Durana clover, Bahia

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C HOLLAND

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I have a 6 acre field and plan to plant it in Oct with winter rye and Durana clover , My cows will be grazing in a Bahia field until then, and I will be feeding them Tifton9 Bahia hay ???? is will the Bahia wind up in my clover. Or will the clover smother it out during the fall and spring.

Thanks in advance for any help or advice.
 
Well the response was so good, maybe someone can tell me about another clover and how well it's doing for them. I am going to plant some with oats and may cut the oats for hay. Will this hurt the clover when I cut the oats off the field.
 
Thanks FR, I am planting both the oats and clover at same time, the field will be fresh tilled before I plant.
 
You should get to cut the oats before the clover really gets going. I sow ryegrass and white clover for silage and take 3 cuts per year on average. The clover begins to dominate towards the end of the season.
 
i think youre gonna get a little bahia in there no matter what. whether it comes through the cow or sneaky seedheads in the hay.
 
FR, Are you bailing the clover too, is it a good hay also. I am new to clover so dont mind my silly (not informed) questions.

and thanks for your response
 
I dont usually make hay, just clamp silage. The clover never really dominates to the extent that you would call it clover silage. I sow it with the grass to increase the protein content of the forage. It also provides some nitrogen of course as well as improving the quality of late season grazing.
I include clover in all my grazing leys also.
 
C Holland, Sometimes people just don't respond to a thread for one reason or another. I have had a few myself. Proably most likely, there are very few that have Durana. Mr Billy is the only one that I had any reports from. Below, I posted the site where we discussed it. I have not planted any Durana up to this point. This is what I know about it, so I may not be able to tell you what you need to know. I have read that it does extremely well in Alabama. It is short clover the first year, then after it becomes established, it grows agressively. It might stay short the first year with the Rye. If you are no tilling the field, I would say by the next year, the Durana would be showing up stronger. Mr Billy posted some pictures for us to see and he planted it along with Fescue. He said that it was growing over the Fescue. All of the studies that I have read say that it will take heavy grazing with cattle and will keep up with Bermuda grass. I am not sure how it would do with Rye. If I run across a study where they have planted it with Rye, I will send it your way.
Here is a thread where we discussed Durana Clover. Mr Billy sent a few sites and one was of his farm where he showed the growth of the clover on his place. After reading and seeing his pictures, I definitely decided to plant it this fall.

http://cattletoday.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=10902&highlight=durana+clover
 
Thanks Chuckie, I am going to mix it with everything I plant and see how it does. I have been looking at a bermuda grass also (CHEYENNE BERMUDA)for next spring and may drill it in a plot of clover after it has been grazed. I think the clover will be a good addition to any forage and help reduce the cost of fertilizer.
 
That was the direction I was headed in. I had considered the Cheyenne and started reading more about the hybrid bermudas. The hybrid produced so much more at a higher protein. On the University of Tennessee site, it reported that Vaughns on a field that had been established for four years around Paris Tenn., produced 8.5 tons to an acre. It said when they added clover to the bermuda, that the calves averaged 146 lbs more each. So by adding the clover, we get a savings on the fertilizer and a gain in the pocket when we sell.
I had been pricing the Cheyenne, and it was so high. I found it around $7.00 a pound, and it called for 15 lbs to the acre. I have been trying to find a source of the Vaughn's, but haven't located it yet. The UTK site says it cost $180 per acre to establish bermuda by sprigs. But my extension man said $750 an acre. Maybe he was telling me that it would cost me that much for the field I was going to plant it in. I am hoping that he mistunderstood my question or I misunderstood his answer. That seems extremely unprofitable and who in the heck would want to sell it for hay when you could sell sprigs for that much. I think we must of had our wires crossed at some point.
 
Chuckie, Even at 105.00 per acre to plant. it should pay back the investment in 3 cuttings of hay, (I think anyway) and if you add the clover when you plant it, that has to help save in fertilizer in the long run. I will share any info I find out on the clover and bermuda. One thing for sure,,,its not a short term return, but I am looking for whats to gain in the years to come.

Thanks for the response's
 
Chuckie: I have mowed the field today and plan to disk the end of next month and drill the seeds in (mix of clover and oats) Do I need to do anything to the field to help with weed control besides disk for now. I have not planted anything since corn 3 years back.
I also plan to use chicken litter for fertilizer and will fertilize next spring per advice from my soil sample I am sending to Auburn Univ.
 
I am sorry it has taken me a whiile to find this thread. I had a long response typed up this morning and hit the wrong key and lost the whole darn thing.

I like our fescue pastures into which we planted (drilled) Durana several years ago. Durana is a low growing clover and thus I wonder if, other than a source of nitrogen, will you get any benefit in the hay? A close relative called Patriot is a taller clover and MAY be better for haying? I would ask Auburn for this answer.

I worry about putting Durana into a field where a grass will shade out the clover seedlings. I would speak again to Auburn about this. We kept ahead of the curve by clipping the fescue to prevent this from happening, but if you plan to let the hay grow, there is going to be shading and clover loss will occur.

Durana is very aggressive in its first couple of years, I blamed it for reducing my fescue stand, but it seems to slow down and be less competitive after say the third year - at least our observation and that of others. I had asked Univ. Ga. forage people about drilling some fescue into the beds of clover where the fescue was no longer visible, and they advised against it because the clover was so aggressive that the fescue would not take. So competition is another question to ask Auburn - once you have a stand of clover like Durana, are you going to be able to drill in a winter rye or someother grass?

If you have a weed problem in the field in question, they you will have one in spades after planting the Durana. First, you can not use any herbicide from here on out that will not also kill the Durana. I have spend the last three summers spot spraying 70 A of the stuff and just keeping nettle in check. If I had thought this through first, I would have spent two years spraying for nettle and other weeds before I planted Durana - hindsight is a good teacher.

I planted Cheyenne last year, but due, again, to weed pressure that I thought I had taken care of, only 50% of the Cheyenne germinated because of severe shading. Pennington came out to take a look, and this year gave me free seed to plant in areas that did not take. It appears to be a fast growing grass once established.

I now have the dubious distinction of being the King of Weeds, for the Univ. of GA weed specialist just completed two test plots of herbicide combinations on parts of our Cheyenne field. I would prefer to be known for something else.

My final advice, get all the advice you can before you enter into this adventure. You've got one of the finest agronomy sections in the country at Auburn, so utilize them!!!!! And, then let us know what you find out.

Billy
 
Thanks Billy, You have made me stop and think now with what you have said, especially about the fact of no weed control after I plant the clover. I am sending in soil samples this week on all my pasture land and will ask more questions about what to plant with the clover and what type is best. I only have Bahia fields (WEED Havens) and want a better forage for my cows. This site is great for people like me to get the lessons learned from others and I do appreciate all the help I get. I am very new to this and do need lots of help and may even ask a stupid question on occasion.

I think I will plant the oats for now and concentrate on weed control of the 2 smaller fields next spring and then get the clover in next fall. I do want to get rid of the Bahia completely and replace with a Hybrid Bermuda. I may just plant clover only(next year) in my 2 & 5 acre field and in the new land being cut of timber and raked this fall.

Thanks again for all the info, My brain is in overdrive now.
 
C Holland, on preventing any weeds, that is a tough call. Since you are planting oats and clover both, either type of hebicide will get the other plant. If you use a grass type herbicide, it will get the oats. Then if you use a broadleaf herbicide, it wil get the clover. I would think that the cool weather will stop most of the weeds that will be showing up. The oats and clover will come up and continue to grow through the winter. The clover will not show much when it gets really cold, but the root system will be spreading underneath. I like the idea of the chicken litter. That will be great disked in. That will add nutrients to the soil. Feeding the soil, will benefit the forage greatly. Sounds like a really good plan.
Mr Billy, my extension agent talked to me about Patriot to be used with the bermuda. He also said it was much like Durana, but grew taller.
 

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