Young Bull.........Opinions Requested

[robertwhite]

This Simm/Beef bull turns 9 months old today. Please give me some opinions about him. He is currently weighing in at well over 800lbs. I think he is pretty nice, but I am quite new to this. His father was a HUGE bull who unfortunately had to go to auction as he came up lame one day (knee)

The Red Simm/Beef Heifer just turned 11 months recently. She is a little out of shape due to the winter months and I am going to start a higher protein feed program. Opinions about her are also welcome.

Hopefully I will get a nice calf out of these two sometime down the road.

 

[piedmontese]

i would be real careful about putting that sim-x bull on a heifer.sims r not normally known for calving ease.i know that there r certain sim bulls that are calving ease but they r proven.i would defiantely not do it myself especially since the bull don't look to be more than a slaughter animal.

 

[rockridgecattle]

For our area, this bull would go to slaughter. It is horned, so it will more than likely throw horned calves, and we get docked if the calves horns have not been removed or pasted properly. Feedlots prefer no horns. They themselves would have to remove them and that costs money in weight loss recovery.
The bull's dingy looks odd. Yes I know there is hair in the area, but it looks swollen.
Not really good shots
Need one of the rear end so we can see the scrotom and how the legs stand.
need one where the calf is standing proper with both legs under him in the same position.
High hips and the tail bone looks a bit higher than the back. This could cause a calf to be stuck a the hips during calving. Not good! You want something straight across
Head is a big sim square head. Gonna be tough to get them calves out.

Showed hubby the pics. He has no idea of our previous thread conversations
His word...not mine....calving nightmare waiting to happen . Hope the farmer has the bucks for c-sections
He also says the heifer is small for 11 months and he hates horns.
He did say the bull would make decent freezer beef!

Sorry!

 

[Caustic Burno]

Those are terminal steer calves not seedstock. Second most trainwrecks I had in my learning cliff,( I didn;t have a curve) was with Simm genetics. Wasn't as bad as with Char's 40 something years ago but bad enough I remember it well. I can't sell a dead calf. Looking back it was my fault, there are a few breeds I wouldn't even consider putting on heifers and Simm is one of them. I want a proven calving ease bull with low birthweight. I haven't lost a calf in years at calving, that was a hard lesson learned. I wore out a set of chains learning that one.

 

[chippie]

I may be very wrong, but his sheath looks similar to a calf that I had who had a hernia. It shouldn't be that large.

 

[3waycross]

Robert, no long winded analysis from me. Just short and sweet. If he was mine I would have someone come over tomorrow and band him then feed him thru the summer on grass and next fall 60 to 90 days on grain and EAT HIM. AI the heifer to something POLLED and with real good CALVING EASE. GOOD LUCK.

 

[djinwa]

I may be very wrong, but his sheath looks similar to a calf that I had who had a hernia. It shouldn't be that large.

Hernia was my first thought. Or maybe an old navel infection.

Is this your only female? I know it's tempting to save money and use him to breed if only a female or two. But as others have said, she being a heifer it's not worth the risk. And if he does have a hernia, and if hernias have genetic tendencies, then wouldn't want that passed down.

 

[robertwhite]

Thanks for the advice, I am supposed to have a guy from the Co-Op come and test my hay, and I will have him look
If it is a hernia I will band him. Funny thing is that it always looked odd to me also.

 

[Jeanne - Simme Valley]

For a 9 month old calf, the bull looks good as far as growth & thickness. His sheath area is definately undesireable. His head is not extremely blocky - he has a wide flat top because he is horned - which is a #1 reason to castrate him.
The heifer is also horned. This is a trait you should be breeding AGAINST. And, they should have been dehorned a long time ago. Sure is a messy process now.
The heifer is in too poor a condition to analyze - especially with just this one picture. She looks smaller than the bull and is 2 months older - but 1 pic is very deceiving.

Breeds (many & most) have changed drastically in 40 years. With modern genetics (not what we are seeing in these pics), I wouldn't (and don't) hesitate to sell PB Simmental bulls to british breeders to use on their heifers. We have been selling bulls to small breeders that only use 1 bull on everything for many years (40) and have never had one have a problem. (rarely sell to a PB Simmental breeder - mostly british or commercial). Yes, many years ago, people took those monster bulls & bred to small cows/heifers & the bulls were cow killers. Angus used to be belt buckle height, also. And they were also bigger than a PB Simmental at one point, also. Things change.

 

[pdfangus]

Robert, no long winded analysis from me. Just short and sweet. If he was mine I would have someone come over tomorrow and band him then feed him thru the summer on grass and next fall 60 to 90 days on grain and EAT HIM. AI the heifer to something POLLED and with real good CALVING EASE. GOOD LUCK.

:cowboy: I agree with this post 100%. :clap:

the ability to proagate should not necessarily imply the right to proagate.

As my daddy used to say....
"The world would be a lot better place it there were more good geldings and steers and a lot less common stallions and bulls."

that calf will only make a common bull. I think the heifer is the better calf. she needs dehorning.

 

[Rangenerd]

When in doubt, get the knife out.

 

[MF135]

- he has a wide flat top because he is horned - which is a #1 reason to castrate him.
The heifer is also horned. This is a trait you should be breeding AGAINST.

Talk about single trait selection :roll: I'm surprised the Hereford boys haven't eatin this post up by now.

 

[Jeanne - Simme Valley]

- he has a wide flat top because he is horned - which is a #1 reason to castrate him.
The heifer is also horned. This is a trait you should be breeding AGAINST.

Talk about single trait selection :roll: I'm surprised the Hereford boys haven't eatin this post up by now.

:lol: Unlike the HH breed, the Simmental breeders really discriminate against horned bulls & heifers. Bulls have absolutely no sale value as a breeder. Feedlots discriminate agains them. Other than "true" horned breeds, horns should be bred out of herds. It's really easy to get rid of them thru breeding - a real pain having to deal with them (dehorning).
Discriminating again a "single trait" is not a problem - BREEDING FOR a "single trait" IS a problem.