Protruding Tongue on Calf

[DebVaughan]

I have a calf about a month old that has had a protruding tongue since birth and has not been frisky either like normal calves. He will lay all day and seldom moves from a very large area and sometimes lays out in the sun instead of finding shade. The cow's bag is small, but I have seen him suck although he goes from teat to teat. I am not sure if the tongue is too big to get a good hold or the mom's milk is not flowing due to lack of sucking. He is skinny, but alive, so he must be getting something. At any rate I brought him to the barn and gave him a B-12 and antibiotic shot and tried to get him to suck my finger. Kind of a listless response. I finally used a tube to put some milk in him, put the cow in with him, and am hoping to see a little strength and more response tomorrow. Is the protruding tongue a symptom that anyone has run across? Any chance the rest of the body will grow to fit the tongue? Any thoughts would be appreciated.

 

[milkmaid]

Might be a lung problem -- or it might be nothing. If you're really concerned about it then have your vet take a look. It's more likely a symptom of a problem than the problem itself.

 

[TheBullLady]

Could it be that he is having difficulties breathing? I've also seen them with a swollen tongue after birth, but not something that would last this long.

I also recommend a vet.. especially if he isn't a "good doer".

 

[DebVaughan]

Thanks for all the help. The little guy is still with me, but is still so bone thin. I am getting about a half gallon of milk down him twice a day and he is drinking deeply from the water trough. When he was in the pasture, i never saw him move from a spot all day. He never makes a sound...no call to his mother or anything. He lays around a lot, but at least his head is up which makes me feel better. One of his eyes is weepy and I am beginning to think he may never had sight in it. I am flushing it with saline. No scours and he has wagged his tail a bit when I am feeding. I get little encouragements here and there.

 

[dun]

From TAMU
When we talk about the reactions to these plants, I must first explain that they are as diverse as the leaflet variations. It is the urushiol (pronounced oo-roo-she-ol) resin, from oleoresin found in the sap, that causes contact dermatitis in humans. Urushiol is found in all parts of the plant but the hairs, wood cells, anthers and pollen. This is why honey made by bees who feed on poison ivy, isn't poisonous. Even though the urushiols often produce a profound reaction in humans, birds eat the berries and bears, cattle, deer, goats, hogs and horses eat the leaves and stems with no ill effects. It is perplexing to note that rabbits, squirrels and rodents eat the very berries that can so debilitate a human.

From WVU
poison ivy
Rhus radicans
Perennial, high climbing, woody vine. Leaves alternate, deciduous, pinnately compound; leaflets three, thin, bright green, shiny, ovate to elliptic, entire to serrate to shallowly lobed, 2 to 12 cm long, 2 to 12 cm wide. Flowers small, yellowish green, in clusters of 2 to 6 in lower leaf axils. Fruit a scarcely fleshy drupe, glabrous to short pubescent, .4 to.5 cm broad. Found throughout the southern states east of the Mississippi River; most abundant in moist woods but also in pastures, fence rows, roadsides and waste places.

poison oak Rhus toxicodendron
Low shrub, .3 to 2 m tall; very similar in appearance to R. radicans; however, it does not climb and leaflets are thicker, dull green, hairy on both surfaces and are more often lobed or coarsely serrate. Fruit is densely pubescent rather than glabrous or short pubescent. Found throughout the south; most abundant on relatively dry, sunny sites in woodlands, thickets and old fields.

TOXICITY

The toxic principle is a phenolic compound called urushiol. It is a skin and mucous membrane irritant and is found in all parts of the plant. Some humans are quite sensitive to the effects of the toxin while others show no ill effects from coming into contact with the plant. The toxin has little or no effect on animals but pets may carry the irritating substance on their hair and thereby transmit it to humans.

SYMPTOMS

Susceptible humans exhibit intense itching with inflammation and the formation of blisters at the areas of contact. Animals are rarely affected. Burning maybe dangerous because the irritant may be transmitted by smoke.

 

[rockridgecattle]

A sure fire way to know if the calf is getting the milk it needs is to separate the two overnight. Calf in the barn momma out side. Then in the morning let the two together and see what happens. observe the bag before the calf goes to town. Is it swolllen, etc.
NOTE TO SELF ... do not place the calf in one pen and the cow in the other in the barn...will result in...
...broken leg on cow if she gets it caught in a pannel
...bent or broken pannels causing the husband to curse both the cow and the pannel and look at the wife funny for undertaking on such an endeavor
...something other than the pannel broken, destroyed, damaged...insert other word of choice...again causing the husband to curse the cow, the broken object and look at wife funny for taking on such an endeavor
...I have that T-shirt (i'm the wife)
If you feel real energetic lock the cow in the head gate and milk her your self an then you have an accurate assesment, as well as you can see the quality.
Is this cow a first timer or a second timer or seasoned cow.
First timer might get better net year
Second timer time to hit the road unless her nutrition was not up to par when she had the last calf...what was it like, or she just did not bounce back when she was pregnant
Older cow, could be a signal as to "time to get wheels". Could be that she has a few dud quarters from mastitis or what ever.

Now on to the calf

yes probably under norished, start slow and increase gradually. Two much can actuall kill him with Cryptosporidia. Feed several times a day small doses for 3-5 days. Then gradually work to three times day. What's a calf bottle 4 pints? 3x a day. When it gets older in about a month, get it on calf grain and the bottle.
As for the tongue...probably due to calving problems and with being under nourished, just not the engery in the body to take the swelling down. A non steriodal anti inflam should do the trick.
But you have mentioned watery eyes. Allergy yes, but I'm inclined to think IBR should be tested. If the calf comes back positive then test the cow. It's possible you have a PI (persistently infected) cow and calf. What do you vaccinate for? When? Pre breeding? ML or killed? If you use a ML fetal protection and the calf is found to be PI check with the drug company. I know pfizer will compenstate for it.

 

[texastj]

I just found this web site. I don't normally do this kind of thing . But I have a bull calf with the same problem and have spent more money than I probably should have . I am hoping maybe we can help each other out. My calf did the same as yours would lay down or walk in circles in the hot sun . I brought him to the barn . When I first got him home I could not get him to eat . I gave him an enema of warm milk and syrup. Witch I think saved his life. The next morning he was up and walking and he even called for his mom. Well I fed him a bottle of milk and when he was trough with the bottle he went right back to walking in circles. He is his mom's first calf. He had been getting shots of antibiotics for several days and it seamed like it might be helping but then he would be right back like he was his tong sticking out and slobbering and walking in circles. I was even wondering if he was blind and was going on his sense of smell and sound. I still am not sure about that part. So I bought B complex inject able and a sublingual B complex I give him in his milk. And he seamed to get better. But then back to the same old thing . I gave him acidophilus to put back the good bacteria I knew he would need it to get well. I started to notice that when I went out to feed him it was like he got worse after I feed him but by this time I had been watching him and wracking my brain I just wasn't sure. Any way I changed his milk to land of lakes it has more soy in it I was thinking that maybe he was like a child who was allergic to milk well I also bought some red cell witch is for horses and I called the company to see how much to give him and they said they could not recommend that I give it to a calf because they had not done any study's on it so I just gave him 1 cc in his milk twice a day and he is doing better he is actually frolicking and playing and chasing me out of the pen after he is fed ( wanting more milk ) this has been the most improvement I have found so far. I have hopes of him living now where I didn't before. And I will keep a eye on this website to see if you have any luck I am just about willing to try any thing I just want him to get better. I have been doing the milk and red cell for three days now,
I took him to the vet but all he did was put ear mite medication in his ears and gave him a steroid shot witch seamed like may have helped a little but not worth the money.

 

[DebVaughan]

OK, I finally brought the calf up to the house because the mother was not tending to the calf at all and it will be easier for me to take care of. The flies were getting worse even with bait and I am still rinsing the eye with saline. I am still tubing before and after work...cannot get the calf to suck after all this time and it is frustrating...never took this long before. Even though we think it's hard to bottle feed, it would be a Godsend at this point. He will get up to go to water, but no frisking or much movement at all. No bawling. I am going to check with the vet on the red cell mentioned earlier.

 

[MikeC]

I just found this web site. I don't normally do this kind of thing . But I have a bull calf with the same problem and have spent more money than I probably should have . I am hoping maybe we can help each other out. My calf did the same as yours would lay down or walk in circles in the hot sun . I brought him to the barn . When I first got him home I could not get him to eat . I gave him an enema of warm milk and syrup. Witch I think saved his life. The next morning he was up and walking and he even called for his mom. Well I fed him a bottle of milk and when he was trough with the bottle he went right back to walking in circles. He is his mom's first calf. He had been getting shots of antibiotics for several days and it seamed like it might be helping but then he would be right back like he was his tong sticking out and slobbering and walking in circles. I was even wondering if he was blind and was going on his sense of smell and sound. I still am not sure about that part. So I bought B complex inject able and a sublingual B complex I give him in his milk. And he seamed to get better. But then back to the same old thing . I gave him acidophilus to put back the good bacteria I knew he would need it to get well. I started to notice that when I went out to feed him it was like he got worse after I feed him but by this time I had been watching him and wracking my brain I just wasn't sure. Any way I changed his milk to land of lakes it has more soy in it I was thinking that maybe he was like a child who was allergic to milk well I also bought some red cell witch is for horses and I called the company to see how much to give him and they said they could not recommend that I give it to a calf because they had not done any study's on it so I just gave him 1 cc in his milk twice a day and he is doing better he is actually frolicking and playing and chasing me out of the pen after he is fed ( wanting more milk ) this has been the most improvement I have found so far. I have hopes of him living now where I didn't before. And I will keep a eye on this website to see if you have any luck I am just about willing to try any thing I just want him to get better. I have been doing the milk and red cell for three days now,
I took him to the vet but all he did was put ear mite medication in his ears and gave him a steroid shot witch seamed like may have helped a little but not worth the money.

If you have a calf wlking in circles, most likely here's your problem:

Polioencephalomalacia (PEM) is an important neurologic disease of ruminants that is seen worldwide. Cattle, sheep, goats, deer, and camelids are affected. The term PEM denotes a lesion with certain gross and microscopic features that are not specific for a particular etiology or pathogenesis. Historically, PEM has been associated with altered thiamine status, but more recently an association with high sulfur intake has been observed. Other toxic or metabolic diseases (eg, acute lead poisoning, sodium toxicosis/water deprivation) can result in PEM as well.

Had a neighbor who had about 50 calves with those symptoms.......................

This was the problem.

 

[KNERSIE]

I have a calf about a month old that has had a protruding tongue since birth and has not been frisky either like normal calves. He will lay all day and seldom moves from a very large area and sometimes lays out in the sun instead of finding shade. The cow's bag is small, but I have seen him suck although he goes from teat to teat. I am not sure if the tongue is too big to get a good hold or the mom's milk is not flowing due to lack of sucking. He is skinny, but alive, so he must be getting something. At any rate I brought him to the barn and gave him a B-12 and antibiotic shot and tried to get him to suck my finger. Kind of a listless response. I finally used a tube to put some milk in him, put the cow in with him, and am hoping to see a little strength and more response tomorrow. Is the protruding tongue a symptom that anyone has run across? Any chance the rest of the body will grow to fit the tongue? Any thoughts would be appreciated.

Had a calf like that last year, mine had a sucking reflex, but very weak and uncoordinated. Had to put him on a teat and keep his head still, after 4 weeks of this I've given up on him and he went to the kill pen in the salebarn. His dam was also culled just incase it was genetic. In my calf's case it was a easy birth 16 days premature, his neck appeared to be in a constant spasma, I think he was just two sandwiches short of a picnic.

 

[texastj]

Polioencephalomalacia may be the answer for my little man. The Red Cell has 30 mg per fluid once . That would explain why I am seeing improvement. I will be calling my vet to see about geting some thiamine Thanks a bunch MikeC

 

[DebVaughan]

Today my vet looked down his throat and could see a mass..grey necrotic...about 3"x2" and managed to get it out...said it was part of the very back of his tongue. There was some bleeding, but not as much compared to the size of the thing, so I guess it wasn't attached by much. This explains why he was having no luck with sucking, but how it sustained damage back there is a mystery. Vet said the eye damage and tongue damage could have been fireants or the tongue damage could have been at birth. He fed him with the tube and gave antibiotic via injection and some additional down his throat...and ointment for the eye. The calf was exhausted by the time we got back and has been resting ever since. I just went out to check on him...it's 12:26 am ...and we now have scours. Thank you for your continued help.

 

[rockridgecattle]

With scours keep him hydrated..that is the key to success. He has drugs in his system already, so keep them up to prevent a secondary infection from setting in...like pnemonia.
Our "drug of choice" when scours hits is calf span and a shot of trivetrin/trimidox/borgal (all the same by different manufactures) as well as an anti inflam such as anafin. This will help with the swelling in the throat if you have to tube more than once or twice. We usually tubed with electrolyes 2x a day minimum. Clean everything between treatments to prevent re-infection and spreading to other animals and humans
Good luck

 

[DebVaughan]

Well, the little man and I lost the battle yesterday about 2 pm CST. I had gone to resorb 3 times a day, but I just didn't do enough or maybe do it right. I appreciate all the help from all and wish you well. Debbie

 

[rangergirl56m]

Im sorry you lost the fight against whatever it was. It sounds like you did everything you could, don't be so hard on yourself.