New found marketing tool at Holstein auction.

[Sir Loin]

New found marketing tool at Holstein auction.

Long story short.
An old friend of mine called me and asked if I would spot for him at last night's Holstein auction as he was running late.
So I agreed and got there 2 hours early to inspect the cattle.

I was impressed to say the least.
IMO Holstein owner do a far better job in grouping their animals and have healthier animals then do beef producers.
After inspection around 800 head in their pens, I found only one steer with an eye injury.

What I did find different and unusual was that on all the inventory sheet handouts someone had marked 4 different lots with a hand written note: "ONE OWNER".
This was the first time I had ever seen this done.
And even the auctioneer made it a point to state they were "one owner" steers when they came in the ring.

I am defiantly going to put that one in my little bag of marketing tricks.
It amazes me how much information those two little words " ONE OWNER " conveyed.

Why didn't I think of that???????????
Who said you can't teach an old dog new tricks!!
SL

 

[dun]

Gee, how clever. Doing exactly what all the sale barns around have always done.

 

[TexasBred]

Those 4 lots probably belonged to the auctioneer. :lol2:

 

[AllForage]

Holstein owners do not do a better job at grouping their animals, it is the genepool. The entire genepool of holsteins trace back to only a handful or less of sires. Probably similar to 1930's Herefords. They are largely linebred for lack of a better term. Generally they grow and feed out very close and consistent. I would not give too much credit.

 

[Sir Loin]

AllForage

There is some truth in what you said, yes genetics does play a part in it all.
But that does not account for the pen uniformity as to size and amount of white or black, no botched castrations/banding, no injuries except for one, no runny noses or coughing, no scours, cross breeds by themselves etc etc which I would normally see at beef actions.
SL

As for:

Those 4 lots probably belonged to the auctioneer.

Could be!! But if he thinks it will help him get a better price, why not??
But I did get a little chuckle out of it when I first read it.
Reminded me of a used car salesman. The old story of " one owner" "old lady who only drove it to church on Sunday", thingee.

But after I thought about it, it made sense to me.
I'll use it!
SL

 

[AllForage]

Sir loin,

The amount of black and white is definitely close breeding in the genepool. Holstein steers here are a mainstream beef enterprise. I can go to any sale barn on a given night and watch hundreds go through like cookie cutters. The industry is very organized. it goes in basically 3 phases. Wet calf to 300 pounds, then 300 to about 900 pounds, and then 900 to finish that bounces around from 1200 to 1600 depending on what the packers are looking for. The no botched horns are from the skilled wet calf raisers and when done with an iron when they bud, a total rookie can do it. Remember you are dealing with a people friendly animal to a certain extent until you put that iron on it's head. The only thing you probably saw that I would not here is nice clean coats. Here Holsteins are kept in total filth and borderline abuse.

 

[TexasBred]

Sir loin,

The amount of black and white is definitely close breeding in the genepool. Holstein steers here are a mainstream beef enterprise. I can go to any sale barn on a given night and watch hundreds go through like cookie cutters. The industry is very organized. it goes in basically 3 phases. Wet calf to 300 pounds, then 300 to about 900 pounds, and then 900 to finish that bounces around from 1200 to 1600 depending on what the packers are looking for. The no botched horns are from the skilled wet calf raisers and when done with an iron when they bud, a total rookie can do it. Remember you are dealing with a people friendly animal to a certain extent until you put that iron on it's head. The only thing you probably saw that I would not here is nice clean coats. Here Holsteins are kept in total filth and borderline abuse.

How many holsteins have you bred, calved and raised.....the things you mention above just prove that dairymen know their business....as for the filth and abuse...I've never done it nor never seen it. I will admit it's hard to maintain a large herd of cattle in limited space...but abused cattle do not produce.

 

[AllForage]

Sir loin,

The amount of black and white is definitely close breeding in the genepool. Holstein steers here are a mainstream beef enterprise. I can go to any sale barn on a given night and watch hundreds go through like cookie cutters. The industry is very organized. it goes in basically 3 phases. Wet calf to 300 pounds, then 300 to about 900 pounds, and then 900 to finish that bounces around from 1200 to 1600 depending on what the packers are looking for. The no botched horns are from the skilled wet calf raisers and when done with an iron when they bud, a total rookie can do it. Remember you are dealing with a people friendly animal to a certain extent until you put that iron on it's head. The only thing you probably saw that I would not here is nice clean coats. Here Holsteins are kept in total filth and borderline abuse.

How many holsteins have you bred, calved and raised.....the things you mention above just prove that dairymen know their business....as for the filth and abuse...I've never done it nor never seen it. I will admit it's hard to maintain a large herd of cattle in limited space...but abused cattle do not produce.

I thought we were talking about holstein steers. I was part of the wet calf to 300 pounds part for about 2 years. Did it in batches of 15-20. That is what drove me to cow/calf and then to what I do today. It is a very depressing enterprise. Whether dairy men know their industry, sure they have created an animal that milks a lot. I will leave it at that. You have obviously never been to WI or seen a typical holstein barnyard feedlot. Standing room only and knee deep or higher in manure. I can go on. It helps me sell beef though. We obviously have very different opinions regarding cattle and I will leave it at that.

 

[Sir Loin]

AllForage

Re:

Standing room only and knee deep or higher in manure.

Yes I've seen it! And you have no body to blame except the environmental special interest groups and the Federal Government to thank for it!

What you should have said was: Standing room only and knee deep or higher in manure while standing on concrete all day and night.
If that's not a prescription for foot rot, I don't know what is!!
IMO, that IS cruelty to animals.

And this crap has just started to move into TN.
The carpetbaggers from the Fed. Government are here waving handfuls of money under every dairymen's noses begging them to take it and do it like WI so they can better compete.
Q. What will it take to put an end to all this environmental BS that is causing both people and animals to die needlessly?
SL

 

[kenny thomas]

Was this the holstein sale at Sweetwater?

 

[Sir Loin]

Re:

Was this the holstein sale at Sweetwater?

No, it was http://www.athensstockyard.com/.
And they will have another one on Dec 8. @ 7 PM

SL

 

[kenny thomas]

Thanks, got my dates mixed up.

 

[ozarkbulls]

Borderline "abuse" is the norm at most of the dairies around here. The one I work at I would consider "fair", as far as overall conditions, I've seen MUCH worse. It's all about pumping as much milk as possible, conditions be damned!
As far as the Holstein steers, some people just do a better job at raising them. I've seen some real "slop" try to go into the sale ring, and their price will reflect that.

I'm up to about 300 steers a year, wet to weaning. I have regular buyers put in requests for sizes, even color matching. (some want almost all black, some want "classic" color, some want almost all white) Genetics does play a role in the finished product, but a calf raiser with his head on straight deserves some credit too. I will NOT sell crap, especially since I deal with regular buyers, and my finished prices reflect that. I keep any "odd-balls" for myself and finish out for beef.
I do kinda like the "one-owner" line though.

 

[Goodlife]

AllForage

Re:

Standing room only and knee deep or higher in manure.

Yes I've seen it! And you have no body to blame except the environmental special interest groups and the Federal Government to thank for it!

What you should have said was: Standing room only and knee deep or higher in manure while standing on concrete all day and night.
If that's not a prescription for foot rot, I don't know what is!!
IMO, that IS cruelty to animals.

And this crap has just started to move into TN.
The carpetbaggers from the Fed. Government are here waving handfuls of money under every dairymen's noses begging them to take it and do it like WI so they can better compete.
Q. What will it take to put an end to all this environmental BS that is causing both people and animals to die needlessly?
SL

You lost me on this "Environmental BS" connection to cruel and inhumane corporate farms Sirloin. I am very environmentally minded and willing to fight anyone mistreating any animal, with cattle right at the top of that list. I have friends in the Deep Green Resistance that spend their lives preaching care for the environment with "sustainable living" as one of their main points. They are completely against large inhumane farms that mistreat animals beef, chicken and pork. Some of them may think everyone should be a vegetarian (which I have interesting discussions with) but many of them raise cattle for food and milk and insist it be done in a sustainable way that is also easiest on the animal.

So how do you equate environmentalists pushing towards a sustainable lifestyle with the most unsustainable and most environmentally harmful method of raising beef, these gathering grounds of manure that spoil the environment while being cruel to the animal?

 

[dun]

Do all of you equate mounds of composting manure as being filthy and cruel. When it's piled it drys and also gives off some heat and provides in rainy weather a dry spot for the animals to lay. May not be aesthetic but it far from filthy or cruel. The wet boggy manure that's hock deep is cruel and unhealthy.

 

[Sir Loin]

Goodlife

Re:

You lost me on this "Environmental BS" connection to cruel and inhumane corporate farms Sirloin.

Interesting you use the words "corporate farms". It almost sounds like you mean something derogatory.
Is there something wrong with someone incorporating as required by the Federal and State law to take full advantage of our investment, litigation and tax laws?

I see absolutely nothing wrong with being a corporation instead of an individual.

Re:

So how do you equate environmentalists pushing towards a sustainable lifestyle with the most unsustainable and most environmentally harmful method of raising beef, these gathering grounds of manure that spoil the environment while being cruel to the animal?

It is these environmental wacko's that have caused these "gathering grounds of manure that spoil the environment while being cruel to the animal".

For over 200 years we have pastured our cattle and brought them in for milking, and it worked just fine. Almost all manure and urine was deposited in the field by the cows as a bio-degradable material.
Then came the environmental wacko's with the EPA as their spokesman.
Hello Mr. cattleman, you can't pasture your cattle any longer, you are polluting our ground water, streams and rivers.
Here is a million dollars to build you a milking polar and a feedlot to feed and hold your cows.
Farmer: What about all that urine and manure?
EPA: OH, here's another ½ million to put in a concrete floor and a wash down system and a holding lagoon for all that urine and manure.
Farmer: What happens when the lagoon is full?
EPA: You simply pump it out into your manure spreader and spread it on your field, it's bio-degradable ya know.
Farmer: But why can't I just let my cows in the field and make their deposits there, as my grandfather and father and I have always done?
EPA: Oh no you cant do that because you MIGHT pollute the ground water and our rivers and streams, and besides, it's against the law.

Now Goodlife,

Which would you prefer, cattle depositing their urine and manure in a field, where it is going to end up any how, or cattle standing knee deep in it getting foot rot and dragging their teats in it before milking?

Some times the old way, is the right way.
SL

 

[Goodlife]

Goodlife

Re:

You lost me on this "Environmental BS" connection to cruel and inhumane corporate farms Sirloin.

Interesting you use the words "corporate farms". It almost sounds like you mean something derogatory.
Is there something wrong with someone incorporating as required by the Federal and State law to take full advantage of our investment, litigation and tax laws?

I see absolutely nothing wrong with being a corporation instead of an individual.

Re:

So how do you equate environmentalists pushing towards a sustainable lifestyle with the most unsustainable and most environmentally harmful method of raising beef, these gathering grounds of manure that spoil the environment while being cruel to the animal?

It is these environmental wacko's that have caused these "gathering grounds of manure that spoil the environment while being cruel to the animal".

For over 200 years we have pastured our cattle and brought them in for milking, and it worked just fine. Almost all manure and urine was deposited in the field by the cows as a bio-degradable material.
Then came the environmental wacko's with the EPA as their spokesman.
Hello Mr. cattleman, you can't pasture your cattle any longer, you are polluting our ground water, streams and rivers.
Here is a million dollars to build you a milking polar and a feedlot to feed and hold your cows.
Farmer: What about all that urine and manure?
EPA: OH, here's another ½ million to put in a concrete floor and a wash down system and a holding lagoon for all that urine and manure.
Farmer: What happens when the lagoon is full?
EPA: You simply pump it out into your manure spreader and spread it on your field, it's bio-degradable ya know.
Farmer: But why can't I just let my cows in the field and make their deposits there, as my grandfather and father and I have always done?
EPA: Oh no you cant do that because you MIGHT pollute the ground water and our rivers and streams, and besides, it's against the law.

Now Goodlife,

Which would you prefer, cattle depositing their urine and manure in a field, where it is going to end up any how, or cattle standing knee deep in it getting foot rot and dragging their teats in it before milking?

Some times the old way, is the right way.
SL

You are right and I agree with the poor use of the term "Corporate Farming". I have never liked that term but it is commonly used in the non-farming world to draw the mental picture of the concrete overcrowded manure ridden farm you and I both have a dislike for.

The rest is very interesting to me. I was not aware that the EPA was telling ranchers they could not allow manure to stay in the field. I have seen where they fined these large overcrowded collectives for allowing their huge amounts of liquid manure to run off into huge pools that become a caustic sludge then when the barrier breaks it runs off to form a terrible mess.

We are both on the same page Sirloin in that we both care for (no, Love) animals and the environment we live in. I agree that when cattle are properly apportioned to the amount of pasture the manure should be allowed to re-fertilize the pasture or be gathered into a pile like Dun brings up to compost. This is in fact environmentally friendly as it is organic fertilizer. When cattle are forced into overcrowded situations it gets bad for everyone, the cattle, the environment, and the consumer who ends up eating less healthy beef.

I was also not aware that the government was telling ranchers to stop pasturing their animals and bring them into concrete collectives! That shocks me. Not calling you a liar by any means, just never known anyone this happened to I guess. Have you seen this actually happen?

And from what I have seen in your posts, you are an environmentalist Sirloin. If the EPA is doing such crazy things as you suggest here, it seems we are both environmentalists that think the EPA is not protecting the environment or our cattle.

 

[AllForage]

AllForage

Re:

Standing room only and knee deep or higher in manure.

Yes I've seen it! And you have no body to blame except the environmental special interest groups and the Federal Government to thank for it!

What you should have said was: Standing room only and knee deep or higher in manure while standing on concrete all day and night.
If that's not a prescription for foot rot, I don't know what is!!
IMO, that IS cruelty to animals.

And this crap has just started to move into TN.
The carpetbaggers from the Fed. Government are here waving handfuls of money under every dairymen's noses begging them to take it and do it like WI so they can better compete.
Q. What will it take to put an end to all this environmental BS that is causing both people and animals to die needlessly?
SL

Sir loin,

I am glad we agree instead of some that jump to the conventional standard's defense always. But up here there is no Gov't money incentive keeping these steers locked up. Most of these folks crop anywhere from 40 acres up to a few hundred and could easily give them a 5 acre run. We are only told what to do by the DNR when it comes to spreading liquid manure, not dry pack. This stuff may be going on in other states, but here it is just plain disregard and ignorance of animal health. Confinement stall feeding came to this country with a lot of these ethnic groups and has never changed. Though they often admire grazing and admit it is the right way, they will never put forth the effort to change.

 

[Sir Loin]

Dun,
Re:

Do all of you equate mounds of composting manure as being filthy and cruel.

No! That is exactly why I let the manure and bedding build up in my calf pens.
I have no problem with manure mounds, particularly west of the Mississippi where the climate is dry.
Re:

May not be aesthetic but it far from filthy or cruel. The wet boggy manure that's hock deep is cruel and unhealthy.

I agree!
But we are talking about a soup mixture on concrete.
The problem is the acid in the urine and manure, which doesn't drain away, and the acid from the lime in the concrete softens the hoof and infection sets in.

SL

 

[TexasBred]

Sir loin,

The amount of black and white is definitely close breeding in the genepool. Holstein steers here are a mainstream beef enterprise. I can go to any sale barn on a given night and watch hundreds go through like cookie cutters. The industry is very organized. it goes in basically 3 phases. Wet calf to 300 pounds, then 300 to about 900 pounds, and then 900 to finish that bounces around from 1200 to 1600 depending on what the packers are looking for. The no botched horns are from the skilled wet calf raisers and when done with an iron when they bud, a total rookie can do it. Remember you are dealing with a people friendly animal to a certain extent until you put that iron on it's head. The only thing you probably saw that I would not here is nice clean coats. Here Holsteins are kept in total filth and borderline abuse.

How many holsteins have you bred, calved and raised.....the things you mention above just prove that dairymen know their business....as for the filth and abuse...I've never done it nor never seen it. I will admit it's hard to maintain a large herd of cattle in limited space...but abused cattle do not produce.

I thought we were talking about holstein steers. I was part of the wet calf to 300 pounds part for about 2 years. Did it in batches of 15-20. That is what drove me to cow/calf and then to what I do today. It is a very depressing enterprise. Whether dairy men know their industry, sure they have created an animal that milks a lot. I will leave it at that. You have obviously never been to WI or seen a typical holstein barnyard feedlot. Standing room only and knee deep or higher in manure. I can go on. It helps me sell beef though. We obviously have very different opinions regarding cattle and I will leave it at that.

Yessir I have seen Wisconsin dairy operations and yes, believe it or not dairy cattle are bred to produce milk and lots of it. Perhaps you need to come down and see some Texas dairy operations as well as their feedlot operations. Pretty impressive if I do say so. :cowboy: