Federal ID Program

[Alan]

One of them is that we in the industry must be responsive to customer demands. However, the beef customer is not demanding a Federal ID program. A bunch of pencil-necked bureaucrats, Japs and activists are demanding it. Along with the sensationalist press.

Craig,

Don't you think that some system like this is needed? If we have even a few head show up positive by the time the media gets done, the pork and chicken people will be lovin it.

Also not to step on any toes, but like many on this board, my life does not depend on the few head I raise and sell. My wife and I work to support our "hobby". This post is the first I have heard of the ID system, and I do support it, but the the couple of grand I gross on my cattle a year it's not worth me being pro-active. So it wasn't necassary for me to hear it any earlier. On the other hand I'm very pro-active on anything relating to our business. In short I'm motivated by the dollar and will do what it takes to improve our business or protect it (almost anything). In the cattle industry I, like many, am a ant and will confirm to the rules set forth. It's up to you guys that "make your living, or a good part of it, to take the pro-active roles. I agree with some on this post that it sounds like it's comming, in fact it sounds like it's pretty much here, from what Geogia has told us. So if I was to care about this for my business sake I would try to figure out how to continue to make money with it, not just say I won't ship or I'll hate it... people are resistant to change, but hey, things always change, roll with it.

Just my opinion
Alan

 

[Alan]

Sorry Craig the second paragraph on my last post is not directed at you. It's just my opinion.

Alan

 

[houstoncutter]

Fellas have any of you been to a large packing plant? If you have you will no why Id numbers wont work. When they are making hamburger they mix meat from many steers at one time. That is why the packers are fighting COOL so much. It wouldnt be business as usual. They couldnt mix animals together. Rodney

 

[Wewild]

Sorry Craig the second paragraph on my last post is not directed at you. It's just my opinion.

I guess me then.

I'll hate it...

It is Ok not to accept or like or agree with an enforced policy that is not voted on by the population. I think our first instance of this was the Boston Tea Party.

In the cattle industry I, like many, am a ant and will confirm to the rules set forth.

Just my opinion
Alan

 

[georgia beef]

Chuck, you make several excellent points. One of them is that we in the industry must be responsive to customer demands. However, the beef customer is not demanding a Federal ID program. A bunch of pencil-necked bureaucrats, Japs and activists are demanding it. Along with the sensationalist press. They eat tofu, not beef. I would venture to guess that 999 out of 1,000 beef consumers couldn’t care less about traceability and never give it a thought. Of course that doesn’t change the odds of it being mandated some day. JMO.

Craig-TX

Your Exactlly right the General Public is not giving any thought to a Federal I D...At know time when the media broke the news about possible disease did it hurt the beef sales at the retail level...there are already safeguards to protect the nations food supply from the federal to the state government...ANd it is working therefore if something isn't broke why fix it...

 

[TheBullLady]

Well, I realize many don't consider me a "real" cattleperson, but I'll voice my opinion regardless.

I will comply with COOL when it's implemented, and I'm sure there will be a LOT of complications and bumps in the road. Anything with this magnatude is not going to go smoothly until it's implemented and everyone can see how it's going to work out. I also keep records on my cattle, so it's not that much of a difference for me.

I've heard cattlepeople mention one of the biggest reasons they don't like COOL is for tax purposes.. in other words "I don't want the government to know how many cows I have and when I sell them". Is this a viable concern do you think?

 

[mbdear]

TBL...seems to me that you have a good relationship with your cattle. I am sure you know yours and their limits and take it all into account in your activities with them. Don't let the negatives get you down. What you do may not be right for everyone but its a choice for you alone.

mbdear
East Texas

 

[Texan]

Well, I realize many don't consider me a "real" cattleperson, but I'll voice my opinion regardless.

BullLady, I think you're a "real" cattleperson. You understand ranching better than a lot of the people on these Boards. Now, I don't agree with you getting so close to your stock. But, you know what? It's none of my business!

 

[Alan]

Bull Lady!

I'll throw in with the last two post also, especially the none of anybody's business part. This board is full of opinions and you know what they say about opinions... they're like feet, everyone got a couple but they usally stink. (or like butt.s and...).

From the guy that has his nose bloodied on this board on a regular basis!

Have a great Thanksgiving all!

Alan

 

[georgia beef]

It will be interesting to see how it all turns out...

At any rate it's time to turn the Beagles loose and do a little Rabbit Hunting.. Happy Thanksgiving to all

 

[Oldtimer]

Well, I realize many don't consider me a "real" cattleperson, but I'll voice my opinion regardless.

I will comply with COOL when it's implemented, and I'm sure there will be a LOT of complications and bumps in the road. Anything with this magnatude is not going to go smoothly until it's implemented and everyone can see how it's going to work out. I also keep records on my cattle, so it's not that much of a difference for me.

I've heard cattlepeople mention one of the biggest reasons they don't like COOL is for tax purposes.. in other words "I don't want the government to know how many cows I have and when I sell them". Is this a viable concern do you think?

Bull lady-- COOL and mandatory ID are two seperate and different things-COOL is for labeling meat as to its country of origin--It is for the benefit of both the producer and the consumer... Mandatory ID is for being able to trace back diseased animals from slaughter (or death) thru all its previous owners to where it was born-- It cannot be used to traceback your steak you buy to tell you what farm it came from- It cannot be used by a producer to get slaughter info back on his cattle--It is strictly for ID in case of health issue---This came to light not only because of the BSE cases but with the possibility of bio-terrorism against our US cattle and dairy industries.

Under the current COOL law use of mandatory ID for just COOL is forbidden-- Any imported beef and imported cattle would be marked and segregated- all other beef would be considered domestic.......The direct cost to US producers would be minimal- any increased cost would go to the feeders, packers, and retailers that use, produce or sell imported meat or cattle-- they would be required to maintain records, segregate, and label the meat as to which country it comes from. If they do not use or sell imported meat they have no additional cost...Much of this could be cheaply and easily done now if USDA would not allow packers and retailers to remove the foreign markings and labeling and replace with US labeling...

I too have heard concerns about mandatory ID being used by the government and meatpackers for snidely reasons.... Just some of the concerns I've heard mentioned are:

1. IRS will use it to tell how many cows you have or have sold

2. Government will use it to find out how many cows you are running on a government lease (BLM, Forest Service, State).

3. Packers will use their battery of high paid attornies to shift blame to the feedlot or rancher in case of a disease related law suit..ex. ecoli outbreak......

As I posted in the above post- Congress is working to cover some of these concerns......

 

[txag]

It cannot be used by a producer to get slaughter info back on his cattle

i was under the impression it could. not necessarily that it would, but could. & why not? all the info will be there so why would it be so hard to give the info to the producer who wanted it (and possibly was willing to pay for it?)

 

[Oldtimer]

It cannot be used by a producer to get slaughter info back on his cattle

i was under the impression it could. not necessarily that it would, but could. & why not? all the info will be there so why would it be so hard to give the info to the producer who wanted it (and possibly was willing to pay for it?)

TxAg- My understanding is because of the privacy issue- The only ones available to the traceback will be the government agencies and then only if a health issue is involved--

That said, there are many companies out there offering a traceback system ID- but everyone in the chain of ownership has to buy into those programs to make them work (cow/calf man, stocker, feeder, and packer).... these along with some of the branded beef programs will offer the producer and consumer info.....
But the Mandatory ID now being proposed by APHIS is just for health and disease traceback--

 

[Craig-TX]

Well, I realize many don't consider me a "real" cattleperson, but I'll voice my opinion regardless. I will comply with COOL when it's implemented...

Same here. If it happens it happens and we, the peon producers, will have to deal with it. I hope it doesn’t happen because, as Jake pointed out on another thread, the government can’t even track humans (illegal aliens) so what makes anybody think they can track cattle. More regs never helped anything. The system will be wrought with fraud, ineptitude and expenses borne by the producer. Oh well, time will tell.

Craig-TX

 

[Campground Cattle]

Might just call it quits and raise hay. will have to wait and see. I can't believe that Uncle Sam getting involved with and not being FUBAR and costly. We know who will pay the cost we will. This is getting to be to much big brother.

 

[georgia beef]

Well like it or not the program is coming.. There s so many regulations in this country now that we are putting ourselves out of business on every sector... And like other Government programs that sound good this one will also take on a snowball affect...Who will pay for the program the consumer and the cattlemen...

 

[bolsen]

this is a shady program if you ask me I can't believe it's coming to this

 

[twp]

Ok, I have stood back and watched these post snowball and I have got to speak up. I work for the cattlemen's assocation in Arkansas, and I do alot more reading than posting. But I will tell you what the ACA, and what our board members are doing and our aproch to this thing. First and Formost, this has to remain privite, no one, and I mean no one needs to know where your cattle are or how many you have unless there is some type of out break. Let me define outbreak, BSE is not a disease that can be transmitted from cow to cow or Mother to offspring. Most of you know that already. But let's just think of what would happen if a case of hoof and mouth was found in the US. If it happened in Arkansas then they will shut down any amimal that came through that state and locate any animal that came through the state on any truck, that means anything East of Arkansas. Next is that Id has to move at Market Pace. If it slows the barns down, then that will affect prices and will affect our bottom line as cattlemen. Next thing is Cost. If it cost alot then most small farmers will get rid of there cattle and putting in pine trees, (at leat in AR anyway). Our out look on tagging cattle is that they should not have to be tagged untill they enter commerce(auction barn). I am sure that if you want your cattle tagged the barns will do it for you at a fee. These things that are mentioned are what the Majority of Arkansas wants. We are curently working on a plan to put primice Id in place on a volentary basis. This thing is going to take place, the government has said so, and it is also the ground work for cool. We can't stop this train, so we can get on and help direct it, or get run over by the government, only you can decide. I encourage everyone to join an association of somekind, what ever you think, the government will only listen to us as groups not as one person. We speak in numbers, not by ourselves.

 

[Dave]

I just hear this morning about a person who APHIS put in charge of implementing this program in a certain state. That news has renewed my faith in the ability of the government to make lots of noise and smoke but get nothing done. This program is coming but no time soon. On the other hand, with people like this in charge we all need to get involved in this process. This is a program that we are going to have to live with so we better be the ones designing it. It is either that or a system designed by the packers or one designed by inept government employees.

Dave

 

[Campground Cattle]

Ok, I have stood back and watched these post snowball and I have got to speak up. I work for the cattlemen's assocation in Arkansas, and I do alot more reading than posting. But I will tell you what the ACA, and what our board members are doing and our aproch to this thing. First and Formost, this has to remain privite, no one, and I mean no one needs to know where your cattle are or how many you have unless there is some type of out break. Let me define outbreak, BSE is not a disease that can be transmitted from cow to cow or Mother to offspring. Most of you know that already. But let's just think of what would happen if a case of hoof and mouth was found in the US. If it happened in Arkansas then they will shut down any amimal that came through that state and locate any animal that came through the state on any truck, that means anything East of Arkansas. Next is that Id has to move at Market Pace. If it slows the barns down, then that will affect prices and will affect our bottom line as cattlemen. Next thing is Cost. If it cost alot then most small farmers will get rid of there cattle and putting in pine trees, (at leat in AR anyway). Our out look on tagging cattle is that they should not have to be tagged untill they enter commerce(auction barn). I am sure that if you want your cattle tagged the barns will do it for you at a fee. These things that are mentioned are what the Majority of Arkansas wants. We are curently working on a plan to put primice Id in place on a volentary basis. This thing is going to take place, the government has said so, and it is also the ground work for cool. We can't stop this train, so we can get on and help direct it, or get run over by the government, only you can decide. I encourage everyone to join an association of somekind, what ever you think, the government will only listen to us as groups not as one person. We speak in numbers, not by ourselves.

Most common sense post I have read, sounds workable. Your right about the cost to the small operator, the average ranch is running 35 to 50 head in my area most would be forced out.