Calf Pulling Rule of thumb

[Ellie May]

Now calm down I ain't tryin' to start an arguement. I'm trying to finish one. Naw just jokin'. It's like arguein' with a Democrat or an Agus breeder. Their is no way & if their was I wouldn't be here. They get so hard headed about their beliefs they can't help themselves. Most of them about 70% of them wait about 80% of them.
Ellie May

 

[jcarkie]

most calves i have seen born had their tongue out. if it is swelled it is a problem.

 

[D.R. Cattle]

Ellie, help us out and use a nice looking hereford bull or something for your avatar.

 

[PATB]

Posted: Fri Mar 12, 2004 5:48 pm Post subject:

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Ellie, help us out and use a nice looking hereford bull or something for your avatar.

Ellie that things looks like something the city folk would shoot as deer in this neck of the woods. You better keep it out of sight during hunting season or some city folk will try to tag it.

 

[shorty]

We try to be there for all heifers but sometimes we're not , this year we calved five heifers and had to pull one , it was a big bull calf and the feet weren't coming out together so we straightened them out and helped , ti took two us all we had to help her get it out, she was down for about an hour after, so we mixed up a colostrum pack ( I always keep some on hand especially when I have heifers to calve) and gave it to him , till she got up we had cleaned him off but she came right over and started licking him , it took us four days though to get her to let him drink, out of the five heifers we calved we had three that we weren't there for right away , we were just lucky that we were there for the one that needed our help. When do see both feet coming we wait about an before helping but when something isn't right we will help sooner

 

[Ellie May]

Good Gosh. If people are that stupid to not tell the difference between a llama & a deer. What has this world come to??
Ellie May

 

[Ann Bledsoe]

It's not so much that they can't tell the difference, Ellie, it's that they don't take the time to identify their target! Too many "weekend warrior"-type hunters out there who will shoot at anything that moves.
One of the best Miniature Jersey bulls of current time (34" tall) was shot and killed a couple of years ago by a deer hunter.
How anybody could claim that they mistook a mature bull (even one that small) for a deer, is beyond me. He didn't look anything like a deer, it had to be a case of shooting before the target was properly identified.

Ann B

Good Gosh. If people are that stupid to not tell the difference between a llama & a deer. What has this world come to??
Ellie May

 

[dun]

A cowboy is standing next to his dead horse and says to a hunter,"I agree it's your deer, but can I get my saddle off of it?"

dun

It's not so much that they can't tell the difference, Ellie, it's that they don't take the time to identify their target! Too many "weekend warrior"-type hunters out there who will shoot at anything that moves.
One of the best Miniature Jersey bulls of current time (34" tall) was shot and killed a couple of years ago by a deer hunter.
How anybody could claim that they mistook a mature bull (even one that small) for a deer, is beyond me. He didn't look anything like a deer, it had to be a case of shooting before the target was properly identified.

Ann B

Good Gosh. If people are that stupid to not tell the difference between a llama & a deer. What has this world come to??
Ellie May

 

[Anonymous]

Ann, sometimes its just city raised idiots out hunting for the first time. I've got a good female friend that, some years ago, took her new boyfriend out for a deer hunt in the east Texas woods, where her dad raised registered red Brahmans. She was able to stop him just as he was drawing a bead on a "real big deer" that was in fact a young red Brahman calf! That boyfriend is the type that only knows that milk comes from stores. Arnold Ziffle

 

[Ann Bledsoe]

I know what you mean, a guy from Lincoln, NE shot a cow elk during deer season a few years ago. The funniest thing about it was that elk are so rare in this area that Game & Parks tagged it as a deer! It wasn't until he was getting ready to butcher the thing out that he found out what he had. He called on a neighbor for help -- that neighbor happened to be a Deputy Sheriff who elk hunts in neighboring states. Guy ended up having the carcass confiscated and was given a stiff fine -- and Game & Parks officials were given a quick course on the identification of the various species of deer, especially those that are not common in this area and are illegal to kill.

Ann B

Ann, sometimes its just city raised idiots out hunting for the first time. I've got a good female friend that, some years ago, took her new boyfriend out for a deer hunt in the east Texas woods, where her dad raised registered red Brahmans. She was able to stop him just as he was drawing a bead on a "real big deer" that was in fact a young red Brahman calf! That boyfriend is the type that only knows that milk comes from stores. Arnold Ziffle

 

[PATB]

Out of state hunters have tried tagging horses, holstien cows and occaisional moose as deer. Goats, lamas and elpacas are in danger every deer seaon around here. It is sad to see horses and other farm animals with blaze orange vest or tape on them during deer season.

 

[SPRINGER FARMS MURRAY GRE]

I heard tell once of a couple of city fellers that shot a farmers two mules and actually tried to check them as "mule deer"..... go figure :cboy:

 

[Ann Bledsoe]

We actually had a hunter try to take one of our domestic turkeys in our BACKYARD last year!

A few years ago we had the intent to raise Royal Palm turkeys (white with black markings -- originally just a varient color phase of the Eastern Wild Turkey). That spring when the hens were old enough to breed, 2 Wild Turkey toms jumped the fence and pretty much moved in. They appeared to be Rio Grande/Merriam crosses, the favored cross for release in this area -- which would explain why they were so comfortable here, not at all afraid of people.
Since then, all the offspring have been Wild hybrids. Those original Wild toms are long gone (one was the victim of a dog attack and the other left shortly after), but they left behind a beautiful flock of domestic Wild-type turkeys that require no permits since they were produced by domestic hens.

Well this fool thought that since he had a turkey permit that he could just come into our yard and shoot the "Wild Turkeys". He sure didn't like hearing that it would cost him $30 to buy the bird, and he wasn't going to shoot it here! He actually tried to turn us in to Game & Parks for "interfering with a lawful hunt"!!! You can imagine how far that went since in this state it is unlawful to hunt on private land without permission AND unlawful to use a firearm within 200 ft of an inhabited dwelling or occupied livestock pen. He would have been less than 50 ft from both.

Some people just don't have a clue -- and unfortunately, they make things so much harder for those of us that hunt the right way. Because of fools like that, I'm having a heck of a time finding a place to deer hunt with muzzleloader or crossbow (city has expanded and swallowed up our old hunting grounds). Everybody I've talked to has a horror story of livestock being shot or let out on the highway, bullets going through their house or car, etc. Most folks are so upset over previous incidents that they won't take a chance on somebody new.

AnnB

 

[Ellie May]

Well I have nothing aqainst hunters, they can be for the good they keep the deer population down & eat the meat. But I hate it when they go gun crazy. We've had so many accidents around here with stupid hunters it ain't funny. I sometimes think the guns are smarter then the hunters. I just wish the guns would be put in better hands.
Ellie May

 

[sillco]

No one wins an argument with a fool!

dun

This is abysmal, get F-1 hereford-brahmans, you will have much much less calving difficulty.

Generaly,

30 minutes after the water bag shows i the feet haven't should up yet.
60 minuutes after feet start showing

0 minutes after the calves tounge sticks out (lack of air), once the head shows, if the calf doesn't continue out it's time to help

give the following a read

http://muextension.missouri.edu/xplor/a ... g02007.htm

dun

Now Dun, she is right about the Brahman influence. The Brahman influence will reduce your maintenance cost and will more then offset the dock at the sale barn, if any. My 25 years experience only gave me about six opportunties to assist a cow in calving using Brahman influenced cattle, mostly registered Brangus but for the first 6 years befort that commercial Brahman cross (Herford or Angus cross with Brahman). They are hard to beat for hardyness and are "good doing kind" of cattle.

 

[dun]

The point was that any one breed won't solve all problems everywhere. Adding Brahman to a succesfull program just doesn't make sense, especially when it comes to the dock. Also, if the do in fact wean a heavier calf there going to eat more, if your forage base isn't very flexible you'll end up having to haul some of those Brahman X cows to the sale barn. They're about the only thing that gets killed worse at sales then straight bred Herefords or sheep.

dun

No one wins an argument with a fool!

dun

This is abysmal, get F-1 hereford-brahmans, you will have much much less calving difficulty.

Generaly,

30 minutes after the water bag shows i the feet haven't should up yet.
60 minuutes after feet start showing

0 minutes after the calves tounge sticks out (lack of air), once the head shows, if the calf doesn't continue out it's time to help

give the following a read

http://muextension.missouri.edu/xplor/a ... g02007.htm

dun

Now Dun, she is right about the Brahman influence. The Brahman influence will reduce your maintenance cost and will more then offset the dock at the sale barn, if any. My 25 years experience only gave me about six opportunties to assist a cow in calving using Brahman influenced cattle, mostly registered Brangus but for the first 6 years befort that commercial Brahman cross (Herford or Angus cross with Brahman). They are hard to beat for hardyness and are "good doing kind" of cattle.

 

[cherokeeruby]

Thanks Silico, nice to have a few reasonable people on the board.

Dun they may eat more to raise the heavier calf but it is low quality forage. They pretty much eat whatever is in front of their face when they are grazing. Will eat stuff Bos Tarus will pass up. Also they do not use as much of their intake to generate body heat. They do get cold in the winter. They are not suitable for climates with severe winters. But on the flip side they relish heat, will be out it the pasture eating and breeding at 110.


Texas A&M has studied the calving issue of Brahmans for decades. They still don't know how they do it but the Brahman female regulates the size of the calf and this benefit carries over to the F-1.

Tried to find the article on that subject on the A&M website but was unsuccessful.

 

[dun]

When we ran cows in the desert we used Brahman influence cattle, they did well. In this environemtn where the quality of forage is generally good to very good, even the poor stuff is at least as good as the good stuff was thre, what's the advantage.
The study I read a while back claimed that Brahman sired calves were harder birthing then calves from Brahman cows.
The point still is, no one breed has properties that apply everywhere. I see no difference in the grazing during the heat between my Red Angus influence (and registered), and the neighbors gerts. But our girls come out of bad winters in better condition then his gerts. His weaning weights are in the same ballpark as ours, maybe a tick higher but his cows weigh 200-300 lbs more then ours. He doesn't market his weaned calves locally. They get shipped to areas that buy eared feeder cattle without the dock. One more expense that we don;t have.
If I was raising cows strictly for funzzies and didn't care about the dollars I would have a herd of straightbred Gyr.

dun

Thanks Silico, nice to have a few reasonable people on the board.

Dun they may eat more to raise the heavier calf but it is low quality forage. They pretty much eat whatever is in front of their face when they are grazing. Will eat stuff Bos Tarus will pass up. Also they do not use as much of their intake to generate body heat. They do get cold in the winter. They are not suitable for climates with severe winters. But on the flip side they relish heat, will be out it the pasture eating and breeding at 110.


Texas A&M has studied the calving issue of Brahmans for decades. They still don't know how they do it but the Brahman female regulates the size of the calf and this benefit carries over to the F-1.

Tried to find the article on that subject on the A&M website but was unsuccessful.

 

[cherokeeruby]

Gyr are pretty, but there are lots of faults with them. If I was rich would run some just to look at them.

Agree with you. Brahmans have there place as well as all the other breeds.

Brahman sires over Bos Tarus cattle that throw big calves is a disaster waitng to happen. Brahman cows can have just about any sire's calves. Would stay away from Simmental on heifers.