inbredredneck
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I must be missing something, 300cd per acre and 180 bpa would work out to a 5.25 adg.
If they're off feed half of that time because of acidosis the gain would be reduced considerably. Knowing they eat corn ears first, shucks, aka husks, secondly and stalks last this could be an ongoing subclinical problem.inbredredneck":2wrf1zs7 said:I must be missing something, 300cd per acre and 180 bpa would work out to a 5.25 adg.
inbredredneck":322lj72s said:Using the numbers given here by the op, in my opinion a person would need to see at the very least 500 cd per acre to balance grazing standing corn against paying someone to harvest it. I would revisit the numbers Jim don't use dekalb's numbers use your own. You know how long the steers where in the field before you moved them. You know how many are in each group. I certainly would take another look at this if I was you. Something is terribly off.
1wlimo":1b0tzeqt said:Nice cattle and system SR. I have grazed corn with sheep in the past and that worked well, but no snow. There are a few tring this anhour or so north on Edmonton. Kind of have to think if they figure it will pay there it should work very well for a lot of people in better climates.
How do your steers get on when there is 2 feet of snow?
Very interesting and my next set of questions raise another set for me personally. Will pencil this out in a timline format for my calving dates and butcher dates and play with it. Don't have my new team ready to plow this spring so it will be the following spring before I plant some corn to try this. I greatly appreciate your time and answers and the dedication it takes to do this. I am greatly interested in it and see it as a viable option for my little farm. Thanks, JonSRBeef":368ng5vz said:Farmerjon":368ng5vz said:Jim, a few questions as your situation peaks my interest. Sorry for the list, but as I said, you peaked my interest. One of the things I want to cut are my grain costs. 10 years ago I could buy my grain cheaper than raising and processing it. I have considered shocking some corn and running it through an electric shredder (for yard waste). So I have some specific things that come to mind, I hope you don't mind my questions.
What are your row widths? 30"
How many rows do your steers get? N/A
At the beginning of the season do you provide only one row and see how long it holds out? Then determine amount and how often you move them? It is important to understand how cattle will graze standing corn. They will trample 40 acres to the ground until they have found and eaten every ear. Only then will they eat husks and leaves. Only when those husks are gone will they start eating the stalk, first the upper portion, then only if very hungry will they eat the lower stalk. This is good because that is where the nitrates mostly end up.So the first offerings are less so they consume it more completely and then as they learn the routine they can have an extra row or two to increase your length of time before having to move wire again? Don't worry, you answered it on the next question.
Have you found moving them more often provides better feed conversion/use of the feed?
As I said somewhere, layout of the grazing standing corn is important. I have found that planting it in strips 100 ft wide x 1/4 mile long or whatever length you want works well. There are semi-permanent (single14 ga steel wires 32" high(nose height) on steel tee posts) electric wires along both long sides. I make 6 passes with a 6 row 30" planter (=90' theoretically)along the 1/4 mi length. They start at a slinky gate lane about in the center. I drive over the corn rows with a 4 wheeler and put up aluminum cross wires on reels and P step in posts in the tire tracks between the two 1/4 mi hot wires. I start with about a 100 ft section so the area open to them to graze is about 100 x 100 or 200 ft or about 1/4-1/2 acre and see how long it takes them to have to start eating the upper stalks. When they are eating the upper stalks then I drive across the corn rows another 100-200 ft away from the center lane, put in another cross wire, go back and reel up the first and let them go to it. As TB brings up below, they can and will eat too much corn if left unrestricted access. They will also waste/trample a lot of edible material.
How is your corn standing at the end of the winter?
Do you think corn could be grazed on through summer if the field were large enough? Definitely do NOT graze corn until it is very mature. Raising good corn requires nitrogen fertilizer and there is a very likely case of nitrate poisoning. This always comes up when folks consider grazing hailed out corn etc. Making silage gives the nitrates in green corn time to change form. Grazing green high yield field corn does not and is very dangerous in my opinion. I understand about nitrate poisoning, I remember as a teacher in 1988 some guys that pastured stunted/toasted corn due to the drought here in Indiana and the cattle died due to high nitrogen content in the plants. What I was wondering, I calve in May, have been hauling my calves to butcher in early November. I wean in October. So my situation would/could be planting corn, then depending on maturity, could finish my older set of calves in standing corn from Sept 1st thru November.
Are you planting a hybrid or open pollinated corn? Hybrid selection is important to pick a palatable variety. In my system I plant a RR Triple stack Bt 95 day corn from a local seed company. I graze this corn up into April so standability is important I have no problems with standability of the hybrids I've been using. Corn on the ground under 2 ft of snow is not very useful. Since the layout of the corn relative to water, corral access ( I weigh them regularly) is important, and newer corn growing technology permits, I grow corn on corn in the same strips every year and have for 6 or 7 years now. I spring strip till in April after the steers leave for the processors. I have started running an Aerway at an angle to the stalks before strip tilling. Plant corn again 15" off the old rows in May. spray it once with glypho a couple weeks later and I'm done.
Enough for now, will ask more later if you don't mind.
I hope this helps. Jim
added: I am going to move the steers through a bit faster this year than last because I want them going to the processors off of good corn, not a couple weeks of cleanup. I am going to run the non-bred heifer calves as a cleanup crew on the corn after the steers get done with the ears/grain.
As feed corn at $3-$4 range or $7-$8 range is all the same. My point is 180 bpa corn should get you at least 500 cd of feed. Any less than that you are leaving profit in the field. I'm just looking at this as a man who raises fed cattle for a living.SRBeef":1yetbct2 said:I used to pay some one to harvest the corn, then pay to haul it, then pay to dry it... then what do I do, build storage and buy shell corn back at $6-7+ per bu? Believe me it did NOT pencil out, at least at $3-4 corn at the time. At $7-8 corn you are correct - I should be out there picking up ears myself!
Jim
inbredredneck":nuz6pr9p said:As feed corn at $3-$4 range or $7-$8 range is all the same. My point is 180 bpa corn should get you at least 500 cd of feed. Any less than that you are leaving profit in the field. I'm just looking at this as a man who raises fed cattle for a living.SRBeef":nuz6pr9p said:I used to pay some one to harvest the corn, then pay to haul it, then pay to dry it... then what do I do, build storage and buy shell corn back at $6-7+ per bu? Believe me it did NOT pencil out, at least at $3-4 corn at the time. At $7-8 corn you are correct - I should be out there picking up ears myself!
Jim
abe richter":2jaucnx3 said:JIM YOUR A GENIUS! THANK YOU! I FINISH STEERS ALSO AND AM SO TIRED OF BUYING CORN-MIXING ETC. JUST GENIUS
I AM 45 NORTH GREEN BAY WI-800 STEERS TO GROW TO 1400-1500 HOW MANY ACRES DO YOU FEEL WITH WASTE AND DEER CONSIDERED.
ABE
What Hybrid and variety are you planting that still holds 35% in Oct or Nov? What county in Wis are you located?SRBeef":2w0drn6k said:I am certainly not going to disagree with your point of view. And in fact I can get around 500 cd out of an acre of 180 bu corn if I push it. the economics however can be viewed in a number of different ways. The value of 35% moisture corn in the field in Oct or Nov looks a whole lot different if you do not own a combine, carts, grain trucks, dryer bins or a feed lot or equipment to feed it.
Jim