Is It???

[I luv herfrds]

We have so much smoke here we can no longer tell if the sky is blue or if the stars still shine.
There is so much smoke that it is burning my eyes today. Too many dang fires. They should allow them to go in and harvest those trees instead of letting them burn. Can't harvest them even after they burn.

 

[jw]

It is really a shame, but to answer the question of what should be done would be getting into a political discussion and we all know what would happen then!!

 

[I luv herfrds]

I wasn't trying to start a political fight, I was just wondering if the sky was still blue or if everybody is being affected with smoke.
I miss seeing the stars at night or being able to see the northern lights on the nights they are down here.

jw just a little history, back in the 80's tress were about 20 per acre, they are now 200 per acre. That was the figure given to me back in 2005 at an S-290 and S-291 Crew and Engine boss fire fighting course. The "new" fire fighters are all for burning, but no logging. The "oldtimers" are for logging, there are now less oldies out there.
It makes me mad that they put people out of work.

 

[brownmule]

why are the burning the trees? to clear the land? yrs ago i read about a slash and burn procedure in Brazil.. now the tree huggers comming out LOL but it made me sad to think about the waste and the air affected... i just cant understand why some one would destroy the trees... timber is a big industry here second to coal mines . stripping the mts is a devastation for many yrs... if a managmnet plan is done and a good one its not as bad.. i know ppl have to work.. so no disrespect to any one who many be in the timber biz... we just have some shady loggers here that give everyone a bad name but i know you have that in every profession.. Rose

 

[I luv herfrds]

A majority of our timber industry has gone under due to the Roadless Act and tree hugger lawsuits. Yes I know people who lost their jobs because of that.
Let's not forget the tree huggers who would put metal spikes in trees and when a loggers chainsaw hit it would kick back and cause either an injury or it could cause a death. Which is worse a dead tree or a dead person?
What is wrong with logging out dead trees? That is a few thousand hours of fuel, per tree.
These fires were not planned.
Ask the Forset Service why they are allowing these trees to burn.

Now lets drop the politics. If you had read my last post you would realized I was just asking about the blue sky and the night stars because I can not remember the last time I saw them because of the smoke.

 

[Susie David]

Know how you feel....remember a few yars back the shy was balck with smoke from Spokane to Billings, probably farther east but Billings was my farest east stop. Had the lights on around Missoula and the ash covered the highway.
Dmc

 

[I luv herfrds]

I'm a night owl. I love looking up at the night sky and seeing all of the stars. Son loves setting up his telescope and looking at the moon, but that was blood red the last time I saw it.
I can't even see the Highwood and Bears Paw Mountains.

 

[jw]

Now lets drop the politics.

I wasn't trying to get a political thread started. What I was refering to was the way the decisions are made about the cutting and clearing. The ex-senator from North Dakota or from South Dakota, (I'm not sure which, he was the Senate majority leader for a long while, little fellow, always spoke real softly and undermined everything the President tried to do), anyway, he would not let the bills pass that would have allowed the logging industry to cut the trees or even clear out the dead ones. Then someone found out he had passed an amendment years before that allowed his state to do it.


That's what I meant by it getting political - in Congress, not on the boards.

THIS IS NOT MEANT TO BE POLITICAL...

 

[jw]

I remember now - it was Tom Daschel.

 

[MistyMorning]

Don't want to get into a heated debate on this guys, but I come at this from a little different perspective. My husband is an incident commander out there right now and you should know they don't make logging policy. Fire is a naturally occuring event and can be very productive for the long term viability of a forest. Logging also helps with regeneration and viability.

He has spent a career in this business and I can tell you that a fire burning in the trees is the one of the most dangerous. Their mission is to save lives, livestock and dwellings. Over the years he has done that. Cutting cattle and horses out of fencing to save them, having ranchers hug and cry with thanks and unfortunately sometimes in grief. It is a dangerous business and for those of us back home not so easy either. This year most of the guys out there are on their 3rd rotation that means almost the whole summer. Resources are depleted we need some RAIN. I am not a tree hugger, I live in Minnesota, burn wood, use toilet paper etc.

Just want you to know not all fire fighters are gun ho on the fire situation, most would rather see a planned burn not wildland fires (these are Dangerous!)

Sorry for the rant, just kinda worn out an miss the hubby

 

[Frankie]

Now lets drop the politics.

I wasn't trying to get a political thread started. What I was refering to was the way the decisions are made about the cutting and clearing. The ex-senator from North Dakota or from South Dakota, (I'm not sure which, he was the Senate majority leader for a long while, little fellow, always spoke real softly and undermined everything the President tried to do), anyway, he would not let the bills pass that would have allowed the logging industry to cut the trees or even clear out the dead ones. Then someone found out he had passed an amendment years before that allowed his state to do it.


That's what I meant by it getting political - in Congress, not on the boards.

THIS IS NOT MEANT TO BE POLITICAL...

Not meant to be politicial? :lol: :lol:

 

[Frankie]

Don't want to get into a heated debate on this guys, but I come at this from a little different perspective. My husband is an incident commander out there right now and you should know they don't make logging policy. Fire is a naturally occuring event and can be very productive for the long term viability of a forest. Logging also helps with regeneration and viability.

He has spent a career in this business and I can tell you that a fire burning in the trees is the one of the most dangerous. Their mission is to save lives, livestock and dwellings. Over the years he has done that. Cutting cattle and horses out of fencing to save them, having ranchers hug and cry with thanks and unfortunately sometimes in grief. It is a dangerous business and for those of us back home not so easy either. This year most of the guys out there are on their 3rd rotation that means almost the whole summer. Resources are depleted we need some RAIN. I am not a tree hugger, I live in Minnesota, burn wood, use toilet paper etc.

Just want you to know not all fire fighters are gun ho on the fire situation, most would rather see a planned burn not wildland fires (these are Dangerous!)

Sorry for the rant, just kinda worn out an miss the hubby

I hope he's home safely and soon.

 

[jw]

MistyMorning wrote:
Don't want to get into a heated debate on this guys, but I come at this from a little different perspective. My husband is an incident commander out there right now and you should know they don't make logging policy. Fire is a naturally occuring event and can be very productive for the long term viability of a forest. Logging also helps with regeneration and viability.

He has spent a career in this business and I can tell you that a fire burning in the trees is the one of the most dangerous. Their mission is to save lives, livestock and dwellings. Over the years he has done that. Cutting cattle and horses out of fencing to save them, having ranchers hug and cry with thanks and unfortunately sometimes in grief. It is a dangerous business and for those of us back home not so easy either. This year most of the guys out there are on their 3rd rotation that means almost the whole summer. Resources are depleted we need some RAIN. I am not a tree hugger, I live in Minnesota, burn wood, use toilet paper etc.

Just want you to know not all fire fighters are gun ho on the fire situation, most would rather see a planned burn not wildland fires (these are Dangerous!)

Sorry for the rant, just kinda worn out an miss the hubby


I hope he's home safely and soon.

Me too.

And without sounding like I'm flirting with you, I love your name.

 

[jw]

Not meant to be politicial?

You know I never get political. I'm always fair and balanced and my rants and ravings are always right!!!!

 

[MistyMorning]

You guys are great. Thanks for the support and keep up that good natured ribbing of each other I get a few chuckles out of it.

 

[I luv herfrds]

I have both friends and neighbors out there right now on these fires. I think about them every day, so you are not alone. If you had heard the first hand accounts I have from people who lost everything in a fire you would understand my true feelings for the FS.
Want to be scared? Have friend call you in the night and ask you where the nice you are. Ours did last year on the Derby fire wanted to know what to do because nobody from the fire IC was talking. Told them to pack what they could and be ready if they are given the order to evac. Gave them more info then the whole town was given in the last several days.
By the way I was over 200 miles away protecting a 250 square mile area.

 

[MistyMorning]

And without sounding like I'm flirting with you, I love your name.

Thanks jw, it was such an inspiration. :lol: I was sitting here on my computer trying to think of a good name for this forum and of course nothing came to mind. I looked out the window and saw a cow wonder by whos name is Misty Morning! :roll: Not too creative!

 

[MistyMorning]

I have both friends and neighbors out there right now on these fires. I think about them every day, so you are not alone. If you had heard the first hand accounts I have from people who lost everything in a fire you would understand my true feelings for the FS.
Want to be scared? Have friend call you in the night and ask you where the nice you are. Ours did last year on the Derby fire wanted to know what to do because nobody from the fire IC was talking. Told them to pack what they could and be ready if they are given the order to evac. Gave them more info then the whole town was given in the last several days.
By the way I was over 200 miles away protecting a 250 square mile area.

From what my husband tells me your situation is none to rare (resources get stretched thin and then there are always the crappy folks not doing their jobs) Do you go through this every year? We lived through a pretty scary spring fire season this year and with livestock and home it was scary and the way it looks now unless we get rain we are looking forward to the same this fall.

 

[MistyMorning]

you would understand my true feelings for the FS

Just one last thing from me on this then I'm gonna start a thread on funny kid and ranch/farm stories. I need some good laughs. Without saying a lot I think you and my husband could sit down with some frosty beverages and comiserate about that FS agency! No telling who could have a better? worse story!

Take care herfrds and have a great evening.

 

[I luv herfrds]

If it's whiskey I'll take ya up on that.
We have been lucky so far this year, no fires. Last year our worse one was 400 acres in winter wheat and pasture. Chickens missing their heads would discribe some of us. :lol: