breeding heifers

[Big D]

I need some advice. Last fall I calved out 18 heifers. Out of 18 we pulled 2 calves, the rest were the perfect size for these girls. Since january 27 I have had 33 heifers calve, 2 are paralyzed, one had a uterine prolapse and we have pulled 50% so far. These heifers were bred to the same bulls as the fall calvers, bcs of 6 to 7. I do not have a weight tape or scale but would estimate these calves @ 125lbs. I am really tearing these girls up. So why would the same genetics produce such big calves compared to those that claved last fall?

Right now I have the same bulls just finishing on the next group of fall heifers. I do not want to go through this again. I have thought of just running the freshly bred girls through the sale as feeders. What would you do? Why the difference in birth wt? We have had a very mild winter but that's nothing really new.

D

 

[Running Arrow Bill]

If it was me after I got a 125# calf I would either haul the bull to the sale barn or make ground beef out of him.

On current heifers, I'd abort all of them, haul the bull, and either A.I. the heifers or get a low BW bull to use for your next crop of calves.

 

[novaman]

You could go the easy route and blame the bulls or you could actually look at the situation. The calves are coming out at roughly 125 lbs? That is extremely high for a cow much less a heifer. Did you feed this group differently then the fall calvers? If they get high amounts of protein during the last trimester the birthweight will jump. Also if those heifers are at BCS of 7 that's getting pretty high. They might be a bit overconditioned. I would shoot for 6 on heifers but nothing over that. Just don't go blaming the bull before properly assessing the situation. Just my thoughts.

 

[Texan]

If you're talking about multiple bulls, you might also consider a change in bull health or dominance between breedings. A change in the dominant bull is what usually impacts changes in my calves from breeding to breeding.

 

[ollie']

I need some advice. Last fall I calved out 18 heifers. Out of 18 we pulled 2 calves, the rest were the perfect size for these girls. Since january 27 I have had 33 heifers calve, 2 are paralyzed, one had a uterine prolapse and we have pulled 50% so far. These heifers were bred to the same bulls as the fall calvers, bcs of 6 to 7. I do not have a weight tape or scale but would estimate these calves @ 125lbs. I am really tearing these girls up. So why would the same genetics produce such big calves compared to those that claved last fall?

Right now I have the same bulls just finishing on the next group of fall heifers. I do not want to go through this again. I have thought of just running the freshly bred girls through the sale as feeders. What would you do? Why the difference in birth wt? We have had a very mild winter but that's nothing really new.

D

Fall calves are always lots lighter on my place. Weigh some with a bathroom scale and see what they weigh. I bet they aren't that heavy. BCS of 7 will sure get you introuble. I know from experience.

 

[milkmaid]

On current heifers, I'd abort all of them, haul the bull, and either A.I. the heifers or get a low BW bull to use for your next crop of calves.

Careful on aborting calves. Saw a cow not all that long ago with a torn cervix and adhesion tags on the uterus from an abortion with a 2 - 2 1/2 month fetus.

 

[Big D]

I have not laid blame on my bulls. I have three that are all half brothers. I have been using their father for 4 years and have never pulled a calf from him. Not all the calves are that big, except the last two. That is where I got the paralyzed girls. Mostly because they went down on us and hip locked. As far as bcs goes, most were in the 6 range with just a few pushing 7. They were on cornstalks containing very little grain and receiving 1/2 lbs. of prot. per day. The biggest thing I am concerened about is why the difference in birth wt. I have read that fall calvers can throw smaller calves. The ??? is do I stick it out and chance facing this in the fall or jump ship.

 

[buckaroo_bif]

Big D try and get a for real birth weight. I just can't imagine they be that heavy. If you don't have scales you can get a heart girth measurement but my chart doesn't even go up to 105 lbs!. A 36 inch heart girth is a 105 lb. calf. But nevertheless if you are having problems you are having problems and it is a bit too late to change plans now. All I can think of I would do is get a different bull for breeding heifers!

 

[buckaroo_bif]

You know Big D I was talking to a feller about calving and he mentioned that with all our dry weather that all the feed the cows or heifers are getting it is going straight to the calf. That is the only thing I can think of that with the warm and dry weather the cows are needing less energy for themselves and more feed goes to the calf, hence bigger calves! I have not noticed it at all our cows though.

 

[la4angus]

Last year you bred 18 hfrs and pulled 2. That was 16 that didn't have to be pulled. Since Jan 27 you had 33 and 2 paralized and 1 uterine prolapse then 50% had to be pulled. That's just 15 that had no trouble. Basically the same as last year. Just different hfrs. These hfrs been fed longer than the fall calvers too. That's your problem, different hfrs and longer feeding time.

 

[buckaroo_bif]

Last year you bred 18 hfrs and pulled 2. That was 16 that didn't have to be pulled. Since Jan 27 you had 33 and 2 paralized and 1 uterine prolapse then 50% had to be pulled. That's just 15 that had no trouble. Basically the same as last year. Just different hfrs. These hfrs been fed longer than the fall calvers too. That's your problem, different hfrs and longer feeding time.

Good point la4. I been feeding bred heifers since November with virtually no problems this year.

 

[Scotty]

Last year you bred 18 hfrs and pulled 2. That was 16 that didn't have to be pulled. Since Jan 27 you had 33 and 2 paralized and 1 uterine prolapse then 50% had to be pulled. That's just 15 that had no trouble. Basically the same as last year. Just different hfrs. These hfrs been fed longer than the fall calvers too. That's your problem, different hfrs and longer feeding time.

Could be your just lucky. Or a run of bad luck. To me sounds like the heifers are to blame.


Scotty

 

[jcarkie]

do the heifers have high birth weights? it can be a factor too.
sorry about your bad luck, that is discouraging.

 

[Big D]

One thing that is different would be All of the fall calvers were sired by my bulls. The heifers that are calving now were not all sired by my bulls but were all born on this farm. Some blame can be aimed at the sires of these heifers. These sires are unknown. I try to cull my heifers for disposition first. I also try to retain heifers from easy fleshing cows. As far as the calf crop these girls are from, we had only pulled one or two that came back feet first. Oh well different year different problems. The cows are due to start calving Thursday. If the mild weather is to blame, we'll know soon enough.

 

[Beefy]

different heifers, the ones having trouble are probably all related, sired by the same bull. you didnt mention what breeds the heifers and bulls are. with calving difficulty its usually genetic rather than feed related.

If they were mine, i'd just step up, and get them up where i can watch them closer and catch them easily WHEN i need to.

are these heifers angus?

 

[plbcattle]

that bull wouldn't make it through the night if I wowned him. Caustic can give you aiming tips but I would kill and eat him and his brothers. what you are experiencing is terrible. the calves that make it are going to have this BW issue. He has done some real dmage to your herd. if you look at all the varriables he is the common factor. teh heifers unlwss everyone is a full sister are all deferent in pedigree. It must be the bull. DOn't sell him KILL HIM

 

[Beef11]

Cold weather causes bigger calves. Hot weather causes smalller calves. I would guess overconditioning might have a little to do with it. Bulls also might be the wild card. Nutrition or heifer genetics could be the culprits? I would guess a combination of them is to blame.

 

[orcow]

Now you are learning the lesson called GENETICS (sp). If that is a commercial herd, get rid of your cow killers. Cause you used em before does not mean they will work again. What blood work and check did you get done? And one last word, DO NOT bank on EPD's, the farmers already got that figured out. Go back to the maternal sire and dam. That will give ya the best picture. Dang near lost everything when it happened to me. And folks it was the BULLS. Lost 18 heifers and 42 cows.

 

[aplusmnt]

Now you are learning the lesson called GENETICS (sp). If that is a commercial herd, get rid of your cow killers. Cause you used em before does not mean they will work again. What blood work and check did you get done? And one last word, DO NOT bank on EPD's, the farmers already got that figured out. Go back to the maternal sire and dam. That will give ya the best picture. Dang near lost everything when it happened to me. And folks it was the BULLS. Lost 18 heifers and 42 cows.

What kind of Bulls were you using and what kind of females? You had 18 heifers and 42 Cows die from calving difficulties in one year?

 

[buckaroo_bif]

Now you are learning the lesson called GENETICS (sp). If that is a commercial herd, get rid of your cow killers. Cause you used em before does not mean they will work again. What blood work and check did you get done? And one last word, DO NOT bank on EPD's, the farmers already got that figured out. Go back to the maternal sire and dam. That will give ya the best picture. Dang near lost everything when it happened to me. And folks it was the BULLS. Lost 18 heifers and 42 cows.

limousin bulls? simmental maybe?