TexasBred]

As I said earlier....Hobbiest are "passionate" about what they do. :clap: :clap: :clap:

 

[hrbelgians]

gerard what I was talking about was that miserable 1% that makes all of us look bad.
I was NOT lumping you in that 1%. If you raise and care for your animals well and even better then the guys who have alot of animals then good for you. Be proud of what you do even if it is a hobby for you.
Ok to address the tension. When you meet someone and tell them that you raise cattle you are now representing the entire cattle industry. Now if these people, who do not know anything about raising cattle, come to your place to visit and see well fed cattle and a great place they "see" the cattle industry. Now if theses same people visit another persons place where the cattle have no grass are thin and look terrible then they "see" the cattle industry.
We are all lumped together no matter how we differ in the care of our animals.


Now onto the working facilities.
It is always good to have facilities that work for you and you can afford. Not alot of us can afford a brand new $6000.00 hydraulic sqeeze chute, but can buy a used head catch and make it work on an older squeeze.

Excellent post that I agree with. I'd like to see us all represent the cattle industry in a positive light. When we come across someone who doesn't, whether they be newbies, hobbyist, full-timers, part-timers, professionals, ranchers, farmers, large scale operators, small scale operators, or whatever tag someone wants to hang on them, then let's work together to educate them and encourage them to do right.

I really like these two posts!! Good job guys!
If I may comment on your post Skyline. I have been on both sides of the fence, newbie,hobbiest, greenhorn or whatever you will call it. At that time it seems, the more experienced people don't talk to you or just criticize you? Why is that? I think it is because the little things seem so natural that the seasoned gets a bad opinion of the new person. Been there and could feel it! Well, I still can't judge these people as snobs. I need to do my part and put my best foot forward and everything will progress!
Where I always made my biggest mistake was thinking, just watch me guru i'm coming through, I can do it like this or like that and I don't have to do it like you say. Well, that still did not make me a hobbiest, but rather an arrogant little dude that will need some seasoning! Don't worry I got some!

There is no better teacher than a bad mistake on my part, wow, now I can remember that!

Now on the other side and have even caught myself here. A newbie comes and askes for advice. Now in fact the silly questions he is asking tells me he is numb to what is really going on. So now it is my responsibility to step back in time and look at things in his perspective!
I have done this personally with a few horse people, and you know, today those guys are my best friend and my toughest competition I face on a regular basis!!

I guess my point in this is, I don't look at these people as hobbiest or gurus, but rather fellow horse people, Doing what needs to be done in the horse world in order to survive! And we all learned a few things in the process! What more do we want?

Isn't the rest just name calling and trying to justify ourselves in whatever position we would like to think we or they are?

Isn't it about as simple as this?
Does a horse push a wagon or does he pull a wagon? Well I can argue both ways. He pushes against his collar so he pushes. Alright the traces run behind him and the wagon is back there so he pulls!
Big flippin deal, he is still a HORSE! But it was sure fun to argue because I think I won!!!
Likewise, we are all cattlemen or women I hope!

Absolutely no punch intended towards anyone on here, but rather a few out of the box thoughts!