Heifer selection

[townfarmer]

I plan on retaining two weaned heifers out of six to replace a couple of older cows. My plan was to keep the two heifers from the mothers with the best production records. However on visual appraisal a few of the heifers from the less productive cows have more eye appeal. I'm interested to hear people's opinion on heifer selection. Which do you place greater emphasis on; visual appraisal or the dam's performance record? I'm sure some of you guys have an effective system or formula for retaining heifers. I'm eager to learn.

Thanks in advance

Andrew

 

[WalnutCrest]

I plan on retaining two weaned heifers out of six to replace a couple of older cows. My plan was to keep the two heifers from the mothers with the best production records. However on visual appraisal a few of the heifers from the less productive cows have more eye appeal. I'm interested to hear people's opinion on heifer selection. Which do you place greater emphasis on; visual appraisal or the dam's performance record? I'm sure some of you guys have an effective system or formula for retaining heifers. I'm eager to learn.

Thanks in advance

Andrew

Well, if I were you and had to chose right now with the information you've given, I'd keep the heifers out of the cows with the better production records and let someone else have the possibly/probably (?) less-productive eye candy (hopefully at a premium).

...HOWEVER...if you're willing to consider a different approach...

There are lots of ways to do this ... I'm not claiming on having a patent on doing it "the right way", but what follows makes sense to us:

* An animal (cow, bull, heifer or steer) leaves the herd for aggression, regardless of all other factors

* A cow leaves the herd if she's not confirmed bred (unless we're intentionally keeping her open to be a recip, etc.) 60-90 days after the embryo / AI / bull breeding program we run has ended.
* A cow does NOT leave the herd just because we think she's getting old --- it's not uncommon to have Aubrac cows calving annually into their teens or early twenties

* Heifers are scored in contemporary groups and only after they have their 2nd calf (which assumes they got bred the first time), as follows:
a) if (for example) you're targeting a March 1 to April 30 calving season, turn the bull in with the heifers on June 1st and remove the bull on July 31
b) preg check all heifers whenever you're comfortable doing so (30-90 days after the bull comes out) ... anyone not bred is a goner.
c) calve out the calves ... any heifer that needs to be assisted is a goner.
d) as soon as the first heifer calves, turn the bull in with all heifers ... leave the bull in until July 31st.
e) preg check all of them again ... anyone who's not bred is a goner once her calf is around 4-6 months old
f) calve out the calves ... any second-time cow that needs to be assisted is a goner.
g) monitor the number of days between the day they calved their first calf and the day they gave you their second calf ... the heifer(s) with the shortest calving interval are noted and you only keep your replacement bulls out of that group of females.

*******************

This is pretty tough selection criteria ... you'll automatically cut out your worst performers over a couple of years and the overall genetic quality of the remaining animals will be much higher as a result.

Oh, and I would avoid keeping cattle based on the "eye test" alone. Remember, Ryan Leaf was once the 2nd overall pick in the NFL draft because he "looked great" in a uniform.

You don't know which heifer is your best one until she's almost 3yrs old under the above program ... it's a long-process. Do you want to keep the 'best looking one' only to find out she's infertile (or sub-fertile)?

Pick cattle that will produce for you, in your area, on your pasture, under your management. Doing it differently than others isn't a problem as long as you do it as consistently as you are able.

Good luck to you!

 

[townfarmer]

Thanks Walnut crest for that very substantial reply. That's quite a rigourous system you have there. It sounds like your selection process is firmly focussed on fertility. Once your heifers have calved do other factors like weaning weights, udder score etc influence your decisions? Or is it a case of "select for fertility and everything else takes care of itself".

It also sounds like you initially retain more heifers than you actually need so you can apply your performance based culling. We only have a small herd of 12 females but i like the idea of maybe retaining 4 heifers and then culling another two based on fertility, mothering ability, etc. Unfortunately we're having a very dry summer here so that may not be the best option.

Thanks again for sharing your wisdom.

Andrew

 

[NC Liz 2]

I think WalnutCrest hit that one out of the park!
The only thing I would add is to retaining 4 weaned heifers out of six in case you have to cull 2 of the 4 along the way.
Liz

 

[WalnutCrest]

Thanks Walnut crest for that very substantial reply. That's quite a rigourous system you have there. It sounds like your selection process is firmly focussed on fertility. Once your heifers have calved do other factors like weaning weights, udder score etc influence your decisions? Or is it a case of "select for fertility and everything else takes care of itself".

It also sounds like you initially retain more heifers than you actually need so you can apply your performance based culling. We only have a small herd of 12 females but i like the idea of maybe retaining 4 heifers and then culling another two based on fertility, mothering ability, etc. Unfortunately we're having a very dry summer here so that may not be the best option.

Thanks again for sharing your wisdom.

Andrew

Our program is, basically, two parts --- (i) direct marketing beef to consumers ... and ... (ii) Aubrac seedstock.

As a result, we pay a huge amount of attention to palatability (that's a topic for a whole other set of threads)

... and ...

the primary profit drivers of a cattle operation, which are fertility (if they're not fertile, you have nothing), temperament (if you have grumpy animals, you're having no fun fixing fences, etc.), and forage conversion / feed efficiency (if they don't convert your inputs to flesh at a fast enough pace and in an efficient enough manner, you'll go broke).

Weaning weights are monitored but not considered very heavily as they will skew selection criteria to larger cows and/or cows who are well above average in milk production ... not necessarily capturing animals that are most efficient at converting forage to flesh.

Udder scores are another thing ... while we're looking for reasons to cut a female out of the herd, we're not going to (necessarily) do that if she's still carrying, calving and weaning a healthy calf for us each year.

Essentially, our cows are our employees --- they have a job to do ... wean us a healthy calf and have a good attitude about it ... and if they don't do that, they then feed us (and/or our beef buyers).

PS -- Why isn't keeping a heifer over a sub-fertile cow a better option in a dry weather? They eat far less ...

************

ETA -- It's not wisdom ... most of it is just the regurgitation of stuff other people have said / typed.

 

[townfarmer]

Thanks again Walnutcrest for explaining your selection philosophy. It all makes plenty of sense. I like your "employee" analagy. My problem is I get too sentimentally attached and give too many second chances.

Andrew

 

[WalnutCrest]

Thanks again Walnutcrest for explaining your selection philosophy. It all makes plenty of sense. I like your "employee" analagy. My problem is I get too sentimentally attached and give too many second chances.

Andrew

My research and non-cattle-related business experience says that the cause of failure in most small businesses is a combination of being under-capitalized and/or keeping under-performing employees around too long.

As it regards all smaller / start-up cattle operations ... one way around the former risk is to focus on feed-efficient, long-lived, fertile and flavorful genetics (i.e., do what you can reasonably do to reduce the risk of being under-capitalized) ... and ... one way to avoid the latter is to not be afraid of eliminating the living animals that don't measure up to at least the average you should expect from your superior genetic pool you're drawing upon for your animals.

To me, it's a powerful two-pronged attack!

Good luck to you!

PS --- An escapee heifer who would not learn to mind the fences was (in my opinion) the second tastiest animal we had butchered last year. Sometimes problems are your fastest way to repeat clients --- one of the families who bought that beef has already referred two other families to join our private beef program.

 

[randiliana]

Our program is this, when I'm looking at the calves for replacements.

Temperament is #1, this is a make or break deal. If she's wild she's gone. I won't even consider keeping a heifer out of a nasty cow. I don't care what her bloodline, production, fertility or looks are, if she's got a bad temperament she is culled.

Production is # 2, keep the heifers out of the consistently best cows. I have learned in the past though to avoid the 'over achievers'. For whatever reason those heifers just never seem to make good cows. Lots of times they will be HUGE when they grow up, that is if they actually get bred.

Calving Date is #3. I want them to be born in the first cycle or about 365-390 days after the cow had her last calf, and preferably out of cows that consistently calve in the first cycle. There are numerous reasons for this, Fertility, fertility, fertility....lol. By keeping heifers born in the first cycle out of consistent cows, you KNOW that their mama's are fertile, and hopefully that will pass on to the heifers.

Looks is #4, I want heifers that are Wide across the back, Deep through their body and that have good legs under them. They have to look like heifers, and like good broody cows. Remember though that calves go through growth spurts and have stages where they look like crap. So keep that in mind when you are culling on looks... I won't keep a heifer on looks alone, but I will cull one that has a poor phenotype.

As far as keeping them around AFTER they've had a calf

#1 is again Temperament, If she chases me she's gone, if she is dangerous to handle in the corral she's gone.

#2 is Fertility. If she doesn't breed back within the calving season, she is gone. And we run about a 50 day season.

#3 is Calving Ease. This will tie into Fertility as well. First off, I will say, we don't cull a heifer just because we had to assist her. 99% of heifers that were assisted the first time go on to be good productive cows that you never need to touch again. BUT, I will cull C-sections, Pulls on small calves, Hard Pulls on big calves is a harder one to decide on though, as there are 2 trains of thought there. First you DID get that big calf out of her, therefore she should be able to handle a bigger calf as she gets older... OTOH, WHY did she have a big calf, was it the bull, was it her?? We've seen heifers that had big calves go on and consistently have big calves, some of which had to be assisted...

#4 is Udders. And this could go right up to #1 place really, depends on the udder. We're commercial, so by all intents and purposes the udder doesn't matter too much to me, so long as she has enough milk and I don't have to milk her or help her calf out. I would't keep a heifer out of a bad uddered cow, but I won't cull the cow unless it is so bad I have to help things out...

#5 is Production. And that's here because in general I will give a heifer 2 chances to raise a good calf. I do have my cut off's though and if it is too substandard I won't give her another chance. I figure a 6-7 month old calf off a heifer should weigh at the very minimum 400 lbs. Anything under that would be culled here.

 

[Taurus]

Excellent advice, Randiliana!!!! Best advice on here!

 

[townfarmer]

Thanks Randiliana; more great information there. I do have a question though.

Firstly both you and Walnutcrest mentioned culling for temperament. You both specified that it was aggression that earned cattle a trip to the sale/butcher. What about nutty flighty cattle? We had a cow that was never aggressive but extremely high headed and when you applied any pressure to move the cattle anywhere she would turn and bolt. Kept her as she produced great calves etc. I finally got sick of her nonsense and sold her last year. What a difference that has made. getting cattle to go anywhere now is an absolute breeze. Is flight zone something you routinely cull for?

keep the heifers out of the consistently best cows

I love the use of the word consistent here. I think that's the key. Production over a long period as opposed to a hot streak of a couple of years.

Thanks again for the time you put into writing your reply

Andrew

 

[randiliana]

That cow wouldn't have lasted long around here. We don't have a big problem with flighty cattle, they are used to us being on the ground around them. But that cow would be considered " if she is dangerous to handle in the corral she's gone."

Consistency is probably the hardest thing to look for. And there are legitimate reasons where a cow might do good one year and not so good the next. You have to consider weather changes (drought) and health problems that you can't really blame the cow for. We will keep heifers out of heifers, and I will give the fact that heifers calves are usually smaller some consideration when deciding to keep or cull the calf.

There are a million and one things to consider, and you have to look at the animal as the whole package. You're never going to find the perfect animal, so you have to give leeway on some things to gain on others.

 

[WalnutCrest]

Thanks Randiliana; more great information there. I do have a question though.

Firstly both you and Walnutcrest mentioned culling for temperament. You both specified that it was aggression that earned cattle a trip to the sale/butcher. What about nutty flighty cattle? We had a cow that was never aggressive but extremely high headed and when you applied any pressure to move the cattle anywhere she would turn and bolt. Kept her as she produced great calves etc. I finally got sick of her nonsense and sold her last year. What a difference that has made. getting cattle to go anywhere now is an absolute breeze. Is flight zone something you routinely cull for? <snip>

Great question.

Flighty, to me, is different than dangerous.

Why are they flighty? If they're flighty because they're new to my place and are just getting used to me, then that's one thing ... if they're still flighty after having been around me and the other cows after a while then that is a whole other thing.

Case in point --- I purchased three heifers and three bred cows from a guy who was retiring from Aubracs. Awesome (!) cattle, but, due to life's twists and turns, he hadn't spent any time with his cattle for at least 4-5 years (which says a lot for their hardiness), making assessing their temperaments pre-purchase quite difficult. They'd move around in a swarm in the pasture as long as we stayed in the golf cart ... but as soon as we got out, they scattered. They were not use to seeing faces AT ALL. Anyhow, we got them home, and one of the heifers won't calm down for anything ... she's just zipping around all over the place acting as if I'm trying to eat her or something ... so, based on her behavior, that's exactly what's going to happen here in a couple of weeks. Also, one of the cows was behaving similar to the heifer at first, but the more she's around me, the calmer she's getting. Right now, they're selectively grazing a tough pasture we leased so I'm not moving them regularly (while we get our new place queued up) ... if this cow continues to improve our interaction, she'll stay around. If not, we'll look for an excuse to eat her, too. The other two heifers and the other two cows are fitting right in.

Another thing ... this fall, we got rid of a cow we wanted to use as a recip who was easy in the pasture but a bit nutty when trying to get her in the chute; the bull calf she gave us this past spring is pretty easy going in all situations though. I wouldn't be too quick to ding a kid if the parent is hard to handle.