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Hard headed.

Ellie May

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How can you make a horse be better on turns & not so hard headed? I have an Arabian (the one I talked about) & a Quarter Horse that are kinda hard to turn. The Quarter Horse isn't too bad, she is pretty good except when she goes into a gallop. She can be hard headed. Any advice?
Thanx Ya'll,
Ellie May
 

Jake

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Most horses are "hard headed" when they are in a full gallop their ability to stop and turn illudes them. Just work it out of them it will take time and energy... Don't let them walk in straight lines when your riding spin circles and such.
 

CopeMan

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My advice is to jerk them reins and let that horse know where you want to go. The only real answer is experience.
 
A

Anonymous

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CopeMan":13s1npns said:
My advice is to jerk them reins and let that horse know where you want to go. The only real answer is experience.
Maybe you best take some advice from Jake before the animal rights people go after you.
 

jfont

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Go to http://www.horsetrainingvideos.com
The trainers name is Larry Trocha. If you log in to his web site you can submit questions and get good answers in a few days, or you can get his roll back and spin video. I've seen this tape and it gives good techniques to put a handle on a horse.
I've seen myself fight for hours to show a horse something, and someone come over a do some little trick an get the right response in no time.
About the best advice I've been given is: If you act as if you only have an hour, it may take you all day; if you act as if you have all day it may only take an hour.
 

Linda

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It's not so much the horse being hard headed. You need to back up in your training routine. If you have trouble controlling the horse at a gallop, then your groundwork and training at a walk, etc., need to be repeated. Don't just back up one step. Start at the beginning and work with the horse through each step, reinforcing everything. Patience and practice. Don't skip steps!
 
A

Anonymous

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I agree with everyone except jerk. Daughter has an appy that had been contested in a twisted wire sliding gag with 8" shanks! Ruined her mouth. Jess started her over riding hunter classes(lots of leg) mare now has buttons that neither myself or wife can find, Reins are still usless.
 

R.T.

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Start off slow ride in brush. You need to use the same signals each time.
Rein pressure, slight body lean into the turning direction, knee pressure, and a gentle pressure from dull spurs. You can slowly increase your speed when you see improvement in your horses response to signals. It just takes time cowboys don't learn it in one day neither do cow horses.
 

Ellie May

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Ok I don't know much about bits, but what is the best bit to use in western pleasure & barrels. Right now I'm using a curb bit, with rollie bars. She does pretty good, I use to use a snaffle then went up to a curb. Any suggestions?
Ellie May
 
A

Anonymous

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I wouldn't recommend barrels until you gain control of the horse.
 

Running Arrow Bill

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Anonymous":nls11m2z said:
CopeMan":nls11m2z said:
My advice is to jerk them reins and let that horse know where you want to go. The only real answer is experience.
Maybe you best take some advice from Jake before the animal rights people go after you.

Guest! Didn't see anything cruel or abusive about "jerking the reins"! (of course there are all levels of "jerk"--I'm not talking here about heavy, severe jerking that could injure a horses mouth). Since you don't identify yourself--are you sure you're not one of the PETA activists??
 
A

Anonymous

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To the person who recommended jerking on their horse--you are the JERK. Jerking on a horse NEVER IMPROVES ANYTHING and causes a horse to be afraid of their face. The person with this original question needs to go back to basics then learn to use a support rein to get this horse to rein. Going from a ring snaffle to a curb bit, ESPECIALLY a longer shank curb bit is confusing to a horse. A ring snaffle bit (used correctly) is a direct rein; a curb bit is used for neck reining, creates a squeeze between bit and chin strap. 'Down pressure' is created, and the horse most likely has not made that transition and is confused at the different 'feel'. Use a very short shank bit, and either a broken mouthpiece or loose shanks. Learn about your support rein and you should be able to get this horse to rein nicely.

To the JERK-ER, put a bit in your mouth and let someone jerk on it.
 
A

Anonymous

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Kudos to you faster horses, took all the words right out of my mouth!

The reason that your horse is not turning at the gallop because he is stretched out, weight on the forehand, not collected, not listening to you and you are not in control. Could make for a very embarrassing barrel run! Bottom line is that you are not safe.

I would go back to the snaffle, or even the halter and stand beside his shoulder facing front. Put a very light pressure on the rein on that side and wait. When he brings his face even the slightest around to you, release. You have to concentrate in order to release immediately. Repeat until he gives his face all the way around to you. Then do the other side. Even though this is a standing still exercise, its hard for the horse whose neck muscles are not used to it.
Then stand facing his shoulder and add rein pressure on that side up by his withers and look at his shoulder. When he gives, hold the pressure and don't release until he moves his front foot away from you. What is happening is that the horse wants to relieve his neck muscles and he learned that when he gave his face to you in the first lesson, he was relieved by the release (rewarded) In the 2nd lesson, the horse is looking for release, but when you don't release, he'll move his feet to find release...then release.. When he has one side down pat, do the other. When you progress to getting him to turning a small circle and coming to face you, then you release. This is the one rein stop and if trained well, it will give you the necessary brakes that you need in all situations.
You are teaching him to not only listen to you and the rein, but to give to it, train his muscles to bend and be more flexible and you are also training him to become ambidextrous and able to give equally on both sides. You should never apply rein pressure on both reins at the same time.
You won't be able to do all this in one lesson, but I still think you will be surprised at how fast it can go. Tell him when he's good, that really helps speed up the learning process...encouragement.
When you arrive at this point, get on him and do the same thing again. If you have done your homework, with the slightest rein pressure he should swing his head right around to your foot, either side. Forget the curb and definitely use the snaffle. Then go out and find some bushes to go around out on the trail as this will help the horse make sense of why he learned all this. Do nice circles around those bushes and don't let him drop his shoulder. Good luck!
 
A

Anonymous

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Kudos to you faster horses, took all the words right out of my mouth!

The reason that your horse is not turning at the gallop because he is stretched out, weight on the forehand, not collected, not listening to you and you are not in control. Could make for a very embarrassing barrel run! Bottom line is that you are not safe.

I would go back to the snaffle, or even the halter and stand beside his shoulder facing front. Put a very light pressure on the rein on that side and wait. When he brings his face even the slightest around to you, release. You have to concentrate in order to release immediately. Repeat until he gives his face all the way around to you. Then do the other side. Even though this is a standing still exercise, its hard for the horse whose neck muscles are not used to it.
Then stand facing his shoulder and add rein pressure on that side and look at his shoulder. When he gives, hold the pressure and don't release until he moves his front foot away from you. What is happening is that the horse wants to relieve his neck muscles and he learned that when he gave his face to you in the first lesson, he was relieved by the release (rewarded) In the 2nd lesson, the horse is looking for release, but when you don't release, he'll move his feet to find release...then release.. When he has one side down pat, do the other. When you progress to getting him to turning a small circle and coming to face you, then you release. This is the one rein stop and if trained well, it will give you the necessary brakes that you need in all situations.
You are teaching him to not only listen to you and the rein, but to give to it, train his muscles to bend and be more flexible and you are also training him to become ambidextrous and able to give equally on both sides. You should never apply rein pressure on both reins at the same time.
You won't be able to do all this in one lesson, but I still think you will be surprised at how fast it can go. Tell him when he's good, that really helps speed up the learning process...encouragement.
When you arrive at this point, get on him and do the same thing again. If you have done your homework, with the slightest rein pressure he should swing his head right around to your foot, either side. Forget the curb and definitely use the snaffle. Then go out and find some bushes to go around out on the trail as this will help the horse make sense of why he learned all this. Do nice circles around those bushes and don't let him drop his shoulder. Good luck
 

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