selling cull cows...question

[milkmaid]

Not really sure where this post belongs. Anyway, I'm wondering what cull cows get docked for and what each flaw might cost per cwt.

For instance, I have a holstein cow that is cull material, whenever I decide to send her to the auction. She isn't completely slicked off, she's still pretty thin (BC of 2 on a 1-5 scale?), small udder (no problems there), and I call her "Knock Knees" for good reason. But with that conformation flaw her hooves obviously don't grow right and she's starting to go lame in the front end, just a little bit. I didn't want to spend the $8 to have her hooves trimmed last month and I'm regretting it, as I think that's the reason she's going lame. I'd like to hang onto her through the first of August as she's raising 3 calves at the moment, but they are big enough to wean so I guess I could ship her at any time, really.

I think she's about 1300lbs but has the frame to easily be 1450-1500lbs, if she were carrying that extra weight. FWIW, I've had her for about 70 days and I don't think she's going to put it on.

How many cents per pound would it cost me if she were running through the ring, lame? It's not that noticable right now, but it might be in another 2-3 weeks.

How about that knock-kneed conformation? will she get docked for that?

And how much less would I get for her not being slicked off versus being slicked off? (could always take a good brush to her, I suppose, LOL.)

Would it be more profitable to sell her now (where she's basically sound), or to wait another 3 weeks (when she might be very lame) and see if she won't look a little better (and get the benefit of more pounds on the calves)? Think I only need ~.21/lb to break even on her.

Comments?

 

[Running Arrow Bill]

Know nothing about Holsteins, except they are black & white and milk cows...lol.

Otherwise, in Texas, "canner/cutter" cows are selling between about .35 and .50 cents a pound at sale barns.

Don't know if this info helps any or not...

 

[Cowboy 2.0]

We sold 10 old cows the other day and averaged $.37 a pound on them.

 

[Farminlund]

It seems that cull cows get knocked most for obvious issues that effect cutability & risk of transport. Having said that - a lame cow is usually docked considerably. The other issues should not have much effect as far as I know.

If you really beleive she will go lame shortly, I say sell now, especially since she will not improve from a body score perspective. But the lost pounds on the calve will have to be factored in - my guess is that you'll loose ~.10/# between a lame & a non lame cull. I am sure that there are more knowledgable folk out there that would give a more informative input - but that's my 2 cents for what it's worth.

 

[susie]

Milkmaid,
Why don't you spend the 8$ for her hoof trimming, keep her another month or however long it is before her hooves grow out and then ship her? Then she won't limp, have given you more growth off the calves, and had a little more time to get some weight on.
Or ship her now and be done with it, but don't wait.
That's my newbie opinion, FWIW,
Take care,
Susie

 

[Farminlund]

I assumed that the cost for hoof trimming was based on doing a fairly large number of cows (ie $8 for 1 of like 10/15 or more). If you could get her trimmed for $8, prevent the lamemess, & grow the calves that seems like a no-brainer. I have never priced hoof trimming but if it cost like $8 to do just a few - I might give a try as there a a few in the herd with some additional growth that could use a bit of trimming.

 

[Texas PaPaw]

MM

Packer cows buyers must estimate grade (canner/cutter/utility) & yield (dressing %) as they are given a maximum dressed wt price based for each grade. What they consider is the estimated grade, dressing % & if the animal will make the haul to the buying plant. Obviously, buyers for the packers located farther away will be less likely to bid on a lame or weak animal or if they do bid it will be less. As a cow gets thinner her dressing % & grade (and value) both go down.

IMO-as it is only 2 weeks to August 1, I would ship her now as she will probably lose some bcs & possibly show lameness in a few more weeks. To me there is a lot more downside risk from keeping her than there is upside potential from growing the calves bigger. Also, this is the time of the year that cow beef prices are pressured by increasing cow slaughter due to drought. BTW-there is plenty of drought in the major cow states. Just my 2 cents worth.

Good luck & happy trails.

Brock

 

[milkmaid]

Farminlund -- if I'd lose $10/cwt as a lame cow then I'd be best off shipping her immediately. Anyone else have any comments on that figure?

Brock -- would some pictures help for comparison?

The cow in question is this cow...

It's not a recent picture of her but she's still in very similar body condition - thin. See the spot on her flank where she's been shaved for LDA surgery? everywhere else she has a long coat that's not slicked off. All the manure's come off her since she's been on pasture.

In view of the fact that a cow in similar or slightly better body condition than this one...

...who is NOT a cull cow, BTW! brought $41.5/cwt about two weeks ago, how would you estimate KK would sell? Will she bring me the $21/cwt that I need to break even?

I can get a new picture in the morning of KK, too, if that'd help.

 

[milkmaid]

About the hoof trimming -- I don't recall exact figures as boss handles that and my herd usually gets trimmed at the same time as his -- but I believe it's 10 or more cows and it's $8/hd for trimming. That's standard for the folks around here. $7-8/hd and usually do about 10-12 minutes per cow. I had the fellow out to do 4 cows a few months back (and he's coming 45 minutes) and he charged me $50. Not bad.

But for ONE cow...not worth it to me. I was just busy that day the hoof trimmer was out at the dairy and didn't have KK trimmed, and I'm not going to call him out now for one cull cow.

 

[Texas PaPaw]

MM

The LDA surgery scar could spook the buyers a little. Probably should tell the auctioneer her story. Assuming it has been a few months since the surgery that should ease the buyers fears. Ask the auctioneer or sale barn owner for their opinion regarding her story. They know the buyers and should advise you appropriately as it is also in their best interest to maximize her value. Would think she should bring $25.00 to $34.00 if she acts OK in the sale ring. Down here most any cow will bring over $25.00 unless very thin, weak or cancer eye. She doesn't appear to be that old, which should be in your favor.

As we are rapidly approaching fall, which is usually the lowest price season for all classes of cattle, you should be able to sell her now and replace her a few months later in the fall with an equal or better cow for the same money. This is a prime time to use the seasonal price cycle to your advantage.

Good luck & happy trails.

Brock

 

[milkmaid]

She's only a four year old cow, so you're right, not that old. Surgery scar is going away and the scar itself actually isn't as noticable as the fact that she's been shaved in that area. :roll:

I'm headed to college this fall and selling off part of the herd, mostly keeping back calves, yearlings, and perhaps one nurse cow. Maybe. So I'm not planning to replace KK anytime soon -- she was just a gamble and one of those "raise a couple calves and hope I can break even on you" cows; I picked her up for free.

Maybe I'll bring her in and take a hose and soap to her and see if I can't get more of that dead hair out and get her looking better. (Don't laugh. ) There's a sale Wednesday and I think between boss and I we can get a full load of cull cows; just isn't quite worth it to make the 50 mile trip for 1 cow.

Thanks again for the advice.

 

[milkmaid]

Oh -- and is it a good time to sell a couple 750-800lb yearlings too, or should I wait a few more weeks? I certainly have the grass for them, but.... :???:

 

[stocky]

Milkmaid, right now the yearling price is pretty good. It is considerably better than it was 30 days ago. The slaughter cow price is pretty good now and typically goes down from now through the rest of the summer with the higher volume of killer cows. I would sell the yearlings now. The good cow in the picture is a 45 cent cow here this past week. The cow you are thinking about selling would be a 35-40 cent cow if it weren't for the scar. The scar could knock her to 20 cents, but probably not if they know she is healthy, so I would have the auctioneer tell the date of surgery and she should still bring 30-35 cents. I sold my cull cows, a bunch of cow-calf pairs, and my yearling calves last week---125 head total, because of the drought and I believe all the prices except the outstanding take home cattle will get cheaper as this drought gets worse.

 

[mnmtranching]

Milkmaid, I sat through a cow auction last Wed.I too have cows to sell. Your cow would have brought about 30$ at this sale. I agree the scar will cost about 5$ per hundred. The limp and hooves won't mean a thing. The limp as long as it's not caused by an open wound wont bother the buyers. Sounds like if you keep her you will have to put some money into her, I don't think I would want to do that. This is a good time to sell yearlings.

mnmt

 

[susie]

Sounds like if you keep her you will have to put some money into her, I don't think I would want to do that.

Milkmaid,
I agree, after learning about cost, etc. of the hoof trimming, I think you should sell her ASAP.

Good luck with the prices, hope you do well.

Susie

 

[Texas PaPaw]

Oh -- and is it a good time to sell a couple 750-800lb yearlings too, or should I wait a few more weeks? I certainly have the grass for them, but.... :???:

The heavy feeder market is good at the moment, however increasing corn prices will put downward pressure on feeders. With drought in the western corn belt that seems to be migrating east increases the probability of higher corn prices unless widespread rain & cooler temps happen in the next few days.

IMO-more downside risk than upside potential for feeders at this point. If they were mine would strongly consider selling in next 2 weeks if not sooner.

Good luck & happy trails.

Brock

 

[milkmaid]

Thanks for the input, ya'll. I'm bringing the yearlings in tomorrow morning, then taking two of mine and two or three of boss's down to the sale tomorrow. Also taking KK along; I DID end up giving her a bath today 8) :lol2: - don't ya'll laugh too hard - and while she didn't like it too well I got the job done. She isn't one of my halter-broke cows, FWIW. LOL. If nothing else, she'll be the cleanest cull cow those buyers have ever laid eyes on. And the white just sparkles! :lol: I put show sheen on her too, to keep her clean.

 

[sidney411]

Well - we need a new picture of clean KK before she goes then.