KNERSIE":ahcoa5fd said:
Chris H":ahcoa5fd said:
1982vett":ahcoa5fd said:
Got a question from a little different angle and probably should have its own thread but much of this dissucssion talks about preg testing and culling open cows. I understand the system of culling open cows and the reasoning for a tight breeding and calving season. I've seen replacement cows go for upwards of $1800 this past spring. If you paid that much for a cow, can you justify culling her if she comes open any time in the next year or two? Do you take the $600 - $800 and ship her putting a bullet in her head and replace her with another $1300 - $1800 dollar cow? Has anyone put much thought on this other than to say "she's open, ship her"? Basicaly what I am asking is, at what point does (or can) the cost of a cow or the cost of raising a replacement get high enough to maybe not cull her just because she came open?
If she comes in open in the fall, you have to ask why. Did she milk too heavy to rebreed under your conditions? Then sell her to someone else where she will perform, because she'll likely be open again. Think she had other fertility issues? Many are inheritable, cut your losses instead of taking the chances of her actually having a calf. I guarantee if she does get bred, she'll have a beautiful heifer that has fertility issues
Or did she come in open because of bull failure? Consider keeping her then.
I agree with Chris H, I would still cull her and chalk it up as tuition fees. (have done it on more than one occasion)
My concern isn't with infertility, but rather with low fertility, that cow that was open will calve the next time with a big energy reserve because of being open the previous year, this means she is likely to settle again and probably raise a very good calf (if its a heifer its likely to be retained starting a vicious circle), but if her production is indeed out of synch with the environment she is likely to to either be open or settle late in the third year. The same cycle will repeat and her heifer will likely follow the same pattern.
I cannot tolerate having a cow that produces as follows:
dandy of a calf, open, dandy of a calf, another calf, open, dandy of a calf, another calf, open, etc.
In my herd I cull all open cows and all cows calving late for 2 seasons. (late means in the last few weeks of my normal calving season). If a cow calves late this year and catches up and calve early in the calving season the next year they don't have fertility or production issues and don't need to be culled.
And yes, I do preg check my cattle at weaning so the open cows can be put on the best grazing to fatten up before being send to slaughter. I cannot allow non productive cattle to have a summer vacation at my expense.
Been giving this one time to bounce around in some heads and to see if anyone wanted to stick their necks out one way or another. Here are some numbers using my herd as an example. I think we can all agree for the most part on the goal of a cow raising one calf each year. Rigid breeding seasons or AI or whatever, one calf a year.
Now for me, I calve year round. :???: No breeding season, no AI. Just the bulls and mother nature. Calving in winter is not that big of a deal. Not as bad as in the northern territories.
I do not raise breeding stock to sell. At present I have 112 head 1 1/2 - 15 years of age.
Of these 112 head, 18 are exposed and have not calved, take these out, that leaves 94.
Of these,15 are 1st calf heifers, take these out and that leaves 79.
Of these, 13 have their second calf, remove these for insufficient data and that leaves 66.
Now of these, only 6 have never gone more than 365 without calving. :???: Sounds terrible don't it. But not so fast.
22 more have an average calving interval of
less than 365 days and another 24 have a calving interval of
365 -372 days. (1 year and 7 days, approaching less than 365 days.)
The remaining 15 had their calving interval average torn up by going over 400 days before calving. Of these, 9 have never gone over 365 days since.
The remaining 6 are on the schlitz list as they are now
at 365+ days for the second time. Usually cull between 7 - 12 a year for various reasons, these will be part of that number.
So
for me, shipping a $1400 cow because she does not breed between specific dates is not economical. In my opinion, it would be like buying a new set of tires every time you got a flat. For many, time and mother nature can make it back up.
So their it is for everyone to trash.
