Opinions: Electric Fence

[fenceman]

I don't think 13,800 volts from a high voltage power line would prevent hogs from tearing down electric fence.
Now hogs are smart and learn quick the problem seems to be you have to teach everyone in the sounder.
All is well until a new sounder moves in and get ready to fix fence.
Hogs don't back away they charge through until educated.

Hey CB I am somewhat experienced with hogs and their destruction (hunting), but not pertaining to livestock fencing. I know the only thing that will keep hogs in or out is livestock panels. I am not gonna say we don't have any hogs at this location because I am sure they are around, but haven't seen any sign of em. I would rather have a fence that will allow them to pass in and out vs trying to keep them out. I was hoping the flexible line post would eliminate tearing down the wire/fence from deer and hogs if they come through. Would it be your opinion if a hog were able to pass through the bottom wire without breaking anything and deer can jump over the fence without breaking anything (at least often)all will be well? Perhaps bottom wire being barbed, second wire from bottom being hot, Third wire from bottom being smooth/neutral and a hot top wire? Or recommend another combination... I can put cattle panel around chargers, and running a second charger in case one failed.

Thoughts?

Electric fence for the perimeter does not meet the requires under Texas livestock laws.


Sec. 143.028. FENCES. (a) A person is not required to fence against animals that are not permitted to run at large. Except as otherwise provided by this section, a fence is sufficient for purposes of this chapter if it is sufficient to keep out ordinary livestock permitted to run at large.
(b) In order to be sufficient, a fence must be at least four feet high and comply with the following requirements:
(1) a barbed wire fence must consist of three wires on posts no more than 30 feet apart, with one or more stays between every two posts;
(2) a picket fence must consist of pickets that are not more than six inches apart;
(3) a board fence must consist of three boards not less than five inches wide and one inch thick; and
(4) a rail fence must consist of four rails.
(c) The freeholders of the county or area may petition the commissioners court for an election to determine whether three barbed wires without a board are to constitute a sufficient fence in the county or area. The election shall be conducted in the same manner and is governed by the same provisions of this subchapter provided for elections on the adoption of this subchapter.

IMO you are putting a target on yourself

Legal fence in Texas is a real Gray area. It depends on if county is listed as open or closed range. If it's a county state or farm to market rd. Etc.
I believe that on a intrastate highway it requires 4 wires at least 48 inches high.
To protect myself and my customer s, I Will not build a fence of less than 5 wires and 54 inches tall. They can call someone else.
You want to sleep tight build a good 5 wire fence. If you want to reinforce it with electric it's real easy. The infrastructure is already in place

 

[SteppedInIt]

I think we got off into left field.

Electric fence for the perimeter does not meet the requires under Texas livestock laws.

I respectfully don't agree here. If I build the fence as originally planned, the fence is not "illegal". This code does not mandate requirements of fence building.

Sec. 143.028. FENCES. (a) A person is not required to fence against animals that are not permitted to run at large. Except as otherwise provided by this section, a fence is sufficient for purposes of this chapter if it is sufficient to keep out ordinary livestock permitted to run at large.
(b) In order to be sufficient, a fence must be at least four feet high and comply with the following requirements:
(1) a barbed wire fence must consist of three wires on posts no more than 30 feet apart, with one or more stays between every two posts;
(2) a picket fence must consist of pickets that are not more than six inches apart;
(3) a board fence must consist of three boards not less than five inches wide and one inch thick; and
(4) a rail fence must consist of four rails.
(c) The freeholders of the county or area may petition the commissioners court for an election to determine whether three barbed wires without a board are to constitute a sufficient fence in the county or area. The election shall be conducted in the same manner and is governed by the same provisions of this subchapter provided for elections on the adoption of this subchapter.

This code refers to keeping out free range livestock from cultivated fields. Does not apply to me. If there are permitted free ranging animals roaming and got into my cultivated fields, the blame is on me not the livestock owner. If I ran a single hot wire around my cultivated fields and permitted free range animals got in and destroyed it, the blame is one me. If I built a sufficient fence according to the code and the livestock got in, well then the livestock owner may be responsible.

IMO you are putting a target on yourself

If your implying the fence as planned would be illegal or would not keep in my cattle, I disagree here as well.

Fenceman, I don't think a Texas mandate for livestock fence requirements exits. Certain counties may have such a thing for certain zones. Hopefully we dont need the government to tell how to build fences in TX.

 

[SteppedInIt]

I appreciate the constructive info given from all. Glad I asked. Did learn some stuff and this brought up things I hadnt thought of. Thanks again.

 

[Caustic Burno]

I appreciate the constructive info given from all. Glad I asked. Did learn some stuff and this brought up things I hadnt thought of. Thanks again.

There are no free range counties in S/E Texas if you do not have sufficient fence and your livestock gets
out you are liable.
There are only 23 open range counties that don't fall under fence in with sufficient fence.
Andrews, Callahan, Camp, Childress, Collin, Cottle, Ector, Hemphill, Jeff Davis, Kenedy, King, La Salle, Loving, Midland, Navarro, Oldham, Palo Pinto, Reagan, Schleicher, Shackleford, Stephens, Sterling, and Throckmorton.
The other 231 have stock laws.


Since 1876, the Texas Legislature has allowed for local stock laws to be passed that modify the common law rule of open range. See Texas Agriculture Code Section 143.021 – 143.082. Stock laws are considered by local voters and can apply to all or a portion of a county. If these laws are in place, the open range common law is modified and landowners have a duty to prevent animals from entering the highway pursuant to the stock law. Many stock laws were enacted across Texas during by the 1930's. The stock laws generally state that certain species of animals (i.e. horses, jacks, jennies, cattle, sheep, etc.) may not be permitted to run at large within the limits of the particular county. Essentially, a stock law changes the area from open range to closed range.

The common law rule on closed range is the one that will bite you in the butt, on knowingly let roam at large, having insufficient fence and willfully didn't maintain a fence. The common law rule falls back on the definitions set in the Agriculture Code.
This has been set by case law.

Example
Section 143.074 sets forth the language that counties must include in their stock law when, and if, they are enacted. This statute is not a penal statute; rather, it creates a duty on the keepers of livestock in counties that have adopted the stock laws to restrain their cattle. Goode v. Bauer, 109 S.W.3d 788, 792 (Tex. App.–Corpus Christi, 2003, pet. denied). This statute is designed to protect all persons and property from wandering animals, not just motorists. Id. While the court in Goode recognized that Section 143.074 does not set forth a standard of care (the statute says, "may not permit"), the court recognized that liability for violation of the stock laws has always required more proof or showing of culpability than the mere presence of a defendant's animal in a forbidden place. Id.

 

[fenceman]

Fenceman, I don't think a Texas mandate for livestock fence requirements exits. Certain counties may have such a thing for certain zones. Hopefully we dont need the government to tell how to build fences in TX.[/quote]

Your mostly right in that these or not mandates, but guidelines. You won't get a ticket or be charged with a crime. Most law enforcement don't even know they exist.
But most lawyers do.....
NO we don't need the government telling us how to build fence. Why I waited so long to bring it up :lol2:
Any way do what you want with it. It'll turn em better than trickle of water ;-)

 

[TexasBred]

Fenceman, I don't think a Texas mandate for livestock fence requirements exits. Certain counties may have such a thing for certain zones. Hopefully we dont need the government to tell how to build fences in TX.

Your mostly right in that these or not mandates, but guidelines. You won't get a ticket or be charged with a crime. Most law enforcement don't even know they exist.
But most lawyers do.....
NO we don't need the government telling us how to build fence. Why I waited so long to bring it up :lol2:
Any way do what you want with it. It'll turn em better than trickle of water ;-)[/quote]
Fenceman if you can prove that you have made a good faith effort to maintain your fences in a way as to keep your livestock in and they still get out, are you still held liable if a cow gets out and is involved in an accident, etc. ??

 

[fenceman]

Fenceman, I don't think a Texas mandate for livestock fence requirements exits. Certain counties may have such a thing for certain zones. Hopefully we dont need the government to tell how to build fences in TX.

Your mostly right in that these or not mandates, but guidelines. You won't get a ticket or be charged with a crime. Most law enforcement don't even know they exist.
But most lawyers do.....
NO we don't need the government telling us how to build fence. Why I waited so long to bring it up :lol2:
Any way do what you want with it. It'll turn em better than trickle of water ;-)

Fenceman if you can prove that you have made a good faith effort to maintain your fences in a way as to keep your livestock in and they still get out, are you still held liable if a cow gets out and is involved in an accident, etc. ??[/quote]

Tb I am not a lawyer, if I was I would not be building fence for a living.
My understanding is if you stay with in the guidelines, and don't have a history of animals running estray. You have a very good chance if should the worst happen, it would fall under a act of God(,wonder when they'll make em change that phrase :lol2: )

 

[Caustic Burno]

Fenceman, I don't think a Texas mandate for livestock fence requirements exits. Certain counties may have such a thing for certain zones. Hopefully we dont need the government to tell how to build fences in TX.

Your mostly right in that these or not mandates, but guidelines. You won't get a ticket or be charged with a crime. Most law enforcement don't even know they exist.
But most lawyers do.....
NO we don't need the government telling us how to build fence. Why I waited so long to bring it up :lol2:
Any way do what you want with it. It'll turn em better than trickle of water ;-)[/quote]

As a statute of law no you are correct.
As Common Law by a judge in closed counties yes. Lot of case law this is based on.
It all refers back to the Ag code on what is sufficient, knowingly let roam at large or willfully did not maintain.
The first thing that will happen after an accident or property damage is a picture of your fence.
Second thing neighbors will be ask how often have they got out. Pray your neighbor isn't PO'd at you
and mad as heII his garden got tore up.

 

[fenceman]

Fenceman quote.
Your mostly right in that these or not mandates, but guidelines. You won't get a ticket or be charged with a crime. Most law enforcement don't even know they exist.
But most lawyers do.....
NO we don't need the government telling us how to build fence. Why I waited so long to bring it up :lol2:
Any way do what you want with it. It'll turn em better than trickle of water ;-)[/quote]
Quote caustic burno.
As a statute of law no you are correct.
As Common Law by a judge in closed counties yes. Lot of case law this is based on.
It all refers back to the Ag code on what is sufficient, knowingly let roam at large or willfully did not maintain.
The first thing that will happen after an accident or property damage is a picture of your fence.
Second thing neighbors will be ask how often have they got out. Pray your neighbor isn't PO'd at you
and mad as heII his garden got tore up.[/quote]
Yeah, that.

 

[Big Cheese]

I don't know anything about legal or illegal in Texas or Arkansas for that matter with fencing but most people in Arkansas only use 2 strands of electric fence. We fenced in a new area last year and we did two strands along the perimeter and one to separate paddocks. A lot of people are even going to just one for the perimeter as well but I don't like that...I would rather go the two. Our mentor does 1 everywhere around and has never had anything get out in 25+ years. We haven't had anything get out either so far since we started using electric...knock on wood. Once they figure out its hot they won't mess with it. I know everyone has been saying there's a law for fencing in your area but I feel like 4 strands is WAY to many but if it's the law it's the law you got to do what you got to do. If you have to do that I would just go all electric fence wire and stay away from the barbed wire.

We used 14 gauge galvanized wire...the 12 gauge just is to hard to handle in my opinion and sags a lot more....also used Gallagher chargers. Just thought I would throw my 2 cents in.

 

[fenceman]

That's interesting, different folks, different strokes I guess.
I would bet a steak dinner. I could fill your car with gas, and you could burn it all, and not find a place here using a electric fence for perimeter fence....at least not on that doesn't look like a scene out off a mad max movie.

 

[1wlimo]

Having built and repaired a fair amount of stock fence high tensile plain wire is really the best way to go. Adding in electric to reduce the wire count is better yet.

The electric keeps the stock off the wire, barbed wire is just plain nasty to work with, new, old is even worse. It breaks, takes pulling staples to retention, stock push it to eat outside the field, and the leather quality of the stocks skin can be reduced.

I have seen high tensile stay good with trees falling on it, and deer, roo's, and hogs all passing thru.

Just need to make sure the fence is built good to start. Very strong H in the corners, and each run as straight as is possible, shallow gradient changes, and shallow corners where they have to be.

 

[Caustic Burno]

That's interesting, different folks, different strokes I guess.
I would bet a steak dinner. I could fill your car with gas, and you could burn it all, and not find a place here using a electric fence for perimeter fence....at least not on that doesn't look like a scene out off a mad max movie.

That would be a safe bet here as well.
People here want to keep what they have worked for all their lives,
not give it to attorneys and plaintiffs.
I use electric cause I don't like repairing fence it is with five to seven strands of barb wire.