Bur Oak Trees

[Chuckie]

Do any of you have one of these beautiful Bur Oak trees on your property? They sometimes are called Burr Oak, Overcup Oak, Mossy Cup Oak. The acorns are almost the size of a small chicken egg? Up North, or Northwest, they have a Bur Oak, but it is more of a scrub oak. It has small acorns, and that is not the tree that I am looking for. It may be in the South as well, but I have not heard yet.
These trees are absolutely beautiful!!! I have planted saplings on my property and they are doing well. It is odd that they surround West Tennessee on all sides, but have not reached us. And the acorns are great. I also grew some of the trees from the acorns. They have a "Big Tree Registry," and these trees are enormous and very old. Here is a picture of one in someones back yard. I would kill to have this in my yard.
http://davesgarden.com/guides/pf/showimage/61850/
I enjoy looking at the trees in the winter time as much as I do in the summer. It shows their crooked arms and their character.
Please let me know if you have any of these trees.
Chuckie

 

[ga.prime]

I think I read somewhere that burr oak acorns are the biggest in the world. I have two saplings growing and doing nicely from acorns that I picked up from a tree a few miles from me. Burr oaks aren't native to here where I am but the tree I picked the acorns up from is doing very well- I think the lady that owned the tree said it was 40-50 years old- about half or a third the size of the one you have linked to. I agree, they're exceptionally nice trees.

 

[curtis]

Yes, i have some Bur Oak trees on my place, we call them over cup acorn, they are huge. i have know idea how old they are.

 

[novaman]

I'm curious now. We have Bur Oaks but they are the small acorn type. Why would the same tree be so different? Or are they two different trees with the same name?

 

[Chuckie]

Novaman,
I have tried to order more bareroot trees, and when I do, they tell me that they have the small acorn type. Now that I have searched for the name of them, I cannot find it.
Here is a video that is showing how to collect acorns. I guess this is for people who have never been off of pavement. But........ I just wanted you to see the size of the acorns. When I held them in my had, I could only hold three of them.
http://www.ehow.com/video_2329348_gathe ... corns.html

I found a site where it says there are actually three varieties of Bur Oaks. ( Sorry for the big words to ID them!)
1. Var. depressa (Nutt.) Engelm. (Q. mandanensis Rydb.) – mostly along the western margin of the Great Plains; small trees or shrubs with smaller and less fringed cups and corky twigs.
2. over most of the species range; trees with large thick cups.
3. Iowa, Minnesota, South Dakota, and North Dakota; trees with thinner and smaller cups. This is sometimes considered within the typical variety.

None of these words are the names they use to identify the smaller acorns when purchasing the trees.

The trees in Iowa, Minnesota, South Dakota and North Dakota, are the trees as large as they are in the Southern parts of the country, just with smaller acorns?

Chuckie

 

[novatech]

I have several Burr Oaks. When I first saw one I thought they were something imported to our area. I planted several of the acorns and they all germinated. They are about 20 foot tall now and producing the giant acorns. Since I planted them I found out they are native to our area. Some of the neighbors come by an pic the acorns to incorporate them into Thanksgiving and Christmas decorations.
Gorgeous stately trees that should be used in landscapes more.

 

[peg4x4]

If you got a tree with the big acorns,put some in a box and send them to those that want them!
If I had a place to put one or four I'd be emailing you my address..

 

[iowa hawkeyes]

Yes, Iowa has a lot of Burr Oak trees, especially around water. I too love the tree for its craggy limbs and big leaves. Our family likes to visit the state and county parks in our state and there are usually a lot of Burr Oaks around. Laura Ingalls Wilder lived in Burr Oak, Iowa but it wasn't mentioned in her books. It was there that her little brother died.

 

[Lucky_P]

Bur oak's native range extends from Mexico up into Canada ( http://www.na.fs.fed.us/pubs/silvics_ma ... ocarpa.htm). There's wide variation in mature size, leaf morphology, acorn size, and cap morphology - I've seen some that lacked any 'fringe'(var. mandanensis), while some almost completely cover the acorn, like a true overcup oak(Q.lyrata), etc.
I fell in love with 'em while I was in grad school at UofMO, at Columbia. It's the quintessential 'spooky old tree' - great form, with that thick corky bark, even on new twigs, large leaves, usually with an ornate 'frilly' cap. Not much fall color, but they're great the other 50 weeks of the year. Had a friend who worked at the MO Dept. of Conservation tree nursery, and they had constant problems with the deer raiding the seedbeds, and even digging up 1-yr old seedlings to get at the acorns.

Bur oak was the Urban Forestry 'Tree of the Year' in 2001: http://forestry.about.com/library/weekly/aa071601a.htm

Not especially common in The Southeast; it's native to a small pocket in Montgomery Co., in my home state of AL, but I'm unaware of them occurring naturally in GA. Auburn University has planted them extensively as 'street trees' around the campus there, and one tree at the AU vet school(I never took notice of them when I was in school there) produces the largest acorn of any bur oak I've ever come across, including some of the south TX selections.
I don't see 'em much here in western KY, but once you get up into the 'bluegrass' area of central KY, they're pretty common; good-sized acorns, similar to those I saw in mid-MO, but not huge like the AL/TX/OK acorns.

I've grown seedlings from acorns collected or sent from MO, IN, IA, ID, WI, MI, AL, TX, OK, NY, KY, VT, KS, Ontario, Manitoba, and probably some other states I've forgotten.
I have some AL/TX/OK seedlings grown from acorns that run in the range of 6-8 acorns per pound(with caps removed), while some of those from more northerly sites, like IA, Manitoba, etc., were pretty small, by comparison, probably running in the range of 80-100 per pound. Generally, the farther south/southwest you go within the native range, the larger the acorn.

In general, they've been pretty fast-growing for me, most putting on 2+ ft of growth per year, with many beginning to produce acorns before they reach 10 years of age.
OIKOS Tree Crops, in Kalamazoo, MI offers a number of different seedling oak selections, including some of the large-acorn type bur oaks; check 'em out at: http://www.oikostreecrops.com

Big acorns, but not the biggest in the world - that award probably goes to Q.insignis, one of the Mexican oaks; . See photos here: http://www.google.com/images?hl=en&sour ... =&gs_rfai=

 

[Chuckie]

Has anyone seen these trees growing close to the West Tennesse edges of your state. I know they are in all surrounding states.
I could travel to the surrounding states,and pick acorns up if it was not too far away. Some states I am only 35 miles, 50 mi. So.......... I guess my next thing would be to try to purchase acorns from someone. At a fair price too!!!
Chuckie

 

[upfrombottom]

Has anyone seen these trees growing close to the West Tennesse edges of your state.

There are several areas that they grow here. The largest I have seen here are about the size of a golf ball and will leave a pritty good knot if one hits you when they fall. Most of the larger ones I have seen grow in the lower areas, but they grow in the hills here too, just not as large of a acorn. When I run across some of the larger ones I'll PM you and you can decide how to get them. They will usually start to fall here in early October. I have seen them used to make christmas tree ornaments when I was a kid.

they had constant problems with the deer raiding the seedbeds, and even digging up 1-yr old seedlings to get at the acorns.

The acorns of the Overcup seem to be the first to fall. The deer will eat them until the white oaks begin to fall and then they tend to leave them alone.

 

[MO_cows]

Those are nice trees! There is a grand old oak tree in a farmed field near here, the farmer just plows and plants around it. I'll try to get a picture and maybe someone will know what sub-species it is. We have one oak tree we transplanted from my grandpa's property when it was about 7 feet tall; it's a pin oak I think. Now I'm gonna have to check and see if the MO conservation department has those large-acorn burr oaks. They sell seedlings super cheap; last year I got a bundle of pecan trees and started them.

 

[Chuckie]

Lucky_P,
I am always looking at the big tree registry, and Georgia had a Bur Oak tree listed, and I was thinking they had moved there. But I looked back at the registry, and the oak is much smaller. So, it had to be a transplant. I did find a record of a Bur Oak in Arkansas in the Registry with 404 points. So, it must of been a whopper.
It shows in Tennessee to have the largest Bur Oak tree in Hendersonville, and one in McMinnville. These two trees are three or more hours away from home. Then I found an article where it shows the trees to be in Lake, Obion and Dyer counties, which are just a short ride. This is next to Missouri, where you spent time with the trees Then in Stewart and Montgomery County, which would take an hour. Now if I can find the few trees that they are saying to be in those counties. Probably in someone's front yard :shock:

Did your friend work on the McBaine Bur Oak? If you type in Bur Oak, you usually get a picture of it. It is a beautiful oak.
Chuckie

 

[Lucky_P]

Chuckie,
I've made the 'pilgrimage' to the then MO Champion(now co-champion) bur oak, in the McBaine bottoms, on several occasions - was not far from where I lived. My buddy at MDC has probably retired by now - it's been nearly 20 yrs; but, I did recently exchange emails with an arborist in Columbia who has been involved in some of the recent care & feeding of the McBaine tree. Hope to get some scionwood from it this winter, and graft it into my collection.

I'm in Christian Co., KY, just north of Stewart & Montgomery Co., TN. I had one bur oak growing on this farm when I moved here, back in '94 - right down on the creekbank, so I can only presume it was native, and not planted by a previous owner; although they're incredibly drought-tolerant, the drought of '98 took it out. Only other bur oaks I've seen around Christian Co., are young trees in spots(church yards, highway interchanges, etc.) that tell me that somebody planted them there.

 

[ga.prime]

Here's one of my saplings. Its about 8 or 9 years old. Hasn't made any acorns yet. Notice the wire cage around it. The wire is a necessity here to prevent deer from shredding the sapling into ten thousand pieces by rubbing their antlers on it.

 

[Chuckie]

ga. prime,
Did you start that one from a bare root tree or an acorn? Looks like a nice healthy tree. Plenty of room to grow too.
Have you tried putting a few tree fertilizer spikes around it? I know they are not the fastest growing tree, but I do put the spikes around the trees for about three years to give them a burst of growth. Then I let them grow on their own. I figured that three years of wide rings in the tree would not make the trunk weak. The rest of the trunk will have much more smaller rings, and be hardened and tougher from the wind blowing and swaying the trunk. I am thinking something around the tree to bring in the earth worms to aerate the soil around it and make the soil more healthy for the tree. I bet that would get more than two feet a year's growth. Alfalfa tea and fish emulsion attracts earthworms big time. Produces a lot of new limb growth, that sometimes is removed, and gets taller. That would be 14 cups of Alfalfa pellets to a 33 gallon trash can, 2 cups of Epsom salt. Stir this really well, and put the lid on it. Just before you water with it, add a cup of fish emulsion. In 3 to 5 days, water what ever you want to see change. (Big time!) When you get down to the alfalfa slush, fill the trash can back up with water, and add 1 cup of epsom salt. Stir well, and repeat the process. This time, you need to use the slush. This might need to go on the flower bed or can go around the tree. Worms will come to eat it and are very large when they finish it. Look like they are on steroids.
Chuckie.

 

[ga.prime]

Thanks for the ideas, Chuckie! The earthworm connection is very interesting and so is your recipe for bringing them in. That's something I'd like to give a try. I'll get a bag of alfalfa pellets and the other ingredients next time I'm at the feed store.

I grew some bur oaks from acorns but I also got one or two bareroot seedlings from the Arbor Day Foundation. I think the one in the pic came as a bare root from Arbor Day.

 

[alftn]

Do you like the beauty of the trees or are you just wanting large nuts????? The saw tooth also makes so really go nuts for wildlife, and are fairly large in size.....

 

[ga.prime]

Do you like the beauty of the trees or are you just wanting large nuts????? The saw tooth also makes so really go nuts for wildlife, and are fairly large in size.....

Alf, what is a "so really go nut"? I like Sawtooth Oaks because they grow fast and produce a lot of acorns at a young age. A Bur Oak acorn is about 4 times bigger than a Sawtooth acorn. Two things I don't like about Sawtooth Oaks are (1) The dead leaves stay on the tree all through the winter and fall off in the spring. (2) The acorns fully develop and fall off the tree really early- in September here where I am.

 

[john250]

Do you like the beauty of the trees or are you just wanting large nuts????? ....

Give me a minute, I'm thinking about this...