Bermuda grass experiment

[Bigfoot]

I found this forum last winter looking for a warm season grass that would work in Ky. I have spent lots of time sifting through the information here trying to find a variety that would work in my area. I intended to plant 20 acres or so back in may. I eventually talked myself out of doing, mostly from pm's from people on here. I have decided to go much smaller scale, and actually follow through despite my total inexperience with Bermuda. I am going to turn my garden in to a test plot. I am sick of fooling with it anyway, and I can irrigate it.

Things I've learned here:
1. Sprigged varieties are better than seed varieties
2. High nitrogen requirements
3. Some varieties are patent protected for lack of a better word
4. Most varieties are not cold tolerant
5. Sprigs don't last long-----they need to be planted soon after gathering


My plan:
1. Turn my 30 x 50 garden into a test plot
2. Plant two varieties, that I can harvest my on sprigs from
3. Keep the broadleaves out, and keep watered and fertilized
4. Stay the course for two years


What I need to know from you guys:
1. Are the varieties Vaughn's # 1, world feeder, midland 99, and wrangler protected varieties. In other words can I just up and plant them.
2. If I can plant any of them, which two do you recomend
3. Which are seed varieties, and which can start from sprigs
4. And how in the bajebas will I get sprigs from where they are to my place
5. Where would sprigs even be available from, especially on this small of a scale
6. My understanding is that my tobacco setter can be used to plant sprigs, you guys down south may not know the answer to this one

 

[Beefy]

i dont know anything about the cold tolerance of bermuda in kentucky or the varieties mentioned, but word of caution--if you even remotely think you might ever want to have a garden there again someday, bermuda is really hard to get rid of.

 

[novatech]

High Nitrogen requirements. Some verities are more nitrogen efficient than others. Meaning they are able to take up more and the result is higher protein grass. Protein is highly correlated to nitrogen. You can grow bermuda with the same amount as any other grass would take but the protein content would be the same. I hope I am saying this right.
The patient protection only applies to selling it, I think.
Keep the sprigs cool and damp they will last longer, but the fresher the better. I can't tell you about the varities you mentioned but I have had Tifton 85 sprout from hay over 2 months out of the field.
I started my Tifton nursery from sprigs cut from under a fence line. I planted them with a mattock.
If your garden has the same type of soil as you pasture the the experiment will work. If not the results may change when planted into a soil that is different. As an example Tifton 85 grows and spreads very well in sandy soil but in clay Jiggs works better.

 

[Isomade]

I can save you some time. Just plant the Mid 99. It has the same production levels as coastal but is more cold tolerant than the other sprigged varieties.

 

[ga.prime]

if you even remotely think you might ever want to have a garden there again someday, bermuda is really hard to get rid of.

Exactly what I was going to say.

 

[tsmaxx47]

i dont know anything about the cold tolerance of bermuda in kentucky or the varieties mentioned, but word of caution--if you even remotely think you might ever want to have a garden there again someday, bermuda is really hard to get rid of.

i would never plant bermuda grass in any area i planned to garden. you will need a full time gardener to try to keep it controlled.........

 

[greybeard]

i dont know anything about the cold tolerance of bermuda in kentucky or the varieties mentioned, but word of caution--if you even remotely think you might ever want to have a garden there again someday, bermuda is really hard to get rid of.

Maybe not. After he gets all the sprigs he wants from the bermuda, he could turn about 1/2 doz hogs in on his former garden, then follow with about 20 chickens-- then do a chemical burndown--he might have a chance at a few tomato vines the next year.

 

[Bigfoot]

Thanks for the help. From research I have found that none of tiftons are cold tolerant enough for my area. Also the garden, or this test plot for that matter could be moved any where. I chose the location because I can keep it irrigated.

If the mid 99 is a known cold tolerant variety, then I have a few questions about it in particular:
1. Is it patent protected
2. I'm only slightly familiar with propogating it vegetatively. If I take a runner, with out a section of root attached to it, and plant it, say an 8 inch piece with half below the surface, and half above, will it take root and grow?
3.assuming this method will work. How long before my test plot will yield some sprigs? It would seem to me that if the test plot worked, the heat of the summer would be here before I could transplant any sprigs. Wouldn't it be best to continue to nurse and baby the test plot until the next spring?

 

[Banjo]

Thanks for the help. From research I have found that none of tiftons are cold tolerant enough for my area. Also the garden, or this test plot for that matter could be moved any where. I chose the location because I can keep it irrigated.

If the mid 99 is a known cold tolerant variety, then I have a few questions about it in particular:
1. Is it patent protected
2. I'm only slightly familiar with propogating it vegetatively. If I take a runner, with out a section of root attached to it, and plant it, say an 8 inch piece with half below the surface, and half above, will it take root and grow?
3.assuming this method will work. How long before my test plot will yield some sprigs? It would seem to me that if the test plot worked, the heat of the summer would be here before I could transplant any sprigs. Wouldn't it be best to continue to nurse and baby the test plot until the next spring?

I'll offer my 2cents...........Wrangler can be seeded. I have heard of people frost seeding it with success. Whatever you plant, when it got up about knee high, cut it and put it in a manure spreader and spread it where you want to plant it you would need to partially incorporate it in with a disc,or bale it then spread it over your area.

 

[hurleyjd]

http://extension.missouri.edu/publicati ... px?P=g4620

 

[shaz]

High potash requirements.

Lots of people planted Vaughn around here but none lately and my guess would be potash price but we tend to have low potash and high phosphate in this area.

 

[dun]

The most popular bermuda in this area is wrangler. I know that it's winter hardy in this area. I don;t know if the reason it's the most popular is becuase it can be drilled rather then having to use sprigs.

 

[Bigfoot]

http://extension.missouri.edu/publications/DisplayPub.aspx?P=g4620

I read that. Thanks for the link. I am convinced I want the midland 99. I see no reason why my tobacco setter want do the job, especially if some people establish it by hand covering---------------------Now the big question. Using the tobacco setter should allow me to use a lot sLess prigs to the acre than just spreading sprigs and discing. I know it's usually sold by the bushel, but I will only need 400 sprigs, and my tobacco setter to plant them. That would be planting a sprig every 2 feet in 24 inch rows Where can I purchase a quantity that small, and can they survive shipping. My gut tells me they want survive shipping.

 

[highgrit]

Use a front end loader bucket to harvest your sprigs out of your test plot. I cut about 2-4 inches deep with the bucket. Go dump the bucket where you want to establish your field in the early spring and disk it in. After disking in, rolling or cultipacking seems to help but is not needed. I used 2 dump truck loads, about 10-12 yards is my guess. The next spring I disked the field up good and drug it simi flat. Before I started sprigging I did a soil sample and added lime and fertlized as needed. I did a 10 acre field this way 4 years ago with coastal and its averaging 4 - 4x5 rolls per cutting this year. It takes awhile but it works, all you need is rain in the spring, Good Luck

 

[Bigfoot]

Does anyone know if upending one stolon 8 inches long with half of it pegged in the ground, and half of it sticking straight up will take root and grow. If it will I am set up to plant as much as I want from my test plot. I just need 400 stolons to start from, and a year to see how they do in the summer, and survive the winter.


Also Joogephus if you ever read this I saw an old thread where you let your Bermuda spread by spraying round up beside of it. I can plant mine in perfect 6 foot strips if the tobacco setter will work for that. How much space should I allow between 6 foot strips for it to fill in the gaps. The crappy Bermuda in my yard, can travel about a foot ever two weeks into my flower beds if I don't spray a foot wide path around them.

 

[Beefy]

do you know any hay producers around that grow any of these varieties? i'm guessing not, or else youd have some idea of how they perform in your area. but for an area as small as your test plot i'd just make a buddy and ask if you can have or buy some runners to experiment with. wouldnt take long to pull up enough runners to sprig that area by hand. and you could cut up the runners (which likely would have a good many roots already) into smaller plants as you go. i prefer to plant mine horizontally b/c they can spread right away rather than growing up and over and then down and out.. but i dont see why yoru method wouldnt work if you got enough nodes in the ground. packing seems to be the key here and of course rain. will you be irrigating your non-testplot when you establish it??

 

[Banjo]

Bigfoot,

You mentioned you had a tobacco setter so I would assume you know all about tobacco. I grew it all my life untill a couple of years ago. I was wondering why you couldn't get you a bag of bermuda seed....to the best of my knowledge it is pelleted about the size of pelleted tobacco seed, and a seeder and make you a floatbed and seed your own sprigs. The trays are about 200 or 242 cells per tray. Grow it just like tobacco plants..........something to think about.

 

[Bigfoot]

Banjo,

According to what I've read, and once again I have NO first hand knowledge. The better hybred varieties don't produce seed, or atleast not much if they do. My first choice would be Vaughn's # 1, but I think it's protected. That leaves the mid 99. It's sprig only. Yes, I raised tobacco for years. Dark only, 16 acres. I quit with the buy out. I wish the government had put us on reservation some where. I am lost with out. Especially this time of year. I'm not going to raise it for the companies. I would pick crap with chickens to put food on the table before I did that. Side note raised the 16 acres with out hiring help, except a couple young guys housing.


Beefy,

To the best of my knowledge nobody around me raises. The land grant university did a little research 7 or 8 years ago. The mid 99 was one of 4 varieties that survived the winter. Coupled that with Isomades advice and settled on it. I've sent some emails to the university folks. I doubt they have any more info than is available online already. There reputation and mine are exactly the same. You know their out there, but nobody has ever seen one.


I may be chasing my tail, but I've got it in my jinormous thick head that 20 acres of Bermuda will let me stock pile enough fescue to make it to Christmas with out feeding hay.------on a year it actually rains.

 

[Beefy]

a fellow i know who lives nearby has some chickenhouses and he has test plots of different types of bermuda ( i live about 25 minutes from Tifton however) for the university. you may want to inquire about that, having test plots. if no one is raising near you and they are interested in doing tests in your area you might be able to work out a neat little deal...

 

[Walker]

I sprigged about 4 acres of Vaughn's in the last part of July. I put the sprigs in a dump trailer, and had my wife drive me around while I "strowed" the sprig's like straw. Though we didnt get any rain for 8 days it seem's to be takin off.