Economy

[Douglas]

Housing starts(edit housing permits) highest in 13 years. This is boom time in home construction. The main thing holding the economy from being better is labor shortages.

 

[Sostra]

Housing starts(edit housing permits) highest in 13 years. This is boom time in home construction. The main thing holding the economy from being better is labor shortages.

If you hear people insisting there is no bubble in housing, be certain there is one.

 

[TennesseeTuxedo]

Housing starts(edit housing permits) highest in 13 years. This is boom time in home construction. The main thing holding the economy from being better is labor shortages.

If you hear people insisting there is no bubble in housing, be certain there is one.

There's a bubble somewhere but I don't believe it'll be in housing this time.

 

[Brute 23]

We have seen nothing of an improved economy. Obama killed the coal industry and a company owned by the governor of West Virginia finished off the support industry. Jobs are very rare here.
And now many in the logging business are in bad trouble. Logs aren't bringing the cost of getting them out and to the sawmill.

Silicon Valley, Wall Street, and the oil fields seem to be doing OK. Fly over country not so much. Years ago many people would have migrated to greener pastures. What is happening today?

O&G is getting destroyed right now. Look up the stock prices for the E&P companies. Low oil and ng prices are contributing to a lot of the growth you are seeing.

 

[Stocker Steve]

Ya, smart money is moving from oil and hardware and financials to investing in the cloud. Should I sell my Apple stock?

 

[sim.-ang.king]

We have seen nothing of an improved economy. Obama killed the coal industry and a company owned by the governor of West Virginia finished off the support industry. Jobs are very rare here.
And now many in the logging business are in bad trouble. Logs aren't bringing the cost of getting them out and to the sawmill.

I'm no Obama fan but the economics of coal killed coal and no one is bringing it back. It's the Blockbuster of the energy sector.

Doesn't become very economical to use coal when it has to be railed in 1200 miles instead of burning the "dirty" coal in your backyard, and not burning the "dirty" coal has nothing to do with economics, but government mandates.
Oh, well, Southern IL will just ship it's coal to China...Makes a lot of economic, and environmental sense doesn't it?

 

[hurleyjd]

The median price of a home sold in 2019 was $236,900.
So to you ex bankers and mortgage brokers. What kind of income would a couple have to have to buy this house. How much would the insurance and taxes be on it. How much down payment is it 29% now. Now for a thirty year loan what would the cost be for owning this home be monthly.

 

[Brute 23]

We have seen nothing of an improved economy. Obama killed the coal industry and a company owned by the governor of West Virginia finished off the support industry. Jobs are very rare here.
And now many in the logging business are in bad trouble. Logs aren't bringing the cost of getting them out and to the sawmill.

I'm no Obama fan but the economics of coal killed coal and no one is bringing it back. It's the Blockbuster of the energy sector.

Doesn't become very economical to use coal when it has to be railed in 1200 miles instead of burning the "dirty" coal in your backyard, and not burning the "dirty" coal has nothing to do with economics, but government mandates.
Oh, well, Southern IL will just ship it's coal to China...Makes a lot of economic, and environmental sense doesn't it?

It doesnt matter how close you burn it to where you dig it or what mandates come from the govt, it take a huge amount of manpower to get the coal out of the ground and burned. Ng power plants use like 3 people... open the valve... close the valve. Ng is dirt cheap and there are huge fields in most of the US. No amount of deregulation is going to change that.

 

[hurleyjd]

I'm no Obama fan but the economics of coal killed coal and no one is bringing it back. It's the Blockbuster of the energy sector.

Doesn't become very economical to use coal when it has to be railed in 1200 miles instead of burning the "dirty" coal in your backyard, and not burning the "dirty" coal has nothing to do with economics, but government mandates.
Oh, well, Southern IL will just ship it's coal to China...Makes a lot of economic, and environmental sense doesn't it?

It doesnt matter how close you burn it to where you dig it or what mandates come from the govt, it take a huge amount of manpower to get the coal out of the ground and burned. Ng power plants use like 3 people... open the valve... close the valve. Ng is dirt cheap and there are huge fields in most of the US. No amount of deregulation is going to change that.

You forgot to add in the cost of removing all of the ash left over from coal that is an expense that you do not have with NG. The nation needs to be doing a Manhattan type of project for fission power instead of fusion that is used for our nuclear reactors.

 

[sim.-ang.king]

I'm no Obama fan but the economics of coal killed coal and no one is bringing it back. It's the Blockbuster of the energy sector.

Doesn't become very economical to use coal when it has to be railed in 1200 miles instead of burning the "dirty" coal in your backyard, and not burning the "dirty" coal has nothing to do with economics, but government mandates.
Oh, well, Southern IL will just ship it's coal to China...Makes a lot of economic, and environmental sense doesn't it?

It doesnt matter how close you burn it to where you dig it or what mandates come from the govt, it take a huge amount of manpower to get the coal out of the ground and burned. Ng power plants use like 3 people... open the valve... close the valve. Ng is dirt cheap and there are huge fields in most of the US. No amount of deregulation is going to change that.

Your equation doesn't include piping the gas to the plant, storing the gas in expensive tanks, the loss of BTU's, drilling manpower, pipe building manpower, and people to monitor it all along the way. That's more than 3 people.
I get it you like natural gas, and the government had nothing to do with anything.

 

[sstterry]

TVA, the nation's largest power utility, was transitioning away from coal and to Natural Gas long before Obama became president. I know this becase they began converting a coal plant 15 miles from me to NG in the early 2000's. Obama did not kill the coal industry. Technology and cleaner, more efficient and more renewable engery did.

 

[jltrent]

We lost a lot of coal mining jobs around here for sure. A lot of the old miners were broke down and bout on their last knees anyway. I think everyone of them got disability, black lung or better when it was all said and done. THey have new shinny big 4x4 diesels now that don't have mud all over them riding up and down the road.

 

[Brute 23]

Doesn't become very economical to use coal when it has to be railed in 1200 miles instead of burning the "dirty" coal in your backyard, and not burning the "dirty" coal has nothing to do with economics, but government mandates.
Oh, well, Southern IL will just ship it's coal to China...Makes a lot of economic, and environmental sense doesn't it?

It doesnt matter how close you burn it to where you dig it or what mandates come from the govt, it take a huge amount of manpower to get the coal out of the ground and burned. Ng power plants use like 3 people... open the valve... close the valve. Ng is dirt cheap and there are huge fields in most of the US. No amount of deregulation is going to change that.

Your equation doesn't include piping the gas to the plant, storing the gas in expensive tanks, the loss of BTU's, drilling manpower, pipe building manpower, and people to monitor it all along the way. That's more than 3 people.
I get it you like natural gas, and the government had nothing to do with anything.

My brother manages a huge portfolio of power plants that include coal, wind, solar, ng, and even diesel for a major power generating company. He has the cost comparisons down to every nut and bolt. The numbers are the numbers. It has nothing to do with my opinion on ng. It's just the reality... sorry.

... and yes... its like 3 people. Your gripe should be with automation if any thing... not govt regulation. :tiphat:

 

[Brute 23]

Doesn't become very economical to use coal when it has to be railed in 1200 miles instead of burning the "dirty" coal in your backyard, and not burning the "dirty" coal has nothing to do with economics, but government mandates.
Oh, well, Southern IL will just ship it's coal to China...Makes a lot of economic, and environmental sense doesn't it?

It doesnt matter how close you burn it to where you dig it or what mandates come from the govt, it take a huge amount of manpower to get the coal out of the ground and burned. Ng power plants use like 3 people... open the valve... close the valve. Ng is dirt cheap and there are huge fields in most of the US. No amount of deregulation is going to change that.

You forgot to add in the cost of removing all of the ash left over from coal that is an expense that you do not have with NG. The nation needs to be doing a Manhattan type of project for fission power instead of fusion that is used for our nuclear reactors.

That ash is bad stuff. Look at the msds sheet on it. It's full of arsenic. It's not supposed to be put any where the run off can make it to a water source and you definitely dont want to breathe the dust.

 

[sim.-ang.king]

It doesnt matter how close you burn it to where you dig it or what mandates come from the govt, it take a huge amount of manpower to get the coal out of the ground and burned. Ng power plants use like 3 people... open the valve... close the valve. Ng is dirt cheap and there are huge fields in most of the US. No amount of deregulation is going to change that.

Your equation doesn't include piping the gas to the plant, storing the gas in expensive tanks, the loss of BTU's, drilling manpower, pipe building manpower, and people to monitor it all along the way. That's more than 3 people.
I get it you like natural gas, and the government had nothing to do with anything.

My brother manages a huge portfolio of power plants that include coal, wind, solar, ng, and even diesel for a major power generating company. He has the cost comparisons down to every nut and bolt. The numbers are the numbers. It has nothing to do with my opinion on ng. It's just the reality... sorry.

... and yes... its like 3 people. Your gripe should be with automation if any thing... not govt regulation. :tiphat:

Don't really have a gripe with anything. I originally was pointing out the idiot idea that are coal was to dirt to burn here, so we ship it to China. Makes a lot of sense right?
If there was something I was going to gripe about, it's that in all of our solutions for lower emissions we don't include increased nuclear power. But it's scary...

 

[hurleyjd]

Doesn't become very economical to use coal when it has to be railed in 1200 miles instead of burning the "dirty" coal in your backyard, and not burning the "dirty" coal has nothing to do with economics, but government mandates.
Oh, well, Southern IL will just ship it's coal to China...Makes a lot of economic, and environmental sense doesn't it?

It doesnt matter how close you burn it to where you dig it or what mandates come from the govt, it take a huge amount of manpower to get the coal out of the ground and burned. Ng power plants use like 3 people... open the valve... close the valve. Ng is dirt cheap and there are huge fields in most of the US. No amount of deregulation is going to change that.

You forgot to add in the cost of removing all of the ash left over from coal that is an expense that you do not have with NG. The nation needs to be doing a Manhattan type of project for fission power instead of fusion that is used for our nuclear reactors.

I need to correct my post on Nuclear power should have been doing more for fusion and not fission. Fission is what is used now.

 

[backhoeboogie]

Fission is what is used now.

With heavy moderators, borated water etc. Fission is like Billiard balls.

 

[sstterry]

Goldman Sachs Prediction ( Doesn't mean the economy, but not good)

https://www.cnn.com/2020/02/20/investing/goldman-sachs-stocks/index.html

 

[1982vett]

The median price of a home sold in 2019 was $236,900.
So to you ex bankers and mortgage brokers. What kind of income would a couple have to have to buy this house. How much would the insurance and taxes be on it. How much down payment is it 29% now. Now for a thirty year loan what would the cost be for owning this home be monthly.

Not a banker, but step-son is in the process of buying/building a home in that price range now. It is going to take about $1825 a month to service a 20% down, 3.78% 30 year loan, taxes and homeowners association fees.....that is, until the true tax consequences are disclosed. I think they are underestimating those about $150 a month. So roughly $2000 a month in the Hutto, Texas area. Property tax rates are somewhere around 2.85%.

 

[Caustic Burno]

Get out more Hurley. Middle Tennessee is on fire with growth. I was in Austin not long ago, crazy busy area. Dallas is booming as is Houston (home office for the company I'm with).

I travel all over and I see tons of construction projects and help wanted signs in every town I visit.

Booming here as well building the I-69 corridor from Lufkin to Beaumont.
Houston now starts at Cleveland and goes to the other side of Katy.
You can't tell the difference from Galveston to Conroe for construction.
Just look at the SH 99 project.
https://www.txdot.gov/inside-txdot/projects/studies/houston/sh99-grand-parkway.html

The Ike Dike funding goes to congress next year.
"The U.S. Army Corps of Engineers and the Texas General Land Office released the first phase of a coastal protection study last month. Plans for the ambitious project, a complex 70-mile system running from High Island to the San Luis Pass, are still at least a decade away from completion. The corps and the land office expect to release a final study in 2021 before sending it to Congress to consider funding the project."