Eric Garner Case

[greybeard]

Personally coming for LE background I think that hold was a little extreme. He had a choke hold what you would use on UFC. We were taught to utilize pressure points and the only time we choked someone was to save their live from swallowing drugs. I guess different departments use different protocol but I feel as it was a little extreme and am in no way defending the fact that he was resisting. I just think better judgement could have been used.

That particular "hold" had been barred from the departmental protocol well before this happened.

 

[greybeard]

In this case the grand jury might have got it wrong. I have watched the video, and the big dude didn't cooperate but he wasn't the least bit aggressive either. I have heard they were there to bust him for selling single cigs, but there is talk of him breaking up a fight on the video. So I don't know which brought the police to him. But once they had him down with several cops on him, and he was gasping "I can't breathe", the cop didn't appear to release his hold at all. Then he was out cold, laying there dying, and they just stood there for a long, long time. It was hard to watch.

I have some sympathy for the cops, he was big as a hoss, and I would hate to be the one who had to put cuffs on him. And who would think such a big strong looking guy would be so "delicate" due to his asthma. But even a mistake, not intending to kill him, he ended up dead over a very minor offense and that should have some consequences.

I switched over to CNN to watch the new Mike Rowe show, but it isn't on, they are covering protests in New York. And it's a real protest, civil disobedience laying in the street, not a fire or a looting in sight.

Considering this is NY, that kind of protest may have a lot more affect to the economy if it is still going on tomorrow morning when all the work traffic starts moving.

I have thoughts on this, but no sense saying them except this very thing has happened before, will happen again, and I am quite confident not much will come of it. It is (by far) not 'the norm' but it has come to be viewed as a kind of 'acceptable collateral damage'.

 

[Red Bull Breeder]

Reckon having been arrested 31 times before would have any thing to do with how he was handled??

 

[Ryder]

I wonder if these so called young black men would get by better if they obeyed the law, I mean I'm just throwing that out there. Maybe if they stopped committing crimes they would have better relations with the police, I don't know, guess I'm just feeling silly tonight and thought I'd post something foolish.Larry

You did. :lol: :lol: :lol:

 

[greybeard]

Reckon having been arrested 31 times before would have any thing to do with how he was handled??

I'm sure the officers called in and asked in advance how many times he had been arrested--before they applied the hold.
May I ask?
What's the magic cutoff #? 1--2-20= if he had only been arrested 3 times would he have been handled differently? 29? 4? 0?
Not rhetorical questions--I'd like an answer.

 

[larryshoat]

Reckon having been arrested 31 times before would have any thing to do with how he was handled??

I'm sure the officers called in and asked in advance how many times he had been arrested--before they applied the hold.
May I ask?
What's the magic cutoff #? 1--2-20= if he had only been arrested 3 times would he have been handled differently? 29? 4? 0?
Not rhetorical questions--I'd like an answer.

My guess is that if he had held it to 30 times he would still be alive. Obey The Law and they probably won't have any trouble.

Larry

 

[Sunfish]

What were the priors ?
Arrested 31 times and still walking free
Chances are the policeman had a previous encounter with him and decided that's the approach that was required
If your overweight and have health issues then maybe you shouldn't take chances of being arrested by breaking the law
Looks like he was eating well and probably on taxpayer dime
I'd say the world is a better place without him
Is that heartless ?
Maybe but we've created this by becoming soft and allowing the crooks, cheats and the lazy to manipulate the system designed to help the needy

He was burden on society and brought it on himself
No one should be responsible for a fat criminal dying because he was obese

 

[skyhightree1]

despite some of yalls hollyier than thou attitudes there is family members in yalls family that are on govt tits and frequent flyers to jails or prisons.. I wonder if that was your family members would you all have that attitude... let me answer that for y'all... nope y'all would not its easy to pass judgment on others.

 

[skyhightree1]

Larry despite obeying the law you can still have problems. I was in a place in my state driving my wife's SUV which at the time had big chrome rims and dark tint all legal. I was pulled the tobacco chewing bigots came to my window and asked me where the drugs were and not to make any fast moves or they would blow my MF head off boy. I advised themmy wallet was in console and prefer they get the wallet he agreed after he made me step out pushing me up against the car and bumping my head. he saw my badge and said were sorry why didn't you say something..I just joked it off till I was out of there laughing and talking till they needed to go cause I was scared they'd kill or hurt me if they thought I was gonna challenge them. y'all know I am no gangster or crook and I had problems with police and I was 1 of them. oh and BTW my # of arrests to this day is 0 did I deserve it?

 

[3waycross]

Larry despite obeying the law you can still have problems. I was in a place in my state driving my wife's SUV which at the time had big chrome rims and dark tint all legal. I was pulled the tobacco chewing bigots came to my window and asked me where the drugs were and not to make any fast moves or they would blow my MF head off boy. I advised themmy wallet was in console and prefer they get the wallet he agreed after he made me step out pushing me up against the car and bumping my head. he saw my badge and said were sorry why didn't you say something..I just joked it off till I was out of there laughing and talking till they needed to go cause I was scared they'd kill or hurt me if they thought I was gonna challenge them. y'all know I am no gangster or crook and I had problems with police and I was 1 of them. oh and BTW my # of arrests to this day is 0 did I deserve it?

no

 

[Commercialfarmer]

I have a lot of reservations about this case, especially knowing some facts about the officer and precinct.

Care to elaborate?

I read several things about this case when it happened. I'll try to find some of it, when I'm on something besides my little phone.

I believe the guy was only there because he broke up a fight, if memory serves me correctly.



For those judging by his record, I'm a believer in looking at past history. Yes, he's been arrested a lot, but I don't recall them being violent reasons. If we look at his, we need to look at the cops as well.. he has been accused of being out of line aggressive/dangerous.

Initial known information left me doubting that the cop was just doing his job.

I agree Larry as is often the case, keeping your nose clean leads to a longer, less problematic life. But I think there may be a lesson here for the over zealous police officer if that is the case. Death may not have been intended, but it was a result and my early opinion is that it was likely very unnecessary.

 

[Commercialfarmer]

Larry despite obeying the law you can still have problems. I was in a place in my state driving my wife's SUV which at the time had big chrome rims and dark tint all legal. I was pulled the tobacco chewing bigots came to my window and asked me where the drugs were and not to make any fast moves or they would blow my MF head off boy. I advised themmy wallet was in console and prefer they get the wallet he agreed after he made me step out pushing me up against the car and bumping my head. he saw my badge and said were sorry why didn't you say something..I just joked it off till I was out of there laughing and talking till they needed to go cause I was scared they'd kill or hurt me if they thought I was gonna challenge them. y'all know I am no gangster or crook and I had problems with police and I was 1 of them. oh and BTW my # of arrests to this day is 0 did I deserve it?

You don't have to be brown to get that treatment. Sometimes being young, driving the wrong truck, talking with an accent, or getting off work after midnight will draw the wrong attention. I've dealt with more than one, and it's not a great feeling knowing that a judge would take their word over mine or that they carry a gun.

Can't even count how many times my truck was illegally searched.

Bad cops exist, really bad. That's what makes the Ferguson situation such a joke. There are hundreds of real abuse of forces each day the media could actually cover.

 

[Jogeephus]

Larry despite obeying the law you can still have problems. I was in a place in my state driving my wife's SUV which at the time had big chrome rims and dark tint all legal. I was pulled the tobacco chewing bigots came to my window and asked me where the drugs were and not to make any fast moves or they would blow my MF head off boy. I advised themmy wallet was in console and prefer they get the wallet he agreed after he made me step out pushing me up against the car and bumping my head. he saw my badge and said were sorry why didn't you say something..I just joked it off till I was out of there laughing and talking till they needed to go cause I was scared they'd kill or hurt me if they thought I was gonna challenge them. y'all know I am no gangster or crook and I had problems with police and I was 1 of them. oh and BTW my # of arrests to this day is 0 did I deserve it?

You don't have to be brown to get that treatment. Sometimes being young, driving the wrong truck, talking with an accent, or getting off work after midnight will draw the wrong attention. I've dealt with more than one, and it's not a great feeling knowing that a judge would take their word over mine or that they carry a gun.

Can't even count how many times my truck was illegally searched.

Bad cops exist, really bad. That's what makes the Ferguson situation such a joke. There are hundreds of real abuse of forces each day the media could actually cover.

I agree. What puzzles me Sky is why you'd have your wife riding around in a vehicle that looked like it belonged to an unlicensed pharmaceutical sales rep and not expect anything less? Sure its legal to have that bling on your car. Its also legal for your wife to go around wearing leopard skin-tight mini-skirts and wear fish net stockings and spike high heels but doesn't that project an image the police might find questionable? He77, she might even have strange men offering her money.

I know of someone else who often complains of police harassment. This person has a big pot leaf plastered on their rear window of their car and they complain constantly about police harassing them. And they are WHITE! So maybe just maybe its not a race thing. Maybe some people are just so obtuse they can't grasp the concept that your appearance has a lot to do with people's perception of you. But maybe some people just enjoy tempting fate and complaining they are a victim.

 

[greybeard]

Maybe Joe, it's called predjudicial profiling. It can be any kind of profiling--not just DWB.
At one time, the highest cop in my county had the distinction of being the only US law enforcement officer to ever serve time in a federal prison for waterboarding the prisoners he pulled over--pulled over based on having a K101 FM radio station (rock station) bumper sticker on the back of their car. He and his deputies waterboarded to get a confession for non-existent trumped up charge. When it all fell apart, and he went to the big house, t he county ended up paying a huge federal civil rights fine after a federal suit was filed in conjuction with DoJ--so big, we have to pay it off in installments of $44,000 per year spread out to over 100 different plaintiffs till it's paid off -done that way, because we are a poor county and paying it all lump sum would have bankrupted the county.

Profiling--such a wonderful throw back to the past.

 

[greybeard]

Several members of congress (white members btw--before someone says they're racially motivated) have requested Dept of Justice investigate the whole Garner case--including how thoroughly the prosecutor presented his case against the officer. DoJ has already begun that investigation according to the Attorney General Holder, and his soon to be replacement has said she will continue it if it isn't wrapped up by the time she takes office.
This isn't over yet.

 

[inyati13]

The tide looks like it is building!

 

[skyhightree1]

no doubt there's bad cops that harass no matter what race you are. I just wanted to share my incident.

Jo like you say its legal to have it. because she had something that is profiled as a rolling pharmacy.. that doesn't warrant the right to be mistreated... we are still in america... what's left of it.
:2cents:
my last post about it. :tiphat:

 

[Sunfish]

An obese career criminal dies and everyone jumps on the bandwagon
All while innocent people are murdered everyday by the same type criminal and no one even cares

Jumping on the bandwagon I believe is the term ?

 

[highgrit]

I'm with Jogeephus on the ride issue, why put yourself in that position? To me selling smokes one at a time, tax free isn't a big deal. I would like to know if any of his 30 other arrests were for felonies, and how many felony convictions he has on his record. If he has more than 3 felony convictions on his record he's where he belongs. IMO Does anyone believe that the cop tried to kill this guy by choking him down? I don't, but yes he probably used excessive force.

 

[larryshoat]

Larry despite obeying the law you can still have problems. I was in a place in my state driving my wife's SUV which at the time had big chrome rims and dark tint all legal. I was pulled the tobacco chewing bigots came to my window and asked me where the drugs were and not to make any fast moves or they would blow my MF head off boy. I advised themmy wallet was in console and prefer they get the wallet he agreed after he made me step out pushing me up against the car and bumping my head. he saw my badge and said were sorry why didn't you say something..I just joked it off till I was out of there laughing and talking till they needed to go cause I was scared they'd kill or hurt me if they thought I was gonna challenge them. y'all know I am no gangster or crook and I had problems with police and I was 1 of them. oh and BTW my # of arrests to this day is 0 did I deserve it?

No you didn't deserve that, but you didn't let it escalate either, in short sky you're not a thug criminal. I'm not saying there are not some problems, but I am saying that if folks would not break the law that they would have much less trouble. I'm no expert, I'm just stating what I see as the obvious answer. As far as my family if one of they were arrested 31 times, if they robbed a convenience store and were killed by the police, yes I would be heart broken but not surprised, my first thought would not be blame the police. Not trying to offend, you can read my sig line, I've had it for years, the young folks that work for me hear it daily. I'm not trying to tell people how to change the world, I'm just trying to say how to stay out of trouble.

Larry