Purebred Angus bulls without papers

[TennesseeTuxedo]

Don't ask me, I'll lead you astray.

 

[callmefence]

In summary, just what do you really do, other than being a good follower and frequently telling me how I should run my operation. ;-)

That is rich, coming from a guy that has 20 pet cows, and tells everyone how much he knows about everything.

What if 20 "pet cows" make more than another persons 100 commercial cows? Are they still pets? I'm confident enough, that I think if I owned BlackCap May 4136, 44 Ruby 2357, and a couple others I know of, but no more than 4 cows in total, that I could generate more cash flow off embryo sales, and selling their daughters bred via AI to sexed semen, than I could on a herd of 500 commercial cows.

I'm pretty sure I could clear $750k a year on 4 cows and their daughters. I could raise them on a 20 acres.

Buy the most expensive bull in a straw. Raise a bull calf, sell to other people doing the same. Nothing goes commercial, it's to valuable. The whole thing is a pyramid scheme.
If it was 30 years ago you'd be pushing ostriches.

 

[TennesseeTuxedo]

That is rich, coming from a guy that has 20 pet cows, and tells everyone how much he knows about everything.

What if 20 "pet cows" make more than another persons 100 commercial cows? Are they still pets? I'm confident enough, that I think if I owned BlackCap May 4136, 44 Ruby 2357, and a couple others I know of, but no more than 4 cows in total, that I could generate more cash flow off embryo sales, and selling their daughters bred via AI to sexed semen, than I could on a herd of 500 commercial cows.

I'm pretty sure I could clear $750k a year on 4 cows and their daughters. I could raise them on a 20 acres.

Buy the most expensive bull in a straw. Raise a bull calf, sell to other people doing the same. Nothing goes commercial, it's to valuable. The whole thing is a pyramid scheme.
If it was 30 years ago you'd be pushing ostriches.

I buy registered bulls when I buy a bull I seldom pay anywhere close to a million.

 

[Midtenn]

In summary, just what do you really do, other than being a good follower and frequently telling me how I should run my operation. ;-)

That is rich, coming from a guy that has 20 pet cows, and tells everyone how much he knows about everything.

What if 20 "pet cows" make more than another persons 100 commercial cows? Are they still pets? I'm confident enough, that I think if I owned BlackCap May 4136, 44 Ruby 2357, and a couple others I know of, but no more than 4 cows in total, that I could generate more cash flow off embryo sales, and selling their daughters bred via AI to sexed semen, than I could on a herd of 500 commercial cows.

I'm pretty sure I could clear $750k a year on 4 cows and their daughters. I could raise them on a 20 acres.

Really Branded? You're confident? Never would have guessed

 

[Midtenn]

That is rich, coming from a guy that has 20 pet cows, and tells everyone how much he knows about everything.

What if 20 "pet cows" make more than another persons 100 commercial cows? Are they still pets? I'm confident enough, that I think if I owned BlackCap May 4136, 44 Ruby 2357, and a couple others I know of, but no more than 4 cows in total, that I could generate more cash flow off embryo sales, and selling their daughters bred via AI to sexed semen, than I could on a herd of 500 commercial cows.

I'm pretty sure I could clear $750k a year on 4 cows and their daughters. I could raise them on a 20 acres.

Really Branded? You're confident? Never would have guessed

Forgive me.. I've tried to stay out of this bickering, but hearing Branded say how confident he is like we didn't already know that...... was just too funny.

 

[True Grit Farms]

In summary, just what do you really do, other than being a good follower and frequently telling me how I should run my operation. ;-)

That is rich, coming from a guy that has 20 pet cows, and tells everyone how much he knows about everything.

What if 20 "pet cows" make more than another persons 100 commercial cows? Are they still pets? I'm confident enough, that I think if I owned BlackCap May 4136, 44 Ruby 2357, and a couple others I know of, but no more than 4 cows in total, that I could generate more cash flow off embryo sales, and selling their daughters bred via AI to sexed semen, than I could on a herd of 500 commercial cows.

I'm pretty sure I could clear $750k a year on 4 cows and their daughters. I could raise them on a 20 acres.

I feel like $750k is far fetched, but embryo sales is where the money's at. IMO The problem I see is having the name and not running out of customers. Something newer and better is always being promoted.

 

[jscunn]

Kinda silly game being played. If I had.. The problem is you dont have them and what it would cost to buy them would be way more than you could make on one years embryo production. I agree with TG 750k sounds high from someone not currently a part of the cocktail circle.

 

[ALACOWMAN]

Kinda silly game being played. If I had.. The problem is you dont have them and what it would cost to buy them would be way more than you could make on one years embryo production. I agree with TG 750k sounds high from someone not currently a part of the cocktail circle.

Just a matter of time.. And He'll be pootin' through silk... :cowboy:

 

[CattleMan1920]

I was reading the Angus Beef Bulletin yesterday and the Angus journal, and you would be hard pressed not to see the most successful Angus breeders in America not using each other's genetics.

As for asking other people for help, and looking at it as a bad thing? Smart people test everything, they experiment constantly.

I surround my myself with the smartest people I can possibly get access to. My guy who sells me hay in addition to what I can't produce, the hay I develop our bulls on, he has won best hay in Kentucky for years on end, he supplies the top Thoroughbred breeders here. My vets? I use two Auburn grads, both at or near the top of their class, one was voted Best Vet in Kentucky. I speak with a commercial producer often that runs over 500 head, and at times was near 1000, and has done so for 30 years. I speak with every top breeder that will take my call on the AI bulls I use. I use a college educated nutritionist at Southern States who comes from a family that ran a top notch dairy, and whose Grandfather was also very accomplished in the area of animal sciences and nutrition. I can keep going, but the moral of the story is this, I don't take any advice from people that are nitwits and I don't follow those that aren't successful. Does that make me a loser? Who cares? I absolutely realize that there are people out there in the big old world that know a lot more than me. A whole lot more.

I've spoken to Ron AKA Bright Raven, outside of this forum and I happen to think he is a highly intelligent person. I wouldn't call it using him, but he will surely be another person in my group that I rely on, not to mention he will be a friend.

The saying "blind leading the blind" applies quite often in the cattle business, as with other industries. I don't want to be following blindly in anything I do, if that is a good plan for your operation, keep at it then!

 

[ALACOWMAN]

Dares never turn out well, but let me think about this. I have a few right now that might work, I would not want to use anything sired by Stone Gate in this throwdown if I agree to it. I think one of our high input SAV sons with top 1% RADG and YW might work.

As TT said, I would want to send down one of our boys that has a healthy appetite, maybe an International son

This is probably the most interesting thing I've heard yet on here.

Be cautious of feed efficiency testing! If you read some of the University studies, these test have some inbuilt flaws when doing "head-to-head" tests.

If you take two 12 month old bulls; one is as skinny as a blacksnake and the other looks like the jolly fat man, who do you think has the most potential to get the highest gains per pound on input?

Do they limit-feed steers on feedlots? Portion control in other words.

I bought a bull once that was on test at Aurburn..breeder had to bring him back home, because of that..

 

[Bright Raven]

That is rich, coming from a guy that has 20 pet cows, and tells everyone how much he knows about everything.

What if 20 "pet cows" make more than another persons 100 commercial cows? Are they still pets? I'm confident enough, that I think if I owned BlackCap May 4136, 44 Ruby 2357, and a couple others I know of, but no more than 4 cows in total, that I could generate more cash flow off embryo sales, and selling their daughters bred via AI to sexed semen, than I could on a herd of 500 commercial cows.

I'm pretty sure I could clear $750k a year on 4 cows and their daughters. I could raise them on a 20 acres.

I feel like $750k is far fetched, but embryo sales is where the money's at. IMO The problem I see is having the name and not running out of customers. Something newer and better is always being promoted.

The elite Simmental breeders flush cows. If they have 3 to 4 flush cows and the reputation to go with them, they do very well. I have no idea what they gross but it is not hard to do the math.

 

[CattleMan1920]

I challenge you to show me someone that owns only four cows and clears 750K a year.

If a person were to own the very top cow from SAV, Connealy, 44 Farms, and Baldridge. Their VERY BEST FEMALE, and those cows were used for embryo purposes only, and those eggs were fertilized with top AI sires using sexed semen. Daughters would be sold in addition to the embryos each year. I would bet that $750k could be achieved.

I believe I saw a Baldridge Colonel, 10 month old heifer sell in 2018 for $97k, here in Kentucky at that! Would you rather sell one of those or 50 heifers, or maybe 75 heifers. That one heifer took nearly no inputs whatsoever to raise, but look at the price she commanded.

I'm not raising 4 cows and making $750k a year at Branded, let me make that disclaimer. What I'm trying to tell you is this, you are either raising genetics or you are raising carcasses. Genetics is far more profitable.

Take computers for example, the hardware is cheap, usually Chinese junk, it's the software that is expensive, what runs the computer. In the computer industry, it's the software companies that reap all the rewards, not the people making the box. An Iphone itself is not too expensive to make, but the technology in it is why they sell for $1500 or more.

It's not to say that economy of scale cannot kick in, look at McDonald's. However, with that said, do you want to sell ribeyes or plain cheeseburgers? If you can sell enough cheeseburgers, and have the labor to make it happen, GREAT! But what if you only had limited resources, wouldn't you want to sell $100 steaks versus a $1 hamburger. I know I would.

 

[gcreekrch]

Are you talking about their feed input efficiency or efficiency in jumping the sides of the handling facilities? ;-)

Strictly referring to feed efficiency. I've got plenty of Angus jumping out of my facilities already.

Convert to Simmental. The only problem with them is they are so laid back, they get halfway down the alley and fall asleep.

Or build something more than a sheep pen.

 

[CattleMan1920]

Now to really stir the pot, and get things lit up around here.

I'm not so sure I would want to send my bulls to test. Right now they eat very expensive grain, alfalfa/ orchard grass hay that comes off the same field that Thoroughbred horses hay comes from, they have the best minerals I can buy, they have around 3 acres per bull to keep the stress down during development, and they have regular shots of multimin, and whatever else they need to have them at top performance.

Would a feedlot do this for them? Maybe they would, but my hunch is they would NOT. Why would I want to downgrade the nutrition in their development phase?

What I do like about the test is the consistency and the data feedback, but I already weigh at birth, weaning, and yearling and submit that to AAA, along with high density DNA testing and a BSE. I'm not sure what else I could be doing to improve them other than genetics. They are under a microscope as it is right now. I make sure I call the buyers and see if they have open cows, and they don't, that tells me that the BSE is confirmed. What am I missing other than being able to tell everyone that my bull is at test? Once those numbers are submitted to Angus, they can pretty much calculate RADG. If I did send them to test I would want to send them to Midland.

I'm sure I will hear all the counter arguments why I'm dumber than dog sh..t, but I'm open to hearing them.

 

[Nesikep]

Branded, you pick the bull test and we'll both put a bull in the test this spring or fall. Who's ever bull comes up short has to pay for the test for both bulls. We only have 4 bulls out of 35 left that could into a spring test. But have quite a few that will make the fall - winter bull evaluation tests. If you want to put some extra boot on the test I'm willing to do that also. I'm so sure that one of our bulls will test out better in the Tifton Bull Evaluation test I'll pay your test fee, travel and $5k for the bull.
You think to much of your bulls, and yourself. I've personally read enough of your BS. Put up or shut up.

An eating contest?

His guys are seasoned pros.

Dares never turn out well, but let me think about this. I have a few right now that might work, I would not want to use anything sired by Stone Gate in this throwdown if I agree to it. I think one of our high input SAV sons with top 1% RADG and YW might work.

As TT said, I would want to send down one of our boys that has a healthy appetite, maybe an International son

This is probably the most interesting thing I've heard yet on here.

You know what I'd like to see as a test? A herd of cattle with half bred to a bull or two from each of you and compare the calves... A bull's value is in his offspring really, not in how big he can get. I've noticed in my herd that some of the thinner, bonier looking cows have the meatier looking calves (I've seen this in several full sisters bred to the same bulls)

 

[gcreekrch]

In summary, just what do you really do, other than being a good follower and frequently telling me how I should run my operation. ;-)

That is rich, coming from a guy that has 20 pet cows, and tells everyone how much he knows about everything.

What if 20 "pet cows" make more than another persons 100 commercial cows? Are they still pets? I'm confident enough, that I think if I owned BlackCap May 4136, 44 Ruby 2357, and a couple others I know of, but no more than 4 cows in total, that I could generate more cash flow off embryo sales, and selling their daughters bred via AI to sexed semen, than I could on a herd of 500 commercial cows.

I'm pretty sure I could clear $750k a year on 4 cows and their daughters. I could raise them on a 20 acres.

If is a very big word, however, you don't have any of those ifs so let's go back to reality.

 

[gcreekrch]

That is rich, coming from a guy that has 20 pet cows, and tells everyone how much he knows about everything.

What if 20 "pet cows" make more than another persons 100 commercial cows? Are they still pets? I'm confident enough, that I think if I owned BlackCap May 4136, 44 Ruby 2357, and a couple others I know of, but no more than 4 cows in total, that I could generate more cash flow off embryo sales, and selling their daughters bred via AI to sexed semen, than I could on a herd of 500 commercial cows.

I'm pretty sure I could clear $750k a year on 4 cows and their daughters. I could raise them on a 20 acres.

I feel like $750k is far fetched, but embryo sales is where the money's at. IMO The problem I see is having the name and not running out of customers. Something newer and better is always being promoted.

That would be even more difficult if you were a four cow and no bull farm. :roll:

 

[CattleMan1920]

An eating contest?

His guys are seasoned pros.

Dares never turn out well, but let me think about this. I have a few right now that might work, I would not want to use anything sired by Stone Gate in this throwdown if I agree to it. I think one of our high input SAV sons with top 1% RADG and YW might work.

As TT said, I would want to send down one of our boys that has a healthy appetite, maybe an International son

This is probably the most interesting thing I've heard yet on here.

You know what I'd like to see as a test? A herd of cattle with half bred to a bull or two from each of you and compare the calves... A bull's value is in his offspring really, not in how big he can get. I've noticed in my herd that some of the thinner, bonier looking cows have the meatier looking calves (I've seen this in several full sisters bred to the same bulls)

That's not a bad idea, I might be able to get one of my clients to agree to that. I would still want to bring the best that I can produce to this pizzing contest.

On a side note, there is a kid on Youtube that takes a full electric Tesla to the drag strip and cleans everyone's clock. He makes videos and bets the people he races against, and makes a lot of money off of them. He is using technology to go faster than all the muscle cars with nitrous and every old technology known. He REALLY makes the gas guys MAD! Yet they come back race after race for another beating, some are willing to blow up their engines just to try and beat him, but the electric wins every time. He goes down the track with his a/c blowing, they go down the track with their engines blowing. They confront him after the race, call him names, posture, but at the end of the day the kid wins every race because his car is more technologically advanced than those he is racing against. It's not even a fair competition, but like I said they keep coming back for more, almost as if they enjoy the abuse.

I see the cattle genetics game exactly like this. I don't want to be the producer trying to grasp on to old tech, and getting my clock cleaned by the new guy. I will be really old before long, and there will be new whippersnappers nipping at my heals, if you think I'm a pain in the azz on CT, wait until these new kids with deep resources from their Father, or Grandfathers successful cattle operations are dictating how the business is run. Better yet, wait until you are competing against a corporation full bore. Take a look at Boyd's, his son is deeply involved and he is a very young buck, just getting started, and he understands everything I'm saying on here as well if not better than me. Oh to be a teenager again, but with knowledge behind me. When I see that, I say to myself, "run faster Branded, run faster"

 

[jehosofat]

Oh boy, a Tesla wins every race against every car known to man. Where do you come up with this junk?

 

[TennesseeTuxedo]

Oh boy, a Tesla wins every race against every car known to man. Where do you come up with this junk?

It's on YouTube.