Embryo Transplant

[SPJ]

I am thinking about doing embryo transplant on two of my cows. The embryos will be from Black Angus. Does anybody have any suggestions on where to get the embryos and how much they would cost? I have a place in Stillwater that will do the transplant. Thanks, Phil

 

[ANAZAZI]

Embryo transfers are not a motive only a means. First figure out what you want to do, then find a way to do it. Now you have a means, and ask us for the motive. What is your goal? Perhaps to introduce registered genetics safely?

 

[SPJ]

Embryo transfers are not a motive only a means. First figure out what you want to do, then find a way to do it. Now you have a means, and ask us for the motive. What is your goal? Perhaps to introduce registered genetics safely?

Anazazi - Thanks for your response. Just got off my tractor, I have been discing my pasture. So here is what I am trying to do: I would like to have 10 good registered black angus cows. Embryo transfers seems to be the most economical way to get those 10 cows. Here is the advantages, for me at least, I talked to Casey Butler today (he will do the transfer) and he said to bring a cow to their facility for 2 weeks would be between $100 - $130.00, and he had some guys locally that he could get some embryos from for about $200.00. When I take the cows to him, he will inspect them to make sure they will make good donor cows, which to me is a big plus. I have tail patches on them now, so I do not have to keep checking it, that part will be done for me. I AI'd the few cows that I do have, so these 2, I wont have to take off work to take them to the vet. I know there is a risk of it not taking, but I think I am going to give it a try at least once. Thanks, Phil

 

[blacksnake]

Here are a couple of suggestions concerning your possible ET work. First I would look at the donor cows that these embyros came from. Look at their production record. Look at their phenotype. Are they good structured momma cows? How are the udders? How is their docility? What is the sire of the embyros. Ask same questions about the sire or the dam of the sire. I consider ET work to be a long term investment and a lot of upfront thought and consideration should go into it. I personally think ET should only be done on the best and most proven cows and sires. Are you getting sexed embyros? are your recip cows suitable to raise a good calf. Unless you are getting heifer sexed embryos and both the dam and the sire are better than what you can get by AI ing your best cows, it may not be a good idea. Hopefully it will work out.

 

[SPJ]

Here are a couple of suggestions concerning your possible ET work. First I would look at the donor cows that these embyros came from. Look at their production record. Look at their phenotype. Are they good structured momma cows? How are the udders? How is their docility? What is the sire of the embyros. Ask same questions about the sire or the dam of the sire. I consider ET work to be a long term investment and a lot of upfront thought and consideration should go into it. I personally think ET should only be done on the best and most proven cows and sires. Are you getting sexed embyros? are your recip cows suitable to raise a good calf. Unless you are getting heifer sexed embryos and both the dam and the sire are better than what you can get by AI ing your best cows, it may not be a good idea. Hopefully it will work out.

I appreciate your post. Lot of good stuff. Casey is supposed to call me back and when he does, I will ask him your questions. The 2 cows that I am thinking about having this done to, I think are better than the 2 registered cows I have. Their calves seem to be the biggest and the best. Thanks again, Phil

 

[KNERSIE]

Embryo transfers are not a motive only a means. First figure out what you want to do, then find a way to do it. Now you have a means, and ask us for the motive. What is your goal? Perhaps to introduce registered genetics safely?

Anazazi - Thanks for your response. Just got off my tractor, I have been discing my pasture. So here is what I am trying to do: I would like to have 10 good registered black angus cows. Embryo transfers seems to be the most economical way to get those 10 cows. Here is the advantages, for me at least, I talked to Casey Butler today (he will do the transfer) and he said to bring a cow to their facility for 2 weeks would be between $100 - $130.00, and he had some guys locally that he could get some embryos from for about $200.00. When I take the cows to him, he will inspect them to make sure they will make good donor cows, which to me is a big plus. I have tail patches on them now, so I do not have to keep checking it, that part will be done for me. I AI'd the few cows that I do have, so these 2, I wont have to take off work to take them to the vet. I know there is a risk of it not taking, but I think I am going to give it a try at least once. Thanks, Phil

Only in theory

I'd rather suggest going to a reputable breeder and buying a few old, in calf cows, pamper them a little if needed and try and get 1 or 2 more AI calves out of them. That way you buy the breeder's very best proven genetics for little over salvage value.

 

[novatech]

I'd rather suggest going to a reputable breeder and buying a few old, in calf cows, pamper them a little if needed and try and get 1 or 2 more AI calves out of them. That way you buy the breeder's very best proven genetics for little over salvage value.

Exactly how I started to build foundation stock.

 

[Rahe Family Belties]

I have considered some ET in my herd but haven't pulled the string on it.

For my area in Illinois-
Flush cost on your cow is about $1000 if done on your farm. That is flushing and freezing combined.
If you buy quality embryos for $300-500 per embryo with no guarantee they will produce a live calf. I'm told you get about 1/3 stick. Recip cost will be in the $1000 neighborhood for a live calf at weaning.

With this you have about $1500-2000 in every weaned live calf.(Half are bulls unless sexed semen/embryos are used.)

I can find you good quality heifers for that kind of money.

Just something to consider. Good luck!

 

[SPJ]

Only in theory

I'd rather suggest going to a reputable breeder and buying a few old, in calf cows, pamper them a little if needed and try and get 1 or 2 more AI calves out of them. That way you buy the breeder's very best proven genetics for little over salvage value.[/quote]

Knersie - My problem is I have no experience so I would not know where to go to find a reputable breeder. That is why I thought the embryo transplant would be a better way. Thanks, Phil

 

[KNERSIE]

That's even more reason to find a reputable breeder, if you say where you are located I'm sure a few of the angus folks will point you in the right direction as far as reputable breeders go.

Buying old cows out of strong herds pretty much guarantee you are buying good cows that stood the test of time.

 

[SPJ]

That's even more reason to find a reputable breeder, if you say where you are located I'm sure a few of the angus folks will point you in the right direction as far as reputable breeders go.

Buying old cows out of strong herds pretty much guarantee you are buying good cows that stood the test of time.

I live in Choctaw, Oklahoma. Thanks, Phil

 

[deenranch]

Buy proven bloodlines... Don't chase fads.... Ask the breeder that you buy them embryos from if he will buy your bull calves, if you don't want them.... If he won't, then I'd think about buying from someone else. If he won't buy them then they may not be the best....

If I was to start over again, I would put embryos in my commercial cattle and build a herd that way. It is cheaper to do that, than buying top of the line cows and flushing them...