Cost raising cattle question

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tmaygspeara

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louisiana
hello everyone, i have been reading on this forum for a while and this is my first post. I have been reading alot of cattlemen on here talking about the cost associated with rasing cattle and how it cost a dollar a day and you only make $100+ a head when selling cows. This confuses me because i have been in the cattle business for a few year after helping my dad and taking over because of his age. I live about 1.5 hours away and i visted the farm 3-4 time a week, i have 15 cameras set up to where anytime of the day i can look on my laptop and view every inch of the farm. My question is how do some of you come up with the cost you associate with rasing cattle.

In our situation we have 220 acres of land, and about 250+ head of cattle. we have 5 ponds and water is never a issue. i refuse to cut and bail hay, because all my life i seen my dad do it and i dont think it is worth all the time and effort cutting and bailing to save a few pennies when you can buy it. i think its it better to let the cows have the pastures for grazing instead of taking the land try to grow hay. so i say we spend about $10,000-$15,000 a year buying hay for the winter. we will worm out cows once a year if we think about it, but we have never had a problem with worms. i refuse to call the vet and if we do that cows with be at the sale barns after she drops. this year out of 200+ calves this year we only pulled 2. even though it has been dry in louisiana we have been bless enough to where our cows are spead out enough to where they still have enough for grazing. my only other cost is diesel for the new john deere tractor (paid cash) i wasted money on because all our land is cleared and it belongs to the cows, and i really have nothing to do with it.

we rasie commerical cows and 90% of our herd is black we usually take to the sale barn about 200 calves per year (500-700 lbs).

My dad always taught me how NOT to spend money and i have made that rules to live by. We dont spend any money on our cattle beside hay and mineral blocks so if we can get by with how we are making it, i wonder why so many cattlemen say it is hard to make money.
 
well...
i'm sure you will get a lot of replies to this tomorrow but i'll throw out a few ideas.

1) is your land paid for?
2) thats great that you can run 1.14 cows per acre. most arent that lucky.
3) a lot of people deworm twice a year
4) a lot of people vaccinate so theres another expense
5) most people probably feed more than 2 rolls per cow per winter. (assuming a roll of hay costs $30)
6) are you factoring in all your costs like the fuel it takes for you to drive 1.5 hours 3 or 4 times a week?

you have the right idea of minimizing inputs however things like not vaccinating may bite you in the fanny one day.

your idea of buying hay instead of growing it is a good one (generally).
 
Thats good to hear your making it ;-)
I think for the most part new ranchers/farmers cant make it with all the cost to do with starting up:
Land Cost
Tractor Cost
All the other equipment needed (fencing, facilities, ect.)
Cattle
and so on
 
Welcome aboard, I'm happy to hear that you are making money on your farm. We have a lot in common, but operate a little differently. My land and farm equipment is also all paid for. I vacinate and de-worm my cattle, and also bale my own hay. I ran some numbers after reading your post, and I bale hay for 1/3 of the cost of buying it. Thats saving more than a few pennies. I live on the farm, but have a job. I don't depend on the cattle for a living. A lot of the guys on here raise cattle for a living, depending totally on them. That is hard. Oh, my girls do pay for themselves. :D :D
 
I ran some numbers after reading your post, and I bale hay for 1/3 of the cost of buying it.
Could you please explain your numbers. Even if your equipment is paid for the maintenance, fuel, herbicide, fertilizer, and labor would come to almost $30/roll. But then maybe you don't spray or fertilize and don't count your labor. If the hay is not leaving the property then 80% of the nutrients end up back on the ground (so I've been told by A&M profs at various cattle clinics), which obvioulsy decreases your fert bill. So please, do tell.
 
tmaygspeara":15sj5vgo said:
....i have 15 cameras set up to where anytime of the day i can look on my laptop and view every inch of the farm........

I would be interested in learning more about your camera/system setup.
 
Nowland Farms":foswckjv said:
tmaygspeara":foswckjv said:
....i have 15 cameras set up to where anytime of the day i can look on my laptop and view every inch of the farm........

I would be interested in learning more about your camera/system setup.

Me too 8)
 
I didn't go into detail on my post, sorry about that. :oops: I have a pasture that I killed off about 5 yrs. ago. I then burned it and plowed it and came back and planted bahia grass. The pasture is clean and well maintained.
1) No need for herbicides
2) Fertilizer as per soil sample = $42 / acre
3) Fuel for clipping / cutting / baling = $5.00 / acre
4) Labor = Me and Wife - You tell me what quality time in hay field with wife is worth. :D
Something that I didn't mention in earlier post is that I run 1 cow / 1 1/2 acre.
I baled hay this year for $6.35 per bale + Me and Wife. :D
How do some of the rest of ya'll figure Ya'll's hay?
Hope that kind of clear things up. :D :D
 
Good used tractor: $20,000.
New JD467 Baler: $30,000.
Fuel / maintenance, etc: expensive

Yes, I bale my own hay.

No, it's cheaper to buy. Learned that the hard way.

As to making money.... one day. After buying the farm, breeding stock, equipment, etc., it's impossible to make money at this time. One day.......
 
tmaygspeara":3ii3qqcb said:
hello everyone, i have been reading on this forum for a while and this is my first post. I have been reading alot of cattlemen on here talking about the cost associated with rasing cattle and how it cost a dollar a day and you only make $100+ a head when selling cows. This confuses me because i have been in the cattle business for a few year after helping my dad and taking over because of his age. I live about 1.5 hours away and i visted the farm 3-4 time a week, i have 15 cameras set up to where anytime of the day i can look on my laptop and view every inch of the farm. My question is how do some of you come up with the cost you associate with rasing cattle.

In our situation we have 220 acres of land, and about 250+ head of cattle. we have 5 ponds and water is never a issue. i refuse to cut and bail hay, because all my life i seen my dad do it and i dont think it is worth all the time and effort cutting and bailing to save a few pennies when you can buy it. i think its it better to let the cows have the pastures for grazing instead of taking the land try to grow hay. so i say we spend about $10,000-$15,000 a year buying hay for the winter. we will worm out cows once a year if we think about it, but we have never had a problem with worms. i refuse to call the vet and if we do that cows with be at the sale barns after she drops. this year out of 200+ calves this year we only pulled 2. even though it has been dry in louisiana we have been bless enough to where our cows are spead out enough to where they still have enough for grazing. my only other cost is diesel for the new john deere tractor (paid cash) i wasted money on because all our land is cleared and it belongs to the cows, and i really have nothing to do with it.

we rasie commerical cows and 90% of our herd is black we usually take to the sale barn about 200 calves per year (500-700 lbs).

My dad always taught me how NOT to spend money and i have made that rules to live by. We dont spend any money on our cattle beside hay and mineral blocks so if we can get by with how we are making it, i wonder why so many cattlemen say it is hard to make money.

:clap: :clap: :clap: :clap: :clap: :clap:

Amen! I get tired of people complaining about how they don't make money but yet they insist on the bull being fed and kept fat, their facilities must be the best and in top shape all the time, and how they insinst on bailing their own hay because of quality even though it costs them alot more. Like their cows won't produce calves on the same grass that another person cuts or their bull won't breed if he does not have fisish. :lol:

I like your logic... get the time to money ratio right and the cattle can be an enjoyable, profitable business.
 
grannysoo":o0ulnjwf said:
Good used tractor: $20,000.
New JD467 Baler: $30,000.
Fuel / maintenance, etc: expensive

Yes, I bale my own hay.

No, it's cheaper to buy. Learned that the hard way.

As to making money.... one day. After buying the farm, breeding stock, equipment, etc., it's impossible to make money at this time. One day.......

I agree... I don't know that it is impossible but it is extremely hard and will tak a long time to get out of the red so you had better have another income to put food on the table until then.
 
Beefy":2wwk2x2p said:
well...
i'm sure you will get a lot of replies to this tomorrow but i'll throw out a few ideas.

1) is your land paid for? YES PAID FOR MY DAD TOLD ME IN 1964 HE PURCHASED HIS FIRST 80 ACRES FOR $3300
2) thats great that you can run 1.14 cows per acre. most arent that lucky. YEP
3) a lot of people deworm twice a year
4) a lot of people vaccinate so theres another expense, NEVER VACCINATE UNLESS THE COW LOOKS OR ACTS SICK
5) most people probably feed more than 2 rolls per cow per winter. (assuming a roll of hay costs $30) FEED 5 ROLLS EVERY 2-3 DAYS
6) are you factoring in all your costs like the fuel it takes for you to drive 1.5 hours 3 or 4 times a week? I DONT COUNT THAT AS A COST, BECAUSE I HAVE TO LOOK OUT FOR OUR FAMILY HOME, SO IF I DIDNT HAVE COWS I WOULD BE THERE JUST AS MUCH ANYWAY

you have the right idea of minimizing inputs however things like not vaccinating may bite you in the fanny one day. MY DAD SAID HE NEVER VACCINTATE UNLESS THE COWS LOOK WEEK AND SICK, BUT OTHER THAN THAT WE NEVER HAD A PROBLEM, HAVENT LOST A COW OR CALF IN 5-6 YEARS
your idea of buying hay instead of growing it is a good one (generally).

I WILL PUT UP A LINK TO THE CAMERA SET UP LATER THIS EVENING
 
tmaygspeara":38ucf29d said:
hello everyone, i have been reading on this forum for a while and this is my first post. I have been reading alot of cattlemen on here talking about the cost associated with rasing cattle and how it cost a dollar a day and you only make $100+ a head when selling cows. This confuses me because i have been in the cattle business for a few year after helping my dad and taking over because of his age. I live about 1.5 hours away and i visted the farm 3-4 time a week, i have 15 cameras set up to where anytime of the day i can look on my laptop and view every inch of the farm. My question is how do some of you come up with the cost you associate with rasing cattle.

In our situation we have 220 acres of land, and about 250+ head of cattle. we have 5 ponds and water is never a issue. i refuse to cut and bail hay, because all my life i seen my dad do it and i dont think it is worth all the time and effort cutting and bailing to save a few pennies when you can buy it. i think its it better to let the cows have the pastures for grazing instead of taking the land try to grow hay. so i say we spend about $10,000-$15,000 a year buying hay for the winter. we will worm out cows once a year if we think about it, but we have never had a problem with worms. i refuse to call the vet and if we do that cows with be at the sale barns after she drops. this year out of 200+ calves this year we only pulled 2. even though it has been dry in louisiana we have been bless enough to where our cows are spead out enough to where they still have enough for grazing. my only other cost is diesel for the new john deere tractor (paid cash) i wasted money on because all our land is cleared and it belongs to the cows, and i really have nothing to do with it.

we rasie commerical cows and 90% of our herd is black we usually take to the sale barn about 200 calves per year (500-700 lbs).

My dad always taught me how NOT to spend money and i have made that rules to live by. We dont spend any money on our cattle beside hay and mineral blocks so if we can get by with how we are making it, i wonder why so many cattlemen say it is hard to make money.

I agree with you on the $100 a cow thing. Historically THAT has been correct; but if an established commercial beef farm of more than 20 cows is only clearing $100 a cow with 600 lb feeders bringing $115 a cwt (and often more) somebody needs a new line of work.
 
here is a link to a similar camera that i have. the way these work, you have setup a wi fi network around you place and these camera tranmit images the same way as using wireless internet. each camera is set up on you computer and you can view them for anywhere via a computer. they have motion detectors. i have mine to where they are on my fence line, so where ever anythings comes close to the fence line it will send a email to my phone and i can check it on my computer. they work so good, to one night i was home someone ran into my field with my car and tore down about 16 feet of my fence. i got a email to my phone instantly and i was there fixing the fence before the cows even knew there was an opening. check them out they are great
http://www.climaxproducts.com/store/pro ... 280&page=1
 
1) No need for herbicides
2) Fertilizer as per soil sample = $42 / acre
3) Fuel for clipping / cutting / baling = $5.00 / acre
4) Labor = Me and Wife - You tell me what quality time in hay field with wife is worth. Very Happy
Something that I didn't mention in earlier post is that I run 1 cow / 1 1/2 acre.
I baled hay this year for $6.35 per bale + Me and Wife. Very Happy
How do some of the rest of ya'll figure Ya'll's hay?
Hope that kind of clear things up. Very Happy Very Happy

Thanks Paul54 that helps alot. I don't want to beat this to death but would like to better understand it.
Your numbers sound about right to me. For bahia I'm guessing you'll get about 1.5 rolls/acre. So with cost inputs per acre of $47 (42+5) and 1.5 rolls per acre gives $31.33/roll Those numbers sound about right. So how do you figure $31.33/roll is 1/3 the cost of buying hay. Certainly you were not paying over $90/roll for cow hay.
 
well...
i'm sure you will get a lot of replies to this tomorrow but i'll throw out a few ideas.

1) is your land paid for?
2) thats great that you can run 1.14 cows per acre. most arent that lucky.
3) a lot of people deworm twice a year
4) a lot of people vaccinate so theres another expense
5) most people probably feed more than 2 rolls per cow per winter. (assuming a roll of hay costs $30)
6) are you factoring in all your costs like the fuel it takes for you to drive 1.5 hours 3 or 4 times a week?

you have the right idea of minimizing inputs however things like not vaccinating may bite you in the fanny one day.

your idea of buying hay instead of growing it is a good one (generally).


YES ALL THE LAND IS PAID FOR MY DAD TOLD ME IN 1964 HE PURCHASED HIS FIRST 80 ACRES FOR $3300. we have all the equipment need for the farm. I remember 10 years ago when me and my dad built catch pens, he would say boy this should last you about 10-15 years and i be darn if it didnt.


like i said before, the entire time my dad has raised cows over 40 year, he told me he might have de wormed twice, never had a problem with worms. i de worm now but ONLY when i notice that they might need it, we do not make it a priority to de worm

in the winter time we feed about 5-6 bales of hay every 3 day, and it seems like plenty

the only time we vaccinate is when we can see that a cow needs it, if one is sick, sluggish, or near death, thats the only time we will do it.

I see alot of people talking about building facilities and all for catle but what is all that really for. I do admit i get on this forum and read all the nice things you all say you do on your farm and i get jealous and want to spend money and update mine, but my set up is dont its job.

also gas going back and forth is not consider a farm expense to me. My dad still live at home and i go out there and check on him like i have always done, so even if there were no cows i would be there just as much.
 
also with my hay for the winter you will be suprise how much hay you can get going to some one with $15,000 cash money and buying hay. you will get it for about $20-25 dollar a roll that way. but going to by 10-20 at a time it will cost you
 
Most don't count true cost what were the taxes divided among X head.
What was the fence cost diveded by X head.
Fuel cost.
Med Cost
Equipment maintainece cost
Fertilizer cost.
Land Cost
Equipment cost
XYZ cost divided by the total number of head.

Then you are not going to have a 100% calf crop due to loses
now you have a cow that you had to maintain for two years before you recieved any return.

Average upkeep cost is a dollar a day for a cow so you have 365 dollars a year upkeep.
If you retain heifers your cost increase versus buying heavies or 3 n1's
As the dam returns nothing to the bottom line for two years and you have two and half years in the heifer before she adds a return to the bottom line. The heifer is 2 before she calfs and another 6 months before the calf is ready to sell. That puts you at having 910 dollars in the heifer before she returned a dime. You have 730 dollars in the dam before she returned any income.
 
Uh, I hope I reall all that wrong! and you did not just admit to cheating on your taxes.....on THE INTERNET!!! The IRS pays bounty money for this kind of information and IP addresses can be tracked with some degree of accuracy. Of course we both KNOW that I have somehow MISinterpreted what you said......rught?!?!?![/quote]

OH YEA you must have mis understood what i said, i see you got that in quotes, but who wrote that not me. you right one could get into trouble operating like that, but take it for what it worth
 

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