Purchased my first yearling Hereford Bull in 10 years

[Chuckie]

Alan,
Have you got a good recipe for fajitas? :lol2:

 

[cowgirl8]

Amazing! We have almost 1000 posts on this thread, and have lurched back into the same old tired rhetoric concerning which is BEST - Angus or Hereford - or - horned or polled - or - or black white-face - or - color - color - color - on to infinity! OR , throwing the same old tired blather relating to the AAA (American Angus Association), which is nothing more than "Breed" prejudice harkening back to the days when the Hereford Breed was the supreme beef breed in the USA ( with justifiable reasons) and the Angus breed (and others) were taking the hind teat. When the Angus breeders got their collective heads out of wherever they had been, and began to pay attention to genetic reality and scientific facts, and a common sense BALANCE between those factors, along with increased education by cattle producers relating to accuracies of selection traits and characteristics - the more astute breeders became aware of the realities of Dominance of Genetics in many of the important profitable factors in making a PROFIT in the beef cattle business. "Single Trait Selection" (Hide "color" being one and Breed "Name" being another) still pervades the thinking of narrow-minded "cattle multipliers" who still can't ascertain why they can't dig themselves out of the "that's-just-the-way-that-we-have-always-done-it!" thinking, and realize the kind of PROFIT that is possible to be realized by paying attention to others who have more sense than they do.

But - in the 6000 year history of recorded world activities, the old Devil "ARROGANCE" will continue to yell in their ears "NOBODY can tell YOU what to do! You know it all!"

And we will continue to have the same stupid justification of 'ignorance' that exists today. And we will continue to have cattle breeders who will ignore reality and advanced knowledge, and continue to wonder why they have less than optimal breeding successes with their herds. EPD's are a scam, and DNA is advanced educational hooey! AND, "Multiple Trait Selection" choices is too much trouble.

Rant over!

DOC HARRIS

I PMed you

 

[JWBrahman]

Alan,
Have you got a good recipe for fajitas? :lol2:

beefitswhatsfordinner.com
We had the balsamic flank steak for dinner last night. Doesn't matter what breed the flank steak always tastes like heaven.
http://www.beefitswhatsfordinner.com/re ... px?id=1031

 

[TennesseeTuxedo]

Amazing! We have almost 1000 posts on this thread, and have lurched back into the same old tired rhetoric concerning which is BEST - Angus or Hereford - or - horned or polled - or - or black white-face - or - color - color - color - on to infinity! OR , throwing the same old tired blather relating to the AAA (American Angus Association), which is nothing more than "Breed" prejudice harkening back to the days when the Hereford Breed was the supreme beef breed in the USA ( with justifiable reasons) and the Angus breed (and others) were taking the hind teat. When the Angus breeders got their collective heads out of wherever they had been, and began to pay attention to genetic reality and scientific facts, and a common sense BALANCE between those factors, along with increased education by cattle producers relating to accuracies of selection traits and characteristics - the more astute breeders became aware of the realities of Dominance of Genetics in many of the important profitable factors in making a PROFIT in the beef cattle business. "Single Trait Selection" (Hide "color" being one and Breed "Name" being another) still pervades the thinking of narrow-minded "cattle multipliers" who still can't ascertain why they can't dig themselves out of the "that's-just-the-way-that-we-have-always-done-it!" thinking, and realize the kind of PROFIT that is possible to be realized by paying attention to others who have more sense than they do.

But - in the 6000 year history of recorded world activities, the old Devil "ARROGANCE" will continue to yell in their ears "NOBODY can tell YOU what to do! You know it all!"

And we will continue to have the same stupid justification of 'ignorance' that exists today. And we will continue to have cattle breeders who will ignore reality and advanced knowledge, and continue to wonder why they have less than optimal breeding successes with their herds. EPD's are a scam, and DNA is advanced educational hooey! AND, "Multiple Trait Selection" choices is too much trouble.

Rant over!

DOC HARRIS

I PMed you

Oh crap!

You're in for it now Doc. Let the chicken litter fly!

Very nice post you put up Doc.

 

[elkwc]

Did all of the Hereford influence come from operations that had Hereford and no other breed on the place? Reason I ask is I know a Hereford/Red Angus guy that sells bulls and more than once his whiteface bulls have thrown a solid on whiteface cows and a solid thrown a whiteface on solid cows.

The Hereford influence comes from registered Hereford breeders, and as far as I know none of them had any other breed.

It would be interesting to do a search of the pedigrees of the bulls who throw solid black calves and see what lurks in the background. To see if any of the known or suspected crosses show up. Titan 23D was one of the known crosses the AHA refused to do anything about. He lurks in the background of many Polled bloodlines. I looked at some of the best Polled cattled I've found yesterday. His influence is in the background and so likely I won't purchase one of them. You can call me a purist or whatever. But for a breeder to say his cattle are purebred Herefords when they know that their herd has a known non Hereford influence in the background is misrepresenting the truth in my opinion. There are other known crosses but many of the known diluters trace back to him. Through the years starting in the last 50's I've seen thousands of Angus/Hereford crosses and never saw or heard of a solid black one until all of the frame race started and the known and suspected crosses came around. Personally I choose to avoid any suspected bloodlines but that is my personal choice. At the least there should be a notation on the papers so anyone could tell they aren't pure and then the buyer can decide.Just like the appendix papers on a QH that is part TB.

 

[elkwc]

First I want to say this is a nice bull. He has some of the Remittal influence which I have found in most of the better polled cattle I've seen. He should do a nice job for the OP. He would rank in the top 5% of all of the polled bulls I've looked at this year. I've been searching for a Hereford bull preferably a polled. Regardless of what some polled breeders claim there is a quality difference at least in this area between horned and polled cattle. I've covered a fairly large area. Have looked at bulls from some of the hottest breeders in the polled business and bulls who have been either high sellers or at the very top. The issues I've found is that on the average the Polled breed hasn't corrected the muscling issue. I've found some structural problems and also frame size. Many of the bulls from the hottest breeders reminds me of the overgrown dwarfs of the 50's and early 60's. I have seen some improvement. I've found a few bulls which I would purchase but they are priced 2-3 times higher than a horned bull of comparable quality. The other issue in some of those I've found that meet my requirements go back to Titan 23D which many of the known diluters trace back too. And being I want a purebred Hereford with no known or possible genetic issues I'm trying to avoid them. Many of the quality Polled cattle I've found trace back to the Remittals and many go back to the Barbers and Moler. I have found two polled herds that are producing what I term good quality cattle that will perform for the commercial breeder. And have one more to go look at. I feel if the Polled breed will address their issues and the breeders quit chasing the current show ring fad they will be very sought after in the future. I have talked to other commercial breeders and most of them echo my thoughts. I can't comment on the quality in other areas but in this area the main improvement I've noticed over the last 30 years in the Polled cattle and a important one are the udders and teats. Most have addressed this issue. Again my opinion is from a commercial breeder looking for a Hereford bull for an cross. The only reason I haven't purchased a Horned bull is we want to eliminate the need to dehorn.

 

[mncowboy]

First I want to say this is a nice bull. He has some of the Remittal influence which I have found in most of the better polled cattle I've seen. He should do a nice job for the OP. He would rank in the top 5% of all of the polled bulls I've looked at this year. I've been searching for a Hereford bull preferably a polled. Regardless of what some polled breeders claim there is a quality difference at least in this area between horned and polled cattle. I've covered a fairly large area. Have looked at bulls from some of the hottest breeders in the polled business and bulls who have been either high sellers or at the very top. The issues I've found is that on the average the Polled breed hasn't corrected the muscling issue. I've found some structural problems and also frame size. Many of the bulls from the hottest breeders reminds me of the overgrown dwarfs of the 50's and early 60's. I have seen some improvement. I've found a few bulls which I would purchase but they are priced 2-3 times higher than a horned bull of comparable quality. The other issue in some of those I've found that meet my requirements go back to Titan 23D which many of the known diluters trace back too. And being I want a purebred Hereford with no known or possible genetic issues I'm trying to avoid them. Many of the quality Polled cattle I've found trace back to the Remittals and many go back to the Barbers and Moler. I have found two polled herds that are producing what I term good quality cattle that will perform for the commercial breeder. And have one more to go look at. I feel if the Polled breed will address their issues and the breeders quit chasing the current show ring fad they will be very sought after in the future. I have talked to other commercial breeders and most of them echo my thoughts. I can't comment on the quality in other areas but in this area the main improvement I've noticed over the last 30 years in the Polled cattle and a important one are the udders and teats. Most have addressed this issue. Again my opinion is from a commercial breeder looking for a Hereford bull for an cross. The only reason I haven't purchased a Horned bull is we want to eliminate the need to dehorn.

I purchased this one from Olson hereford and red Angus. Argusville ND. olsonredpower.com

 

[Chuckie]

JW, For years as a kid, we ate flank steaks. My dad would grill them rare, and slice it thin. It was soooo good. It was actually considered a lower quality cut of meat back then. The price was low. That was the only kind of steak that we ate.

I will play around with the boiling/microwave - hatchet recipe.

 

[elkwc]

First I want to say this is a nice bull. He has some of the Remittal influence which I have found in most of the better polled cattle I've seen. He should do a nice job for the OP. He would rank in the top 5% of all of the polled bulls I've looked at this year. I've been searching for a Hereford bull preferably a polled. Regardless of what some polled breeders claim there is a quality difference at least in this area between horned and polled cattle. I've covered a fairly large area. Have looked at bulls from some of the hottest breeders in the polled business and bulls who have been either high sellers or at the very top. The issues I've found is that on the average the Polled breed hasn't corrected the muscling issue. I've found some structural problems and also frame size. Many of the bulls from the hottest breeders reminds me of the overgrown dwarfs of the 50's and early 60's. I have seen some improvement. I've found a few bulls which I would purchase but they are priced 2-3 times higher than a horned bull of comparable quality. The other issue in some of those I've found that meet my requirements go back to Titan 23D which many of the known diluters trace back too. And being I want a purebred Hereford with no known or possible genetic issues I'm trying to avoid them. Many of the quality Polled cattle I've found trace back to the Remittals and many go back to the Barbers and Moler. I have found two polled herds that are producing what I term good quality cattle that will perform for the commercial breeder. And have one more to go look at. I feel if the Polled breed will address their issues and the breeders quit chasing the current show ring fad they will be very sought after in the future. I have talked to other commercial breeders and most of them echo my thoughts. I can't comment on the quality in other areas but in this area the main improvement I've noticed over the last 30 years in the Polled cattle and a important one are the udders and teats. Most have addressed this issue. Again my opinion is from a commercial breeder looking for a Hereford bull for an cross. The only reason I haven't purchased a Horned bull is we want to eliminate the need to dehorn.

I purchased this one from Olson hereford and red Angus. Argusville ND. olsonredpower.com

They have some nice herd bulls. They are a long ways from me. Just curious will 5 thousand buy a bull from them?

 

[SRBeef]

I'm curious about the Titan 23D influence. Titan 23D calved in 1972. How can you look at the AHA website to see if he is in a particular bull's pedigree?

Looking back through just the the topside of my current (Huth Z072) bull's pedigree, he goes back to Felton's then the Line one/Prospector in the 1960's but there are a lot of places that 23D could have entered. It would take days to check them all. Is there a way to do a search for a particular sire in a bull's pedigree?

thanks for any help

Jim

 

[mncowboy]

First I want to say this is a nice bull. He has some of the Remittal influence which I have found in most of the better polled cattle I've seen. He should do a nice job for the OP. He would rank in the top 5% of all of the polled bulls I've looked at this year. I've been searching for a Hereford bull preferably a polled. Regardless of what some polled breeders claim there is a quality difference at least in this area between horned and polled cattle. I've covered a fairly large area. Have looked at bulls from some of the hottest breeders in the polled business and bulls who have been either high sellers or at the very top. The issues I've found is that on the average the Polled breed hasn't corrected the muscling issue. I've found some structural problems and also frame size. Many of the bulls from the hottest breeders reminds me of the overgrown dwarfs of the 50's and early 60's. I have seen some improvement. I've found a few bulls which I would purchase but they are priced 2-3 times higher than a horned bull of comparable quality. The other issue in some of those I've found that meet my requirements go back to Titan 23D which many of the known diluters trace back too. And being I want a purebred Hereford with no known or possible genetic issues I'm trying to avoid them. Many of the quality Polled cattle I've found trace back to the Remittals and many go back to the Barbers and Moler. I have found two polled herds that are producing what I term good quality cattle that will perform for the commercial breeder. And have one more to go look at. I feel if the Polled breed will address their issues and the breeders quit chasing the current show ring fad they will be very sought after in the future. I have talked to other commercial breeders and most of them echo my thoughts. I can't comment on the quality in other areas but in this area the main improvement I've noticed over the last 30 years in the Polled cattle and a important one are the udders and teats. Most have addressed this issue. Again my opinion is from a commercial breeder looking for a Hereford bull for an cross. The only reason I haven't purchased a Horned bull is we want to eliminate the need to dehorn.

I purchased this one from Olson hereford and red Angus. Argusville ND. olsonredpower.com

They have some nice herd bulls. They are a long ways from me. Just curious will 5 thousand buy a bull from them?

Yes

 

[Dave]

Oh yea! Nothing, I mean nothing beats a good Hereford steak! Especially if you cook it at a slow boil for a few minutes then finish it off in the microwave! So good you can cut it with a hatchet no problem and last in your mouth for a long while! Good eats!

Alan, you know this is BS. You aren't cutting that with no short handled hatchet. It take a long handled falling axe to cut it. Something you get a good swing with. But once you get it sliced up there is simply nothing to compare it to

 

[greybeard]

Then can you explain why you'd pay more for angus rather than a regular big mac?

You seriously didn't just ask that did you?[/quote]

Who would?
Not me--not most end consumers unless they've just bought into the marketing hype.
There's a sucker born every minute.
(not that I would buy any McDonald's product unless there was just nothing else open)

 

[PLTannery]

Didn't have the time to read this whole thread..But if you read the "Certified Angus" and "Certified Hereford" requirements. Black Baldies will meet both requirements. So depending on which is more "Popular" you will still be at the top of the market...

 

[cowgirl8]

Didn't have the time to read this whole thread..But if you read the "Certified Angus" and "Certified Hereford" requirements. Black Baldies will meet both requirements. So depending on which is more "Popular" you will still be at the top of the market...

And whether they taste different or not, its what people want and are willing to pay more. This is not something i came up with, its just how it is. Glad to see that someone else can validate it. Which then kind of makes sense that if you dont go for black, black w/f, that if you have any other color and want top price, that calf better be growthy looking or make up for it in size.

 

[WalnutCrest]

You can actually taste the difference huh? Interesting.

Actually there have been taste tests done among purebreds.
And Hereford was consistently the winner.

I'm sure that Wagyu & Jersey have been winners for tender beef.

I understand this is about Angus vs. Hereford vs. black baldie......

The best beef taste is Jersey. The best beef tenderness and texture is Piedmontese. A thick stark will tear when you try to flip it on the grill. I have eaten quite a few steaks from the cross, and there is no comparison to any Angus steak. I have never had an Angus steak separate on the grill or when you are cutting it, you are thinking, "I could cut this with a fork" as it separates and tears. So tender. Sooo good.

We run multiple taste-tests here on the farm each year.

The one we hosted last week, our home-grown Aubrac steer was the narrow consensus winner over a fullblood Galloway steer under the same management, butchering instructions and preparation (nothing fancier than a tiny pinch of salt).

The one we hosted before that, the big winner was an Aubrac/Limmy cross cull cow and it wasn't even close. The quote that night was, "Wow!! That's beef butter!!"

One of the ones before that was a tight race between Aubrac, Pinzgauer, Jersey and a bison cross. The red angus was in the bottom third that day as was the Charolais.