Protein or Energy

[BC]

In my VERY limited experience.....

It cost u money to wean em 2 weeks!!
Better off and more dollars in your pocket by trailer weaning right to the sale barn.
Money saved on feed etc is money still in your pocket. The post above about buyers wanting those weaned calves like that know exactly that the SELLER has absorbed the costs that they would normally absorb. And prices ain't off far enough on GOOD QUALITY UNWEANED calves to make up the difference in weight loss, vax, weaning etc...

If you implant them and wean at LEAST 60 to 90 days you can possibly be money ahead just from the gains on those calves.

Murray, you have about half of the story. It takes about 30 days to get back to what the calf weighed the minute you pulled it off the cow. It is the health aspect that makes a weaned calf more desirable. I am going to use an analogy that I think everyone can understand, Your unweaned calf is like a child going to school. They don't get sick until they get exposed to the other kids at school who came from different backgrounds. If they know how to eat from a trough, then you can get some energy in them which will keep them from getting run down and more susceptible to sickness. A good vaccination program boosts their immune system.. Another plus to a weaned calf is that the male calves more than likely have been castrated. Marketing those weaned calves is the key. In parts of the country, they hold sales for weaned calves with a known health protocol. Those sales typically see a $5 to $12 per cwt. premium over a calves sold through the regular sales. If you take a small group of weaned calves to your regular sale, I doubt you will see much difference in price. Reason is there is no way to differentiate the unweaned from the weaned when bought and penned together.

Another thing that few people discuss is shrink and ways to minimize it, A weaned calf that knows how to eat and drink, can be hauled to the sale a day or two early and go right back on feed and fill back up. A trailer weaned calf walks the fence and bawls and losses weight. In East Texas, a trailer weaned calf will typically shrink 5 to 8% and can be as high as 10% in August -September heat and large runs.


One final thought, by weaning and holding at your place, you get to choose the time of sale especially in the fall and avoid selling in October which calf buyers refer to as "National Dead Calf Month".

the weaned calves from the

 

[Lucky_P]

It cost u money to wean em 2 weeks!!

Amen to that.
If you don't weigh them, you might look at them, and say, "They look good, I THINK they're gaining"
After we got scales set up, I was amazed to see those calves - which were already accustomed to eating grain out of bunks, drinking from tanks, and eating hay - drop an average of 50 pounds each in the first week, even with little to no bawling or walking fenceline. I would not have dreamed it would be that bad... but the scale tells the tale.

 

[Jeanne - Simme Valley]

Amen to that.
If you don't weigh them, you might look at them, and say, "They look good, I THINK they're gaining"
After we got scales set up, I was amazed to see those calves - which were already accustomed to eating grain out of bunks, drinking from tanks, and eating hay - drop an average of 50 pounds each in the first week, even with little to no bawling or walking fenceline. I would not have dreamed it would be that bad... but the scale tells the tale.

That may be true, but that is shrink and as soon as they settle in, the recoup that shrink quickly. I would say, if you wean for only 1-2 weeks, you are hurting yourself. If you wean for 30+ days, you should make out better.
I consistently wean each year for 35-40 days. But, I have developed a marketing direct to a feedlot. I used to type up all the stats (weights, vaccinations, etc) for the buyer. He doesn't even want it anymore. Trusts what I deliver will make him money.
Last year my steers brought more than my "pre-sold" bull calves. Steers brought $2028 each.

 

[Silver]

If I was buying calves I'd like that too. But i think if u are going to keep them 30-45 days you might as well keep them a bit longer yet long enough to put some money in your own pockets

In my opinion 90 days minimum. But that's just my opinion.

 

[MurraysMutts]

That may be true, but that is shrink and as soon as they settle in, the recoup that shrink quickly. I would say, if you wean for only 1-2 weeks, you are hurting yourself. If you wean for 30+ days, you should make out better.
I consistently wean each year for 35-40 days. But, I have developed a marketing direct to a feedlot. I used to type up all the stats (weights, vaccinations, etc) for the buyer. He doesn't even want it anymore. Trusts what I deliver will make him money.
Last year my steers brought more than my "pre-sold" bull calves. Steers brought $2028 each.

Me thinks your animals might be a lil bit exceptional!!

 

[farmerjan]

No, the buyer wants a calf that has gone through the bawling stage, knows what a feed and water trough is for and is less likely to get sick.

Agree... they do not want calves that are walking around looking for momma, don't know how to eat or how to drink out of a watering trough... and have an immune system that is not compromised by the stress of coming right off a cow. We didn't used to have the facilities to wean, but now we do and we do get more for the calves that are weaned and know how to find feed/water for themselves... No they might not gain for those first couple weeks they are weaned, but once they "get it", most buyers will pay more for them.

 

[farmerjan]

That is why calves that learn to come to a feed bunk/trough with their momma, and have to learn a water trough, where they might have to push down the balls to get to the water, will wean easier and faster and lose less than ones that come in off a range where they have only had to go to the creek/pond to get water and have no idea what that stuff is that you put there for them to try to eat. I use a creep gate at the pasture where the 1st calf heifers are, and they quickly learn that the truck or car means they are going to get a "treat" when they see me and I call them. They are not on self feeders, and don't get alot... but they associate me with "good stuff" and don't take off for the back 40.... they still miss momma when weaned, but they don't wear themselves out walking the perimeter and don't know what the feed bunk is for on top of it. Like @Lucky_P said, they are accustomed to all that, they still lose weight for a week or so, but they will MORE quickly gain it back if they get the past the initial just missing their momma's. And they will not get sick as easily if that little bit of learning curve has already been passed and they can eat and keep up their energy and strength.

 

[Travlr]

Me thinks your animals might be a lil bit exceptional!!

One of the things I've learned on this forum is that a lot of people will buy the cheapest animals they can find, expecting good results from what they feed them. As though minerals and cubes and supplemental grain and hay tested for nutrients will make their animals better...

@Jeanne - Simme Valley is using everything she knows to do it the opposite way... growing the highest quality cows she can and getting the best results from genetics, and with as few feed expenses and efforts as possible. And she's getting excellent results. She's not starving her animals in any way, or going cheap on anything, but she starts with good animals. That's her starting point.

Like I've been saying... spend a little more to buy the better cows, mothers that you will be keeping for 5 years average or more... and don't worry as much (AS much) about trying to feed your calves up to something they will never be because they came out of crap cows.

 

[gcreekrch]

In my VERY limited experience.....

It cost u money to wean em 2 weeks!!
Better off and more dollars in your pocket by trailer weaning right to the sale barn.
Money saved on feed etc is money still in your pocket. The post above about buyers wanting those weaned calves like that know exactly that the SELLER has absorbed the costs that they would normally absorb. And prices ain't off far enough on GOOD QUALITY UNWEANED calves to make up the difference in weight loss, vax, weaning etc...

If you implant them and wean at LEAST 60 to 90 days you can possibly be money ahead just from the gains on those calves.

A few years ago at B.C. Cattlemen's AGM they brought in a young lady from Nebraska to give a presentation on what feedlots expected cow/calf producers to do prior to delivering calves to a sale ring or direct to a lot. Weaned 60 days, double vaxxed etc.
The gal left out the economical points on the cow guy's end. Shink, cost of vaccine and feed, death loss….

When they asked if there were any questions I was first to hold my hand up. I asked is she could give me the names of a few lots that would pay me 25 cents a lb more than the premium we already received for our calves straight off the cow as that would be a rough breakeven to do the excercise. Most cow guys are not set up to maximize gains immediately and I think in those case the number would be closer to 40 cents difference to break even.
The facilitator actually grabbed the mic out of my hand when she was at a loss for words and asked if there were any other questions. There weren't.

 

[farmerjan]

@gcreekrch ; Agree on the costs of weaning and vaccs etc... we are getting a bit more here for them... maybe not $.25, sometimes more... when they are advertised as weaned and vacc... there are times we don't wean and all that... they get trailer weaned.

And we may very well sell some that are trailer weaned, sooner rather than later, with the prices the way they are. Calves here at the local sale on Friday, 2/02.... all the way up to 7 wt calves, there were ranges of 2.50 to 3.25... and lighter weights were a little higher in some cases. Have some bigger calves coming off cows in another week... and they may go right on the trailer and to the sale........ and NO , they will NOT be falsely advertised as weaned... even though many of the cows are pushing 7 months bred, and many of them look like they have dried up now.......since they were in a group with different sized calves that we wanted to get back to a more uniform calving time frame and group. So we will be pulling calves off, since these cows will be in the 5 -7 month bred range... due mostly in April/May which is better than the Feb through August that these were, all over the place...Some are bought cows, some are ours... and we had all sorts of grass at this place so moved anyone out there we could get off the home farm and some were exposed to the bull when they had small calves on them....some had bigger calves.... hoping to back some up from summer to spring... and get back to a 60-75 day calving window...

 

[gcreekrch]

@gcreekrch ; Agree on the costs of weaning and vaccs etc... we are getting a bit more here for them... maybe not $.25, sometimes more... when they are advertised as weaned and vacc... there are times we don't wean and all that... they get trailer weaned.

And we may very well sell some that are trailer weaned, sooner rather than later, with the prices the way they are. Calves here at the local sale on Friday, 2/02.... all the way up to 7 wt calves, there were ranges of 2.50 to 3.25... and lighter weights were a little higher in some cases. Have some bigger calves coming off cows in another week... and they may go right on the trailer and to the sale........ and NO , they will NOT be falsely advertised as weaned... even though many of the cows are pushing 7 months bred, and many of them look like they have dried up now.......since they were in a group with different sized calves that we wanted to get back to a more uniform calving time frame and group. So we will be pulling calves off, since these cows will be in the 5 -7 month bred range... due mostly in April/May which is better than the Feb through August that these were, all over the place...Some are bought cows, some are ours... and we had all sorts of grass at this place so moved anyone out there we could get off the home farm and some were exposed to the bull when they had small calves on them....some had bigger calves.... hoping to back some up from summer to spring... and get back to a 60-75 day calving window...

Most calves in this area born from February to May with some late ones. More people calving a little later every year.

 

[Brute 23]

One of the things I've learned on this forum is that a lot of people will buy the cheapest animals they can find, expecting good results from what they feed them. As though minerals and cubes and supplemental grain and hay tested for nutrients will make their animals better...

@Jeanne - Simme Valley is using everything she knows to do it the opposite way... growing the highest quality cows she can and getting the best results from genetics, and with as few feed expenses and efforts as possible. And she's getting excellent results. She's not starving her animals in any way, or going cheap on anything, but she starts with good animals. That's her starting point.

Like I've been saying... spend a little more to buy the better cows, mothers that you will be keeping for 5 years average or more... and don't worry as much (AS much) about trying to feed your calves up to something they will never be because they came out of crap cows.

I think the same can be said for bulls. People will go buy equipment and feed and all sorts of other things but skimp on a bull. If there is any one thing I could go back and tell myself (about cattle) that I didn't know early on it would be... spend more money on bulls.

 

[Travlr]

I think the same can be said for bulls. People will go buy equipment and feed and all sorts of other things but skimp on a bull. If there is any one thing I could go back and tell myself (about cattle) that I didn't know early on it would be... spend more money on bulls.

That's good advice... But if you know what to look for you can find great deals and even save money on bulls. We've all seen bulls go for a lot of money and they were great bulls but there is no way they would result in calves that were so much better that the bull would pay for itself. On the other hand we've also seen some great bulls that people have overlooked, that are really herd improvers. It's just like any investment, you have to be ready to jump when you find the right one. Still... spending a little more will probably net you a better profit as long as it's not too much more.