Polled Hereford Bull Opinions

[Brandonm2]

400 lbs. at 4 months is a weight per day of age of 3.33 lbs., I would hardly call that mediocre, he must come from a milker and have some growth potential to use that milk.

Actually, IF we assume an 80 lb birth wt...
400-80=320/(4x30) = a real wt. per day of age at weaning of 2.67 which I admit is very good; but he has done absolutely dreadful from that monent on. His WDA at one year was 2.25 lbs and if he passes that on to his calves the feedlot is going to be underwhelmed. TR in his first post did say that he is only now growing like TR had hoped.

What happened to him after weaning is more due to management than genetics, since growth rate is less than 40% heritable.

I agree that growth rate is "ONLY" 40% genetics; but are we expected to take it on FAITH that THIS bull's problems are not genetic??? The EPDs predict that he is going to be one of the poorest growing bulls in the entire Hereford breed. He is comfortably in the bottom 1% of the entire Hereford breed for weaning AND yearling wt AND scrotal circumference EPDs and and thus far he has lived down to those low expectations. He does not LOOK like an 18 month old bull to me. IF you told me he was 14 months old I would have said nice looking young bull; but TR says he is 18 months old. I feel a little better about him after seeing that he does have a decent brother out there working; but I am still not overwhelmed. Bez is right. This probably IS a trouble free bull who will sire easy keeping daughters who will milk (without being too extreme) though I would worry a little about their fertility. Like a lot of bulls, his calves will not be BAAAD; I just don't think they will be AS good as other bulls you could use. I think there are AT LEAST a dozen Hereford breeders in Texas that can sell TR a Hereford bull who will be just as problem free who SHOULD sire thicker calves that on average weigh 15 lbs or more at weaning.

 

[Bez!]

Will his calves go to the feed lot - or to the farm gate or to the grass finish market. Or into their own freezer?

Bez!

 

[txag]

One question though.....this bull is not being used on any of the purebreds. They were AI'd to different bulls as he's their brother. He was purchased strictly for the commercial herd. I don't need to submit the calves weights and stuff if they're from commercial cows, do I? His numbers won't change until he's bred to purebred cows and their calves are weighed and submitted, right?

the AHA has started a program called the "Alternate Breed Inventory" which allows producers to send in data on crossbred calves. it's still in the initial stages and the data from the crossbred calves will not affect the bull's epd's.

http://www.hereford.org/AHA/tabID__3581/tailored.aspx

if no purebred offspring are recorded to this bull, his epd's could still change as offspring from relatives are recorded, but the changes won't be significant and his accuracies (PE) won't change.

 

[Brandonm2]

One question though.....this bull is not being used on any of the purebreds. They were AI'd to different bulls as he's their brother. He was purchased strictly for the commercial herd. I don't need to submit the calves weights and stuff if they're from commercial cows, do I? His numbers won't change until he's bred to purebred cows and their calves are weighed and submitted, right?

Your roughly correct. His accuracy will never improve significantly since he won't be submitting data. Since his sire and his dam are still active (I assume) their numbers SHOULD change and I ""think""" that means his EPDs (which are purely based on pedigree performance) CAN change. Maybe somebody more knowledgable will know for certain.

 

[TR]

Here he was at 4 mos:

At 7 mos:

At 11 mos:

and one right at 17 mos:

 

[TR]

Will his calves go to the feed lot - or to the farm gate or to the grass finish market. Or into their own freezer?

Bez!

Hi Bez!

They're going to the sale barn, so where ever they go from there is where they'll be going......Honestly haven't even thought about retaining any daughters from him at this point. We're pretty space limited with a relatively young herd.

 

[BentCreekFarm]

TR, I would offer 1100 if you could deliver to Georgia :lol: .
I think he is just fine.


Caustic, That is a fine looking bull you have there . Sure wish he was with my ladies. Right now I have a registered 18 month old Gelbvieh with my herd of Angus. But I sure am partial to those Herf's.

 

[mtnman]

He's not the best bull I've seen lately, but he has some quality to him.

Some of these folks just can't see it because he is pretty green.

Look at the crease between the muscle in the rear view, he'll muscle up just fine.

He's not barn-burner, but he's not real poor either.

Brandon, not everybody needs breed leading performance, some prefer a little less labor and feed bill.

mtnman

 

[Brandonm2]

I have never owned a trait leader in my life. I do agree that I would be suspicious of such a bull siring moosy daughters I can't afford....on the other hand (to my knowledge) I have never owned a bull solidly in the bottom 1% in not one but THREE traits. If his weaning epd was 35 and his yearling EPD 55 (bottom 35% and 25%) I would not have made a big issue of it; but we are talking bottom O N E % Those growth EPDs have not been average since 1984!!!
http://hereford.org/Acrobat/Perf/S06_Trend.pdf
I agree with the poster who thinks he is showing more muscle expression as he ages; but nobody cares if a market steers pumps up at 26 months. We need him thick by 13 or 14 months. I look at him and I see a slow growing bull who reaches puberty late and that is what the EPDs are telling us to expect. A lot of that is management. He would be further along, thicker, and better finished if he had not been running with the cows; but I still think he would be flawed. With that poor scrotal circumference EPD, I would have a BSE test done to see if he is really lacking there or not.

 

[topsquar]

after looking at the poll hereford bull when he was weaned and in the other photos of him, I think if he was in my heard i would of casterated him. you dont breed good cattle from average quality cattle. ;-)