I got a flyer from Schaff Angus Valley with all their bulls bismark, record harvest, etc. I was surprised that most of the 205 weights were 800-1000 lbs with alot of them 900+ looking at genex they had alot of high weights to for angus. That seemed really high since I have been looking at a lot of gelbvieh bulls and their are not that many with weights that high on bull barn. Have angus caught up that much in the growth department?
Angus Bulls weigh more than Continentals.
- Thread starter bmoore87
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ALACOWMAN
Well-known member
. creep fed..Pesonaly I'd be more impressed seeing 750+ on moma and grassbmoore87":6y56lllc said:
Agree with ya on the grass raised. I assumed that both the gelbvieh and angus would be creep fed. Just surprised that so many of the angus were higher especially since gelbvieh are known for high ww.
The gains per day for SAV Bruiser with a 72 bw and 1032 ww comes out to about 4.68 per day from birth on. I think their are calves coming in the yard at 6-700 that cant do that.
The gains per day for SAV Bruiser with a 72 bw and 1032 ww comes out to about 4.68 per day from birth on. I think their are calves coming in the yard at 6-700 that cant do that.
Nesikep
Well-known member
One of the gelbvieh breeders I know has range cows, and some of his mommas come back with 800 lb'ers.. no supplements... My better cows will get well into the 700's on grass alone.
When I start to see much over 800 lb 205 day weights i'll only use those to compare from the same ranch, because they must be feeding them drastically different.. I'm thinking LOTS of grain and goodies, in other words LOTS of extra expenses that no normal cattle producer would ever be able to justify.
My 11 month old bull is somewhere around 1000lbs I think, I think he looks really good, meaty and well built, but not fat.. Again, seeing these 1400 lb yearling weights sure makes me wonder about the feed.. I'm quite happy if I get 3 lbs a day gain consistently.. when it's getting into the 4-5 lb range for a year there's gotta be some tricks being played.
When I start to see much over 800 lb 205 day weights i'll only use those to compare from the same ranch, because they must be feeding them drastically different.. I'm thinking LOTS of grain and goodies, in other words LOTS of extra expenses that no normal cattle producer would ever be able to justify.
My 11 month old bull is somewhere around 1000lbs I think, I think he looks really good, meaty and well built, but not fat.. Again, seeing these 1400 lb yearling weights sure makes me wonder about the feed.. I'm quite happy if I get 3 lbs a day gain consistently.. when it's getting into the 4-5 lb range for a year there's gotta be some tricks being played.
plumber_greg
Well-known member
Not always, look at the gains stockers, for instance, get on the grass in the Flint Hills. The grass in Montana will put more gain on than the grass in NW Mo. Your grass, or the GV breeder you're talking about, may be very different. gs
I would take 700 on grass any day. Environment can play a large part but getting those large of gains even with great grass seems tough.
In general the angus weighed more than the gelbvieh ai bulls online that I would guess get some creep also so i would think they should both be comparable.
In general the angus weighed more than the gelbvieh ai bulls online that I would guess get some creep also so i would think they should both be comparable.
TexasBred
Well-known member
It's not tough....just very expensive to create big numbers.bmoore87":27x5yho6 said:
mwj
Well-known member
If it is only feed making those fast growing cattle, where are the rest of them? There are a lot of small purebred breeders that can afford all the feed there cattle can eat! Those big calves are never short on nutrition but they have to have the genetics also.
TexasBred
Well-known member
Some chose to do it "right" and let the calf reach weaning age on mother's milk only along with grazing. Others, thinking they'll impress everyone, pour the feed to them and get those non-typical weaning weights.mwj":1aietw5c said:
ALACOWMAN
Well-known member
I've said it before. They have to have the genetics to reach those weights.. But it masks a lot of momas ability..small producers only get personal satisfaction ..not the multimillions..that Sav enjoys...mwj":2o7rotp7 said:
mwj
Well-known member
People that buy those genetics are not required to use the same feeding program. They pay the price so they can have the option to do the heavy feeding if they have the cheap resources to do so.
mwj":1env5i7c said:
Agreed. I personally don't use a lot of their genetics, but they have a program that would make many a cattleman envious. Would we rather have 750 lb on grass? Sure. Will their animals beat ours most days from sunday under the same feed conditions? I'm thinking so. :hide:
ALACOWMAN
Well-known member
Whole lota difference in their outfit then my commercial maw and paw...would I use one of their bulls..anytime..angus9259":1h5fbki3 said:
Commercialfarmer
Well-known member
AllForage":w0qzti4t said:
You can find them, but they don't get as much attention. When black was branded and marketed, it makes sense financially to build and use a terminal black animal for a lot of producers. But I agree that there is a big difference in what was and what is in much of the breed now.
But it's that way in every breed. Saw some herford bulls sale this week that were more geared for terminal than maternal. They have a place.
Have a couple materal PB simmental bulls that hopefully have clicked well for some simangus heifers. They'll get a black terminal sire.
polledbull
Well-known member
remember those numbers are reported by people, only as good as the honesty of the person sending them in,the genetics play a role, the quality of grass in the upper mid west is superior to most grass, the feed bunk is filled 2 times per day by the silage wagon, and how old were the calves when they were weighed and actually weaned , all this combined makes a very good situation for huge weaning weights,
AllForage":e43v6gkn said:
Odd. Ohlde, Duff, Sinclair, Pharo etc.... have a bazillion maternal oriented cattle - can't believe anyone would have trouble finding maternally bred angus. I thought everyone knew about them! Would you like me to send you a link to their websites?
sim.-ang.king
Well-known member
Schaff has a money that they could be feeding those bulls gold dust, with their feed.
Jake
Well-known member
angus9259":26a989lo said:
Are they truly maternal? Or do they just fail to grow? We have used a lot of Ohlde genetics over the years and had to go away from them because we were weaning 450# calves.
What is the definition of maternal? I would say this is the real debate is how do we define maternal cows instead of are there any left.
