Stocker Steve
Well-known member
elkwc":1rpkdw4v said:The current market here is flooded with bulls.
80 at about $1.06/lb yesterday
is that lower tier?
elkwc":1rpkdw4v said:The current market here is flooded with bulls.
Bright Raven":feoecqlp said:The average cow/calf operation in Kentucky is about 20 head. They buy bulls for about $1500 or less. As someone mentioned, many buy culled bulls at the Stockyards.
The cost share program for improvement of herd genetics is intended to encourage producers to use better bulls. It has helped.
I bought my first bull (a registered Angus) for about $1800. When his photo was put up on Cattle Today back in 2013, he was massacred. I had him about 16 months and sold him. At that time, I began to AI. I still needed a bull so I bought a Rocking P bull ( registered Bull with Built Right pedigree) for $2500. I kept Spartacus about 2 years and leased him. While on lease, a guy saw him and I sold him. For the last two years, I have been total AI. I do not have a bull and that is a pleasure. I have only 16 cows, all registered. So far, they have bred back AI without any problems.
I don't want a bull to deal with but if I did, I would raise my own. I would not pay more than $2500 for a bull.
True Grit Farms":3edgu6lu said:Raven folks like you are a double edged sword. On one hand they help the seedstock market, on the other they damage it tremendously. The only difference is some folks have better cows. The larger seedstock producer has a larger pool to draw from, looks and EPD wise. Everyone has the same bulls available to them through AI.
Raven how many calves out of your 16 cows are going to end up at the sale barn being sold as feeder calves?
FlyingLSimmentals":ufsynpv1 said:I wouldn't change anything with just 16 cows especially with your skills. Just saying AI calves aren't always terrifically better or better at all. I wouldn't have gave out the top figure "$2,500" I would pay for a bull and try and sell a bull higher. I understand now because you have 16 cows but still don't think I would have stated it unless my bulls for sale were always gonna be $2500 and below.
Bright Raven":101g3ggu said:Mike,
My girls do not want a bull on the farm. They are not driven by sex. I sold Spartacus after I heard a list of their grievances. Then I ask for a vote. They voted 16 to 0 against him. It was not based on bad behavior. Spart was a good guy. But he was always hitting them up for sex and they got tired of it. My girls enjoy pregnancy. They have a contract with me to AI them. The less fuss and muss, the happier they are. Just yesterday, I went to the back 30. There laying by the creek in the shade of a kind old sycamore was the 16 gravid girls. All in A glow enjoying their pregnancy without a bull or the kids bothering them. Fat, slick and happy. Why would I change anything?
Until a few years ago we did 100% AI. Now with the problems that have come up I don;t have the strength to do it as much now. Even when I can get someone to help it isn;t as convenient. That's why we run a bull with a most and then AI only a dozen or so. If They don;pt settle to AI they go see the bull. Using bulls we raised is rewarding but not nearly as much as when I did all the AI work myself. I felt like a proud pappa every time a calf was born.Bright Raven":2bls067g said:FlyingLSimmentals":2bls067g said:I wouldn't change anything with just 16 cows especially with your skills. Just saying AI calves aren't always terrifically better or better at all. I wouldn't have gave out the top figure "$2,500" I would pay for a bull and try and sell a bull higher. I understand now because you have 16 cows but still don't think I would have stated it unless my bulls for sale were always gonna be $2500 and below.
AI is perfect for me. Fire Sweep knows the pedigrees and phenotype of my cows. She sees my cows every year. With one bull, I don't have many options for matching bulls to the cow. For example, if I have a cow that is framey, she matches it to a bull that will help. She also compliments the cow with bulls that promote their traits.
I should not have set a dollar amount. I should simply say, I have no intentions of buying a bull or growing a bull to breed my cows.
Bestoutwest":2fbhvxk7 said:Bright Raven":2fbhvxk7 said:Mike,
My girls do not want a bull on the farm. They are not driven by sex. I sold Spartacus after I heard a list of their grievances. Then I ask for a vote. They voted 16 to 0 against him. It was not based on bad behavior. Spart was a good guy. But he was always hitting them up for sex and they got tired of it. My girls enjoy pregnancy. They have a contract with me to AI them. The less fuss and muss, the happier they are. Just yesterday, I went to the back 30. There laying by the creek in the shade of a kind old sycamore was the 16 gravid girls. All in A glow enjoying their pregnancy without a bull or the kids bothering them. Fat, slick and happy. Why would I change anything?
So your cows are premenopausal? You need to get you some heifers, quick!
dun":2jo50nnl said:Until a few years ago we did 100% AI. Now with the problems that have come up I don;t have the strength to do it as much now. Even when I can get someone to help it isn;t as convenient. That's why we run a bull with a most and then AI only a dozen or so. If They don;pt settle to AI they go see the bull. Using bulls we raised is rewarding but not nearly as much as when I did all the AI work myself. I felt like a proud pappa every time a calf was born.Bright Raven":2jo50nnl said:FlyingLSimmentals":2jo50nnl said:I wouldn't change anything with just 16 cows especially with your skills. Just saying AI calves aren't always terrifically better or better at all. I wouldn't have gave out the top figure "$2,500" I would pay for a bull and try and sell a bull higher. I understand now because you have 16 cows but still don't think I would have stated it unless my bulls for sale were always gonna be $2500 and below.
AI is perfect for me. Fire Sweep knows the pedigrees and phenotype of my cows. She sees my cows every year. With one bull, I don't have many options for matching bulls to the cow. For example, if I have a cow that is framey, she matches it to a bull that will help. She also compliments the cow with bulls that promote their traits.
I should not have set a dollar amount. I should simply say, I have no intentions of buying a bull or growing a bull to breed my cows.
Bright Raven":2pf7nucr said:True Grit Farms":2pf7nucr said:Raven folks like you are a double edged sword. On one hand they help the seedstock market, on the other they damage it tremendously. The only difference is some folks have better cows. The larger seedstock producer has a larger pool to draw from, looks and EPD wise. Everyone has the same bulls available to them through AI.
Raven how many calves out of your 16 cows are going to end up at the sale barn being sold as feeder calves?
I would estimate 25 per cent. I retain my best at least for now. As long as the people who buy them are happy. Then I am too.
I am not expecting a monument to be erected after I die saying, "Here lies the man who advanced Simmentals into the next century".
I guarantee every heifer I sell is with the calf that I say she is bred to. I will even pay for the DNA test if the buyer decides to perform it.
IMO: Vince, you are deluding yourself about what is going on in the cattle markets. You present it like it is a sacred mission. People have been selling and trading cattle of all kinds and qualities since they were domesticated from Aurochs. It is amusing reading some of your naive posts. Please keep it up.
I won't have a bad udder on the place either. Not even on a beef cow. When we use to dairy I would tell folks that if you see one you don't like I'll give her to you. Never lost one.True Grit Farms":1stdkzqg said:Bright Raven":1stdkzqg said:True Grit Farms":1stdkzqg said:Raven folks like you are a double edged sword. On one hand they help the seedstock market, on the other they damage it tremendously. The only difference is some folks have better cows. The larger seedstock producer has a larger pool to draw from, looks and EPD wise. Everyone has the same bulls available to them through AI.
Raven how many calves out of your 16 cows are going to end up at the sale barn being sold as feeder calves?
I would estimate 25 per cent. I retain my best at least for now. As long as the people who buy them are happy. Then I am too.
I am not expecting a monument to be erected after I die saying, "Here lies the man who advanced Simmentals into the next century".
I guarantee every heifer I sell is with the calf that I say she is bred to. I will even pay for the DNA test if the buyer decides to perform it.
IMO: Vince, you are deluding yourself about what is going on in the cattle markets. You present it like it is a sacred mission. People have been selling and trading cattle of all kinds and qualities since they were domesticated from Aurochs. It is amusing reading some of your naive posts. Please keep it up.
I just try and do what I feel is right for the situation. I'm going to do my best to make sure that the phenotype is correct on the cattle that I sell as seedstock. Genomic testing and EPD'S don't mean anything if the animal has a bad udder or wrong color, or color in the wrong spots. And to make matters worse, lots of times a bad udder won't show up till just before - after the first calf. I usually cull for bad udders, and the wrong color goes into my commercial or recip herd.
My cull rate is 70-80% on seedstock. But I don't want to sell anything off the farm anymore.