Pine trees in the pasture question

[SRBeef]

As I am new to cattle I will post this question on the beginners forum rather than pasture -

I am adding some permanent fencing this summer and would like to include a couple of acres of approx 30 year old white and red pine tree woods inside the pasture as a place for winter shelter. I will also gradually thin and harvest some of these planted trees to increase my grazing area.

On other posts here I recall someone saying that their cattle had become sick or died from eating Ponderosa pine needles. Is this something unique to the Ponderosa or is it also White and Red pine?

In my current pastures I have a number of both red and white pines where my Herefords go for shade in the heat. I see them occasionally browsing on those pines without any problem that I have noticed.

Question: does anyone see a problem of including a couple acres of solid planted white and red pine woods as a shelter area inside a pasture? Thanks for any advice or experience.

 

[bandit80]

Don't know about the pine needles effecting your cattle.

If you want to establish a windbreak/shelter area for your cattle, I doubt you would need a full two acres. Guess it depends on the number of head you are talking about. You will want to be careful as to how far apart you plant your trees, otherwise you will creat a dense pine forest that the cattle will not enter. If it were me, I would simply plant your pines in various lines to creat a windbreak. This is provided there aren't any existing trees to create such. Cattle are pretty good at using trees to seek shelter.

Maybe plant in a pattern like this. The l's represent a solid side, not sides with gaps. Just have your opening on say the southeast side, or whichever direction the wind doesn't blow from very often. This will give them access to the sheltered area while still breaking the wind from all sides.

__________________
l l
l l
l l
l l
l l
l_____________

EDIT: I can't get the right hand side l's to line up correctly. Just make a box, with an opening in one corner.

 

[dun]

Apparantly it's primaruly a Ponderosa pine problem
http://www.ars.usda.gov/Services/docs.htm?docid=9977
http://www.csubeef.com/index.php?option ... ad&pdf=166

 

[hrbelgians]

I do not know if I can truthfully answer your question, however will pass on what I was told.
When we bought this farm we also had lots of pine planted for wind-breaks ETC. and was told horses (I don't remember about cattle?) absolutely need to be kept away from them. I was told the needles will puncher the gut. I built a fence of which ended up in later years being to close to the trees. But the horses and cows actually keep them trimmed back at this point and we have never had any issues. Thats just my experience for whatever it's worth.

Edit: I am only contending with a dozen trees total, maybe volume would be an issue?

 

[SRBeef]

Thanks for the replies. We have no Ponderosa or the other varieties listed in the links so I will probably be OK. I will use electric wire to keep them out of the pines most of the time but want a good 5-wire perimeter fence which will necessarily include the pines. I appreciate the time taken to offer advice.

 

[msscamp]

On other posts here I recall someone saying that their cattle had become sick or died from eating Ponderosa pine needles. Is this something unique to the Ponderosa or is it also White and Red pine?

We've never had cattle become sick, or had them die due to eating pine needles but, generaly speaking, cattle will only eat pine needles when there is nothing else available. The only time we had problems with pine needles was during blizzards, and only in 1 pasture - the cattle were driven up onto a ridge of pine trees, and it was usually a day or so before we could get out there to get them back down due to the blizzard. There was nothing else for them to eat, so they ate the pine needles and they usually aborted. As far as I know, it is only Ponderosa Pine needles that contain turpentine - and that is the major cause of aborting calves.

 

[mnmtranching]

We have thousands of pine trees in our pastures, all sizes. The only time the cattle will nibble on pine is Winter, then only if their hungry. I only problem I have with all the trees is, shading out the grasses.