Downed Steer....Nervous Coccidiosis? Polio?

[bpwagner115]

Noticed a steer (approx. 6-700lb) last night at feeding time who was away from the bunks. Watched him for a while and he acted nervous, pacing and then laying down somewhat awkwardly and then getting back up. Walked a little uncordinated at times and at times looked like he didn't have a good sense of balance. By just looking at the animal there is no way to tell he is sick, probly one of the top 5 animals in the pen. Coughing occasionally after running him up to the yard.

About a month and a half ago I saw something very similar to this and as I approached the animal that was laying down he jumped up and ran in to eat. Never gave it much thought. The next day the animal was on the ground again and had completely lost its sense of balance and could not stand up. Would kick his legs but could not stand. Head movement was again very uncoordinated. Animal had plenty of energy and was putting forth effort to try standing. Dead by the next morning.

Both animals acted very similar. Called the vet and he thought nervous coccidiosis or polio so we are treating for both. Anyone have experiences with either?

 

[Gale Seddon]

I'd never heard of "nervous coccidiosis" before this. What are you treating the steer with?

Found this on the polio; seems related to sulfur toxicity?
http://vetmed.iastate.edu/diagnostic-la ... -can-be-ca

Must have been terrible watching the other one struggle. Hope this one makes it. Please post progress?

 

[regolith]

Could be polio. I haven't heard of nervous coccidiosis either, normal coccidiosis should cause scours (which would be visible) and behaviour change would be due to dehydration and weakness (and sore guts).

Treating either effectively should bring the animal round within 24 hours. If you don't see fast recovery after treatment I'd hazard a guess it's not polio or regular coccidiosis.

 

[bpwagner115]

Here is a link with infor on Nervous Coccidiosis. Seems like it is a condition that exists in addition to coccidiosis and the calf definately does not have scours. Seems like what I have found on the web has led me to think its sulfur toxicity. We just started including DDG into our rations last summer and we have been close to 50:50 in terms of a shelled corn/DDG ratio since weaning our calves. Doesn't make sense though because our feed rep said some guys go 100% DDG for calves who are just weaned.

http://www.iowabeefcenter.org/Docs_heal ... diosis.pdf

 

[Anonymous]

Not knowing a lot about ddgs I'd be Leary of feeding 100%. And I'd sure as heck double check what your "rep" was telling you. Don't forget he's still trying to sell a product.

 

[Gale Seddon]

Could there be a connection between the DDG and the onset of the neuro problems? I don't have a clue, but just a thought.

Did the vet draw blood for CBC/Chem? Might that provide some information? (Re-read your post and now wonder if the vet saw the animal in person). Any chance you had a necropsy on the first dead one? If this one dies (and I sure hope it does not), I'd sure look into getting that done.

Seems a shame to lose animals that are half-way grown.

 

[regolith]

Well no doubt someone'll get annoyed at me for saying so... looks like nervous coccidiocis is polio when they can't figure out the cause.
That was an informative link.

What sort of time frame between introducing the new ration and seeing signs on these two calves? My initial reading on polio was pre-internet days (for me - 2003 I think) and at that time it was thought to be triggered by an interruption in the availability of thiamine in the rumen... overproduction of thiaminase if I recall rightly. I left that reading with the impression that any change/hunger/stress/toxin, anything that interrupted normal eating and digestion could trigger this, though obviously that was not the case since most animals can endure a day's hunger or a diet change without getting sick. We never did get to the cause but thiamine injections were an effective treatment, and in the end we injected the whole herd as a preventative measure.

I'll second what hook said. Your rep is trying to sell the product, and you don't know the details of those guys feeding 100%, for all you know they could be seeing 2 - 3 cases a month of polio or feeding a lower poundage and more hay.

 

[bpwagner115]

The vet never made it out to look at the animal but made it pretty clear he felt it was one of the two. The more I think about the two cases, the less i find in common. The first calf that died was 5-6 days post weaning and ration of DDG had just started. It has been close to 2 months since weaning and we have slowly increased to somewhere around 6lb of DDG (along with shelled corn, hay, and corn sileage) per head per day with no problems up till this point.

No blood was drawn from the previous animal as we attributed it to shipping fever or something that was correlated more with the stress of weaning. Hindsight is 20/20 but I wish we would have. If he doesn't make it we certainly will.

As of tonight the animal looks fine, not noticably unbalanced. Still no loose stool. Feed ration is going to consist of sileage and shelled corn, obviously no DDG for the time being. Noticed another steer in the yard laying while all others were standing, prior to feeding. I hate to sound too cautious, but anytime 100 animals are standing and waiting to be fed and one is laying....generally i must assume something is not right. We took that calf's number and we will see what we have tomorrow.

 

[regolith]

it's good to keep an eye on things. I noted from the first post that you picked up the problem very early, better that than losing a calf and wondering what happened.

 

[jerry27150]

there was an article in a farm magazine a couple of years ago about a feedlot in iowa that was feeding ddg & he lost a lot of steers before he figured out what caused it.

 

[milkmaid]

Has the rest of the ration been tested for sulfur levels? tested the water? I wouldn't assume that the only place minerals come from is what you deliberately add to the feed. Do you remember if this steer tends to eat more or less than the others? ie was he always first to the bunk and did he spend all day there? Is the steer currently drinking? eating? and if so, what is he eating?

I've seen cattle with acidosis display neurological symptoms, but you'd see scours as well if that were the case. Have you taken a temp on the steer? a high fever can result in weakness, resembling neurological signs. It might be polio, but it might also be pneumonia or meningitis. And without any other information, the rest of the possibilities might range from lead poisoning to salt toxicity to a right displaced abomasum. Nervous ketosis would have to be a secondary problem but that will also cause neurological signs. Anytime an animal is ill and/or running a fever and/or off feed and/or has an electrolyte imbalance, symptoms can include poor coordination and staggering.

 

[bpwagner115]

Vet stopped by last night as he was in the neighborhood to take a look. Ruled out Polio almost immediately, he said the first sign of polio is for the animal to lose eyesight. Animal looks and acts fine. Vet asked if he was kicking at his stomach at all when we saw him the other night and I remembered seeing him do it a couple times. He said it could have been a gas colic? Never heard of such a thing but he said the animal is in alot of discomfort and would explain why he wasn't interested in eating and kept standing up, laying down, and acted restless.

Also figured out we are only feeding about half the amount of Rumenscin we should be feeding, and it's my understanding Rumenscin is supposed to help in the prevention of coccidiosis. Vet mentioned a detox program designed to manage coccidiosis that has to be fed for 30 days. He was going to price it and let us decide. If we can do it for under $10 a head it might not be a bad idea. We did have a case of coccidiosis two years ago and lost 3 head before we knew what happened. At $1000 dollars a head you can't really afford to let them start laying over.

The more I look at it, maybe these two sick calves are totally different cases. Seems the first was a likely candidate for shipping fever since it was less than a week after weaning.

 

[Lucky_P]

You mis-heard the vet.
Deccox (decoquinate), not detox.
It is a coccidiostat - but I'm not sure that you also get the enhanced feed-efficiency effect that Rumensin or Bovatec provide in addition to reducing coccidia oocyst shedding.

 

[Calman]

Could be tetanus? Lost a young steer with tetaus years ago. When I first noticed it it wouldnt eat. But still looked full.Which was bloat.Soon it lost controll of it's muscles. Walked stiff legged and would loose balance and stagger.


Cal

 

[krazynot2]

I have a holstein bull calf, he is 2 months old, was doing well, I put a fresh new alfalfa bale in the feeder and he seemed good. The next morning I came out and he was laying on the ground looking dopey, with his head down. I had to help him stand up and he seemed bloated on one side. The top right hand side of his back is hard. He will not eat anything, we have to tube feed him water to keep fluids in him. He hasn't been able to have a bowel movement until this afternoon, I was rubbing/patting his stomach and he started to try to go, there was only a thick mucus that was coming out of his rear. I have been checking on him every hour on the hour to stand him up and rub/pat his stomach, just an hour ago he had a few small hard dark green poops, but seems very strained to go. He is weak, and wants to lay down all the time, when we do stand him up, he stands in the corner with his head down. This afternoon there was blood and alot of mucus in both nostrils. I am really not sure what to do, I have given him Bloat-ease, and am continuing to give him water and standing him up and getting him moving every hour. Any ideas on what this is? and how to treat it??

 

[Red Bull Breeder]

To much sulfur will sure play heck with a calf.

 

[regolith]

Is this a weaned calf?
My *first* advice in this instance is to call your vet. Bloat-eze (if it's the same product I'm using, which is based on alcohol ethoxylate) is not recommended for young calves. The vet will be able to tell you the appropriate dose rate and if it is safe to use, also offer a more positive diagnosis of bloat and/or something else.
Has the swelling come down at all?

 

[fatcattle]

I have treated nervous coccidiousis with a paunch injection of corrid, give the recommended dosage for a drench. It's much faster and easier than tubing. Also LA 200, or it's generic equal given sub-Q. A shot of thiamine certainly wouldn't hurt. As with all treatments timing is everything and it sounds fairly advanced. The calf you have the number on should be pulled and treated. This won't hurt him if there is nothing wrong and tomorrow might be too late. Deccox in the feed isn't a bad idea, but it might be to late to get much good from it, depending on how much longer you will be feeding these calves. Corrid in the water tank will be a much faster solution. Scrape your pens and spread lime around any hay piles or mud holes. I assume you are mixing a mineral into your ration, if not you should, wouldn't hurt to have it out free choice also. Good luck, either condition can be rough to deal with.