Cross breeding a mixed herd ???

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alabama

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A friend of mine that lives about a mile down the road has a herd of about 50 momma cows that are mixed with most being black and some red and some white cows. He has been running Angus bulls for as long as he can remember. He bought the place and the cows from his grandfather. They have been keeping heifers to replenish culling losses. He is trying to grow the herd and is currently developing 19 or 20 new heifers. About half of those heifers look like pure Angus and the other half are baldes with 2 red and 2 white heifers.
Well this year he needs a new heifer bull. He has two Angus bulls to breed the main herd but they are the sires of his heifer crop. He still wants to run an Angus bull on the heifers and I agree with that. But I think he needs to replace his oldest bull as he ain’t much of an Angus bull. His granddaddy bought him from me at weaning about 5 years ago knowing he was not much, but he was cheap.
So if he replaces this bull what bred should he buy to help cross up his cows and add pounds at weaning without having calving trouble. He told me yesterday that he can never remember having to have a calf pulled on his place.
 
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alabama

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TNMasterBeefProducer":16o0z2qv said:
I would have to say Gelbvieh or Salers. Salers cuz they calve easy, are small at birth, wean heavy, milk good, and docile. Same for Gelbvieh, usually small at birth, wean heavy, milk really good, and are extremely docile.

I don't know much about either bred but would like to learn more.
I should have also added thet he will be keeping the heifer calves from the bull. now, he was thinking Brangus bull but I am not so sure. It would add a little ear but not much to angus cows.
 

Engler

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Where at in Bama? Does he need a shot of ear or is he far enough north that it's ok to do without.

Second, what's the market he's shooting for? Is there a premium for (or how bad is the discount for not being right) color (black)? What about the ear?

If he wants to stay black I'd go with either a homo black, homo polled Simi or Gelbvigh (sp) or possibly go with a char if smokeys will work.

Either of the black breeds should add pounds and lay back in some good mommas behind them. He could have a bit of issues with chrome with the simi depending on what the bull is, but if there is enough time spent hunting for the right one not a problem.

The char will probably add the most pounds and muscle plus he should make all his calves white, gray or yellow giving consistancy from that standpoint, but with him being 1 of 2 in the pasture then you've got half the calves that are black and half white.

Additionally it sounds like he's getting/has his cow herd fairly uniform. If that is a goal then using the char cross heifers as replacements will get him back to a rainbow herd and calf crop. Moreover the char cross cows are USUALLY bigger mature females that need more feed and/or reduce stocking rate.
 

Beefy

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i think i'd go with a brangus. 3/16 ear wont hurt a thing. should get a uniform looking calf crop with the exception of maybe a few grays and w/fs
 

rouxshortorn

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I'd go with Shorthorn they have milk,meat and are docile, you can't go wrong with a breed that's been around for so long and has proven their cross-vigor with so many other breeds.
 

Jovid

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alabama":1nirclca said:
A friend of mine that lives about a mile down the road has a herd of about 50 momma cows that are mixed with most being black and some red and some white cows. He has been running Angus bulls for as long as he can remember. He bought the place and the cows from his grandfather. They have been keeping heifers to replenish culling losses. He is trying to grow the herd and is currently developing 19 or 20 new heifers. About half of those heifers look like pure Angus and the other half are baldes with 2 red and 2 white heifers.
Well this year he needs a new heifer bull. He has two Angus bulls to breed the main herd but they are the sires of his heifer crop. He still wants to run an Angus bull on the heifers and I agree with that. But I think he needs to replace his oldest bull as he ain’t much of an Angus bull. His granddaddy bought him from me at weaning about 5 years ago knowing he was not much, but he was cheap.
So if he replaces this bull what bred should he buy to help cross up his cows and add pounds at weaning without having calving trouble. He told me yesterday that he can never remember having to have a calf pulled on his place.

Red Poll....easy calving and early maturing will add several pounds at weaning plus the hybrid vigor.
 
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alabama

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Engler":ksbh9e4h said:
Where at in Bama? Does he need a shot of ear or is he far enough north that it's ok to do without.

Second, what's the market he's shooting for? Is there a premium for (or how bad is the discount for not being right) color (black)? What about the ear?

If he wants to stay black I'd go with either a homo black, homo polled Simi or Gelbvigh (sp) or possibly go with a char if smokeys will work.

Either of the black breeds should add pounds and lay back in some good mommas behind them. He could have a bit of issues with chrome with the simi depending on what the bull is, but if there is enough time spent hunting for the right one not a problem.

The char will probably add the most pounds and muscle plus he should make all his calves white, gray or yellow giving consistancy from that standpoint, but with him being 1 of 2 in the pasture then you've got half the calves that are black and half white.

Additionally it sounds like he's getting/has his cow herd fairly uniform. If that is a goal then using the char cross heifers as replacements will get him back to a rainbow herd and calf crop. Moreover the char cross cows are USUALLY bigger mature females that need more feed and/or reduce stocking rate.

He has made alot of improvements in the herd since he got it 3 years ago. This year he will be in a 3 month calving season and he hadd the vet school preg check and age this summer so he has culled alot and kept the best. He wants to sell on the video market and get out of the stockyard but not there yet.
I understand they had a Brama bull about 20 years ago but not much remains of him except a little ear.
Thanks for the advice so for.
 

Diehard40

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Did i just read on here that some one said choose Salers b/c they are docile?????????????????
Don't ever remember reading that any where.
I would personally run a Simmental before i would a Gelbvieh.
Both breeds have come a long way as far as birth weights go.
But i'd go with the simmy due in large part to increase in carcass quality.
 
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alabama

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Not many Gelbvieh in my area but from what I read they may work. They should keep the calves black too.
What sort of EPD' should I look for in Gelbvieh?
 

dun

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alabama":k8r2aff4 said:
Not many Gelbvieh in my area but from what I read they may work. They should keep the calves black too.
What sort of EPD' should I look for in Gelbvieh?

It will only keep the calves black if it's homozygous black. As to what to look for in EPDs, it depends on what the cow herd needs.
Got ot their wibsite and look around, http://www.gelbvieh.org/
 

andybob

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For heat resistance without 'ear', small calves, docility and a good dose of heterosis, try Tuli, there are breeders within reasonable distance of Alabama. For breed information, research and pictures try this link;
http://www.tuli.co.za/
The North American breeders association is on the links.
 

TB-Herefords

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The chose is clear; go with hereford. :D Herefords have come a long way with Birthweights and calving ease. Get some good line one genetics. The baldies will be black-the heterosis will make top calves. With the cows being mostly angus dominated you'll produce some great replacments and and amazing steers. Which case the steers will fall in either both CAB and CHB brands. I think we could all say our personal breeds excell in Calving ease; BW WW milk and very docile. In the end it depends on how well you are at choosing your bull. How selective you want to make your market.
 

Jake

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Key to profit in small operations in uniformity of genetics. Uniformity comes most easily in color and weight; so the easy thing to do is to go with a brangus or braford bull.

Your going to get either majority black calves with a few baldies and those few smokies if you go with the brangus.

If you go with the Braford you going to get baldie calves a few red baldies and then some high yellow baldy calves.

Look like Brangus would be the way to go in a round about way of getting there, just thinking out loud to hopefully help clarify.
 

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