crazy limos

[msscamp]

Anyone ever worked with old fashioned Black Angus cattle? The little short bodied, stub legged ones? I don't see them around anymore, but on calving day, and for the next couple weeks after, you couldn't get within 100 yards of a pen The neighbor had a herd of 50-60, and when you'd ride by them doing checks, the cows would storm out of the bushes and try to take your horse out from under you. Rod

Yes, we've had a few of these over the years. Last one bought herself a one-way ticket last spring. Couldn't get near her from the time she went into labor until the calf was a month old - even then it was iffy.

 

[CopeMan]

I know limousins are crazy. I used to work for Woodbrook Limousin Farms, they buy good cattle from Wulfs, and other big name breeders like Magness and I think Express. They are a big operation who is only getting biiger in to Limousins. While working at the farm running these cows through the pens, the owner told me " always watch these limousins cause they will kill you!" Ive always heard its the limo cows and not the bulls thats so crazy.[/quote

This is my point, you have been told alot but you never mention ever having any trouble with them

No, thats why I said I do know. I do have expericence with them. What do you think I meant when I said I worked with them? Because I quoted the owner does not mean I didnt help him work the cows. Those witches with a capital "B" go crazy in the headgate. You cant even tag them. They never did hurt me...too bad. but they knocked the heck outta the owner. Dont think this means i dont like them. What this does mean is I dont like hard headed people like you who are to stubborn to agree that limousins are crazy. There are crazy ones in every breed. The Limousin Farm that I work for is called Woodbrook Limousin Farm, this is no small little dinky farm either, Woodbrook makes the NALF Calender evey year. They always attend Denver, and Fort Worth and and blah blah, And still yet the woner will tell you that "Limousin are crazy." They will kill you if you handle them wrong." And breeders are trying to breed the craziness outta them." So in conclusion, dont tell me I dont know first hand about Limousin, cause I do.

And by the way they even talk about Dispostion in the Limousin World Magazine.

 

[houstoncutter]

Limousin breeders have a epd for docility. I have used it the past for bull purchases, and have found it very reliable.... At least the Limi folks are doing something about their problem, and have made great progress. Also something folks might wish to consider..... The English breeds have been in this country for a couple hundred years. That makes for a large gene pool. The european breeds have been here for abot 30 to 40. If you have a few bulls in the beginning that have a disposition problem, that problem will remain until you breed it out.... Sorta like the dumpy mutt angus bulls of the 50's, 60's, and 70's. They had to breed it out

 

[Three T]

dumpy mutt angus bulls

somebody always got to bash Angus cattle when an argument starts about another breed.
Three T Farm
Home of those pot gutted, dumpymutt, ill natured, over hyped,can't take the heat or cold, pinkeye gettin,no yield makin, tough eatin son of guns that i'll keep raisin . :idea:

 

[1848]

The vet at the salebarn says he likes it when they have to work limos, they can get so many through the chute so much faster then any other cattle.

dun

Ain't that the truth! Some breeds ya gota whoop through the shoot!.. :lol:

 

[1848]

Not sure what happened to caustic's comment on why the Limi breed had developed a new EPD for Docility if they weren't known for their unpredictable temperment in the first place...but it disappeared. :shock:

So why did the Limi Assoc need to develop an EPD for docility if they are not unpredictable at times?

I think it is a move in the right direction by the Assoc., but you have to wonder if breeders will wash the truth a little even when reporting it...especially if they are used to handling them, and their #2 is any other breeds #5. ;-)

Here is a link to an article on the issue:

http://www.nalf.org/why_choose_limousin/limtechbull.pdf

 

[dj]

Not sure what happened to caustic's comment on why the Limi breed had developed a new EPD for Docility if they weren't known for their unpredictable temperment in the first place...but it disappeared. :shock:

So why did the Limi Assoc need to develop an EPD for docility if they are not unpredictable at times?

I think it is a move in the right direction by the Assoc., but you have to wonder if breeders will wash the truth a little even when reporting it...especially if they are used to handling them, and their #2 is any other breeds #5. ;-)

Here is a link to an article on the issue:
http://www.nalf.org/why_choose_limousin/limtechbull.pdf

1848
Here ya go. What was lost, is now found.
http://cattletoday.com/forum/viewtopic. ... c&start=45

 

[1848]

Thanks DJ, Caustic corrected me too. Oh well, makes for good reading anyway...

 

[houstoncutter]

Three T if those cattle work for you thats great. There are markets for all types of cattle. Of course on this board it seems that the Angus breeders are sorta like the king with no clothes on.........Dont tell em anything is wrong with their breed, that just cant be true, according to them. Some of us commercial breeders have no intention of spending a huge amount of money to try and find a curve bending Angus bull. Many of us want a bull that will be used as a terminal sire.....period....We sell calves by the pound, something many Angus sired calves do not bring to the table

 

[cypressfarms]

Whenever someone mentions Limousin on this board someone always brings up the temperment issue. Seems to me that some people lack confidence, or should that be competence, in their cattle handling skills.
;-)

Boy that's a mouthful there Rich.

I wonder how much confidence anyone would have with a 1800 lb. limo running straight towards them (or any breed for that manner). When they get "the look" in their eye, and their coming for you, confidence is not a trait considered. Bravery, at that point, will only cause you medical bills.

I haven't had a lot of experience with limo's, just a few here and there.

I like cautic's comparison to tigers. I do have experience with tigers. That's when your competance comes in: having all equipment ready, moving the cattle in groups, etc etc.

BUT why bother with the potential explosion if you can have cattle that are docile and walk the line for you? I cull for disposition. I don't care how nice a cow looks, if she won't back off when I step to her, I don't need her. I will tolerate a little agressiveness when she's calving, for obvious reasons, but I will not tolerate it in cows or bulls. From what I've seen and read, disposition is hereditary. Why chance it with wild cows?

 

[Angus Guy]

As has been said over had over again ALL breeds have their spooks. It just so happens that certain breeds have more aggression than others and Limi's fall into that catergory. I say this with confidence since I have several in my commercial herd. I also have simi's chia's angus and baldies. I also have a register herd of angus that are simply a pleasure to work. If you select for disposition along with all of the other traits you want you should end up with a calm and easy to work group cattle.

 

[Brandonm2]

I wonder how much confidence anyone would have with a 1800 lb. limo running straight towards them (or any breed for that manner). When they get "the look" in their eye, and their coming for you, confidence is not a trait considered. Bravery, at that point, will only cause you medical bills.......BUT why bother with the potential explosion if you can have cattle that are docile and walk the line for you? I cull for disposition. I don't care how nice a cow looks, if she won't back off when I step to her, I don't need her. I will tolerate a little agressiveness when she's calving, for obvious reasons, but I will not tolerate it in cows or bulls. From what I've seen and read, disposition is hereditary. Why chance it with wild cows?

I agree, I usually like to work cattle slow with feed and a flapper (I think Cypress calls it a "luge stick"). If a mama cow turns on me and I can't get her out of my face flapping then hitting her across the snout with the flapper stick itself, I will reach (relucantly) for a 2x2. If I have to reach for a 2x2 twice on the same cow to keep from getting run over during routine work that cow is headed to the salebarn even if I paid a good price for it. When one cow panics and freaks out many cows panic and freak out. I have known people who needed aluminum baseball bats to work their cows in a pen. I won't put up with that kind of garbage. It is time to buy new cows before it goes that far.

 

[Susie David]

Just gotta add my few cents worth....when we went to have a look at some Lim heifers that we were thinking of trying Susie and I walked the pen with the owner and 40 or so yearling heifers, didn't get charged, seperated then easily and were close enough to get sniffed. Not a mean one in the lot, but then we take our time slowly worked them...bought a nice girl, cautious but not mean. She's the first one through the chute but also the first one at the feed bunk....we'll see in March how she handles calving, expect her to be a good mom as she helped a angus heifer clean her calf when she wasn't sure of what to do.
Wild in any breed, except Herfs, never met a mean one yet. Did buy a baldy heifer calf that left a head sculpture in a wire fence panel...lasted exactly five days on our farm and heard the song of the auctioneer on the sixth.
We'll probably buy some more Lim heifers this spring and will damn sure look for disposition. DMc

 

[edb130]

I bought some limousin heifers last year. I am just trying to get back to farming. Two of the heifers I have you can walk up to slowly and pet in the middle of the field. Two of them have calved recently and haven't caused me any concern when working their babies. The fifth one seems a little flighty but she went right in the shoot to be weighed and I can walk within two feet of her in the field before she backs away. I was a dairy farmer before and some of my holsteins weren't as approachable as my limousins. A lot of an animals disposition comes from the person handling them. There will always be crazy animals just like there are crazy people.

 

[Beef11]

I bought a Saler cow, she had been in close quarters with all her herdmates and they seemed socialable (black Angus) I thought she would be ok. Anytime you moved the herd or were working them the Saler was always working the fence which wasn't good because the are very athletic. Also though they are very low maitenence critters, easy calvers that take good care of themselves. Make limis look tame though.

 

[2centsworth]

As a Limousin breeder, I have to throw in my 2-cents-worth.

This discussion is getting old. It comes up every month or two, and the same comments from the same people are posted every time.

Here are the facts:

There are bad-tempered cattle in every breed.

Limousin had a few more than average at the beginning.

Limousin introduced a docility EPD to help remedy the problem.
The docility EPD, like every other EPD, is a comparison tool. You use it to compare cattle. Even if someone scores their cattle better than is deserved and higher than the next person would, as long as they score them comparitively, it doesn't matter.

The docility EPD average of the breed has improved significantly in the past ten years. This means the average temperment of Limousin cattle today is better than it was ten years ago. It does not mean there aren't still some flighty cattle out there, but there are fewer of them.


Now here's my opinion. There are people who cull for temperament and people who don't. If you are buying cattle of any breed, buy from someone who does.

 

[CopeMan]

Very well said

 

[aplusmnt]

I know as far as show cattle go I am going to start looking harder at temperament. Use to if it looked good, i figured I would eventually get it broke. Last year my little kids 8 & 10 started showing Heifers. Use to we just showed a steer with my teen son. But with having 5 show animals and seeing how much easier life is with the docile ones. I will be making how gentle they are a bigger priority in future, maybe even 1st above their looks.

 

[Jeanne - Simme Valley]

Temperament is #1 on this farm. I'm 5'2 and I do 90% of the cattle chores. I cannot & will not tolerate bad temperament. Now, if they are a little snotty at calving, but I can lure the cow away with grain, and she's fine out in the pasture, that's OK. Every year I "grade" the calving temperament of each cow. Helps me be prepared at next calving.
When we have a bad tempered animal, it gets shipped on the rail if it's a cow, sold as a feeder if it's a heifer calf. If everyone did that, there wouldn't be so many breeds with "known" bad temperaments.
I can only remember one heifer calf that we shipped. She was beautiful, everyone that came to the farm picked her out as "the show heifer", sale manager picked her for a consignment sale. Long story short - she would literally take you in a pen, so we pulled her out of the sale & shipped her.
ALL breeds have bad ones - just how many within a breed makes a difference.
I love Vicki's comment "Salers are hairy-limis".

 

[Jeanne - Simme Valley]

I also wanted to comment that the Limi's have done a great job improving their temperament problem with their EPD Docility.