Need advice please

[vclavin]

Sold a neighbor 5 cow calf pairs 6-15-2012. I'm still waiting for them to pick them up. I called several weeks ago and they said they did not have the new fence ready - I wasn't told about the fence when they bought the cows, never thought a problem as they have 10 cows now? Tried to get ahold of them a few days ago and got a message on the machine about new fence built but still repairing the old fence. My message to her was I needed these cows picked up as I'm out of grass and I need my other cows up...etc? They said they would pay feed costs but seems to me it should be more than that. Rural water is out of site and their cows are getting what mine should be.. plus I'm raising their calves (which are also being fed). So here we are, I'm doing the work and at this rate they will get the profit..hmmmm
Checked with someone that charges $6.50 per day for cows and $2.50 per day for calves - this is for flushing. What should I charge to be fair? Ideas?
Thanks
Valerie

 

[Anonymous]

Just give the money back and take the pairs to the barn

 

[JustSimmental]

To be fair, I would charge them for the grass,feed, your time, water and care. A mature cow will probably eat 35 lbs of grass per day x 5 = 175 lbs per day
Depending on the age of the calves and what you are feeding them grass -- 350 lb calves 10 lbs of grass x 5 = another 50lbs per day
If you are feeding the calves you must charge what it would take to replace the feed lost the cost of going to get it. labor, etc--so add to it.
I would charge them 175 lbs + 50 lbs = 225 lbs per day since 6/15/12 which would be 3600 lbs. If rolls of hay are 1200 lbs that is 3 rolls I'd charge them for 6 rolls.
I would double any feed cost I accrued over this time because feed prices are climbing daily and it is a replacement cost and not necessarily just the cost for feed.
I would charge my labor at not less than $20 per hour which includes your extra time and your hassles
I would charge them for water at double the cost per day
And I would send them a bill tomorrow and put on it Due Upon Receipt to include 1.8% interest due over 30 days. I would also put on there that if they decide they want their money back you would be happy to do so, less the bill already accrued.

You do that and these morons wont try to take advantage of your kindness ever again.

JS

Sold a neighbor 5 cow calf pairs 6-15-2012. I'm still waiting for them to pick them up. I called several weeks ago and they said they did not have the new fence ready - I wasn't told about the fence when they bought the cows, never thought a problem as they have 10 cows now? Tried to get ahold of them a few days ago and got a message on the machine about new fence built but still repairing the old fence. My message to her was I needed these cows picked up as I'm out of grass and I need my other cows up...etc? They said they would pay feed costs but seems to me it should be more than that. Rural water is out of site and their cows are getting what mine should be.. plus I'm raising their calves (which are also being fed). So here we are, I'm doing the work and at this rate they will get the profit..hmmmm
Checked with someone that charges $6.50 per day for cows and $2.50 per day for calves - this is for flushing. What should I charge to be fair? Ideas?
Thanks
Valerie

 

[vclavin]

Just give the money back and take the pairs to the barn

I'd lose my you know what if I took them to the barn, they paid $8800.00 for the 3 registered Angus pairs and 2 Angus cross pairs. They'd lb them out at the salebarn...OUCH! I'd be better off keeping them..heard the prices will likely go sky high about time to wean the calves.
I sure hate to make an enemy out of the neighbor but I also can't afford to be too kind. What a deal!
Valerie

 

[J&D Cattle]

I sure hate to make an enemy out of the neighbor but I also can't afford to be too kind. What a deal!
Valerie

They would sure be an enemy of mine if they were treating me that way. JS outlined the costs pretty well, if you felt like being a little more fair you might just stick to actual costs and not charge for labor as it sounds like you're there feeding your others as well. That's a tough spot that they should't have put you in. Good luck.

 

[Alan]

First have you been paid yet? If not :?

If you have you may need to drive over and pop in, speak to them face to face and explained things just as you did in your first post. It may help and save a nieghbor relationship and future customer.

Alan

 

[Limomike]

I would call them up and tell them a certain date to pick them up (today!!) or would have to start charging them for feed, & water for each day thereafter. They should really pay you for the time you had to keep them, and should have been told that from the start,when they bought them. A month and a half is plenty of time to get a fence finished.

 

[vclavin]

Thanks guys I really appreciate your input. They have paid $3600 down on them so far. I have a quickbooks program so made an invoice for the sale of the animals to them, the money they paid down on them , 2 weeks free board and then 4 weeks to be paid for. I've already talked to them and it's not registering with them .... they said they were done with new fence and almost done with repairs. These calves were born march/april they have gained enough to more than pay for the boarding fees.
They may never buy from me again but that could be a good thing..lol. If it wasn't for this blasted drought and all the high feed costs and everyone holding hay till prices hit the roof.. I guess I'd feel a little different, just concerned about the welfare of the ones I kept....
Hope I've done the right thing .......
Valerie

 

[CottageFarm]

That sounds more than fair on your part.
Unfortunately, I would warn you that they will probably raise a big stink. That they haven't paid in full yet, and are taking tremendous advantage of you by leaving them with you to care for and feed them, would raise a whole bunch of red flags for me. If I were in your shoes, my expectation would be for the worst, I'm afraid, and I'd be prepared to refund their deposit less feed costs. But I sincerely hope that doesn't happen to you.

 

[vclavin]

That sounds more than fair on your part.
Unfortunately, I would warn you that they will probably raise a big stink. That they haven't paid in full yet, and are taking tremendous advantage of you by leaving them with you to care for and feed them, would raise a whole bunch of red flags for me. If I were in your shoes, my expectation would be for the worst, I'm afraid, and I'd be prepared to refund their deposit less feed costs. But I sincerely hope that doesn't happen to you.

I figured I'd bite the bullet and see what happens. Didn't want to sell them in the first place but drought bit me hard and I figured being neighbors... well..you know. Never guessed this would happen.

Valerie

 

[chippie]

I have the feeling that they do not have the money to pay you. Were they going to pay the balance due when they picked up the cattle?

Whatever you do, I would not release the cattle until paid in full.

 

[vclavin]

I have the feeling that they do not have the money to pay you. Were they going to pay the balance due when they picked up the cattle?

Whatever you do, I would not release the cattle until paid in full.

They offered to pay the first week but we felt the $3600 was enough to hold the girls for them. Sent letter this morning... we shall see. If nothing else maybe they will HURRY!!!
Valerie

 

[Dave]

I have the feeling that they do not have the money to pay you. Were they going to pay the balance due when they picked up the cattle?

Whatever you do, I would not release the cattle until paid in full.

They offered to pay the first week but we felt the $3600 was enough to hold the girls for them. Sent letter this morning... we shall see. If nothing else maybe they will HURRY!!!
Valerie

If that doesn't work offer them free delivery. As in, they are in the trailer where do you want me to unload them.

 

[vclavin]

Finally got a response.. fence is finished and they are ready for animals.
BUT!!! Not happy with xtra $1300 I charged to feed and take care of them. They don;t think
they can come out .
What do you think is fair to charge for 6 weeks of caring for, feeding hay, grain, lick tubs and salt blocks and getting bred 5 cow calf pairs.

Blessings
Valerie

 

[CottageFarm]

Finally got a response.. fence is finished and they are ready for animals.
BUT!!! Not happy with xtra $1300 I charged to feed and take care of them. They don;t think
they can come out .
What do you think is fair to charge for 6 weeks of caring for, feeding hay, grain, lick tubs and salt blocks and getting bred 5 cow calf pairs.

Blessings
Valerie

Did they buy them bred, or did that happen only because they've been there so long?
If you want to keep it friendly, give them your actual out of pocket costs and show them an itemized bill.
Find out the avg difference in market price between 3/1 and pairs and add that to your cost. (or have them sign a contract that gives you ownership of the resulting calves)
If $1300 is actual cost, they'll pay it if they're honest sort of people. If they're not honest, return their deposit (less your cost to keep them) and write them off as someone to never do business with again. Then sell them as 3/1. My :2cents:

 

[vclavin]

Finally got a response.. fence is finished and they are ready for animals.
BUT!!! Not happy with xtra $1300 I charged to feed and take care of them. They don;t think
they can come out .
What do you think is fair to charge for 6 weeks of caring for, feeding hay, grain, lick tubs and salt blocks and getting bred 5 cow calf pairs.

Blessings
Valerie

Did they buy them bred, or did that happen only because they've been there so long?
If you want to keep it friendly, give them your actual out of pocket costs and show them an itemized bill.
Find out the avg difference in market price between 3/1 and pairs and add that to your cost. (or have them sign a contract that gives you ownership of the resulting calves)
If $1300 is actual cost, they'll pay it if they're honest sort of people. If they're not honest, return their deposit (less your cost to keep them) and write them off as someone to never do business with again. Then sell them as 3/1. My :2cents:

They bought them as cow calf pairs and we understand they would pick them up in a few days... that was 6-13-2012!!
Blessings
Valerie

 

[CottageFarm]

Some people are really something, huh?
Here's how I would handle it:
If they don't want to pay you for breeding their cows, tell them the alternative is that you will abort them
at no additional cost. Either way, they pay for the care and feeding (that they apparently assumed you would provide for free). I would then explain to them you're not a non-profit business, and you can't afford to feed other peoples' cows for free, especially in a drought.

Now, bear in mind, I don't have a whole lot of patience with certain types of people, and would, under these circumstances, have no problem pizzing them off and never see them again.
If you really want to play nice, ask them what they do feel is a fair price for feeding, boarding and breeding their cows.

By the way, document EVERYTHING. Even verbal conversations. Get it in writing if you can, like email correspondence. But even if it's a phone conversation, write it down. If they do anything other than pay you everything you ask for, get their signature of agreement to any other course of action.

My guess is that it's not a coincidence that they finished their fence right about the time you told them it's feed/board aren't free.

 

[vclavin]

Some people are really something, huh?
Here's how I would handle it:
If they don't want to pay you for breeding their cows, tell them the alternative is that you will abort them
at no additional cost. Either way, they pay for the care and feeding (that they apparently assumed you would provide for free). I would then explain to them you're not a non-profit business, and you can't afford to feed other peoples' cows for free, especially in a drought.

Now, bear in mind, I don't have a whole lot of patience with certain types of people, and would, under these circumstances, have no problem pizzing them off and never see them again.
If you really want to play nice, ask them what they do feel is a fair price for feeding, boarding and breeding their cows.

By the way, document EVERYTHING. Even verbal conversations. Get it in writing if you can, like email correspondence. But even if it's a phone conversation, write it down. If they do anything other than pay you everything you ask for, get their signature of agreement to any other course of action.

My guess is that it's not a coincidence that they finished their fence right about the time you told them it's feed/board aren't free.

Thanks, that's kinda why I sent the bill-lol- I figured it might just hurry them up.
I figured what we spent just o keep those cows for them for 2 months and I had a heart attack!!! $750 per month for 5 cows and calves on creep feed. If I had the pasture to put them on and ponds it would not have cost so much but supplementing bad hay and city water bill.... OUCH! Hubby said to just take what they offer for feeding them and get them gone. He's afraid of getting a bad rap for trying to be honestly paid, especially when it was not in the deal in the first place and we only sold them because of drought conditions. They got keeper cows not true cull cows.... what a lesson.
Blessings
Valerie

 

[chippie]

Finally got a response.. fence is finished and they are ready for animals.
BUT!!! Not happy with xtra $1300 I charged to feed and take care of them. They don;t think
they can come out .
What do you think is fair to charge for 6 weeks of caring for, feeding hay, grain, lick tubs and salt blocks and getting bred 5 cow calf pairs.

Blessings
Valerie

What do they mean "They don't think that they can come out"?

I agree about showing them what it cost you to keep them and that they did not get the job done in a timely manner as they indicated when they bought the cattle. See what they say.

To me, they don't sound like very good neighbors and I really do think that they don't have the money to pay for them. If they did, the fence would have been finished sooner and they would have payed you and picked up the cattle.

I guess that the lesson learned is get payment in full and an agreement you will keep the cattle so many days before you need to charge upkeep.

I have bought horses in the past, and have always paid board until we could pick up the horse.

Good luck!

 

[CottageFarm]

I can understand your hubby's concerns. Oh, how I would be ticked off about it though.
Yep, expensive lesson learned, though you certainly did nothing wrong to get there.