Bad reaction to sedation

[Little Cow]

Anyone who uses sedation for dehorning or castration, have you ever seen a bad reaction to the drugs? Our vet was out anyway, so he did the dehorning. We had to do chest compressions today on the calf after a bad reaction. She was gasping occasionally, but it took a reversal to get her to where she was breathing regularly. Her heart never stopped. Gums looked awful for a few moments. Groggy for about three hours afterwards. The drugs used were standard protocol (rompun and ketamine). Weight was right. Our vet was horrified. Never saw that before. Just a sensitive calf, I guess. She seems fine now.

 

[Till-Hill]

Week ago I woke up half hour before I was supposed to during wisdom teeth surgery. Everything reacts differently to every drug.

 

[Aaron]

Why would you sedate for either? Local anesthetic is all that is required. Avoid sedation at all costs because a lot of cattle never wake up from it. Only required for invasive surgery.

 

[Bright Raven]

I used Xylazine to sedate a heifer that was very sensitive to Artificial Insemination. She was extremely docile. She is still in my herd and is no longer sensitive to AI, thank goodness. I had my dog at the vet and was telling the vet that I had a valuable heifer that got nervous when I tried to AI her. When I would manipulate her cervix, she actually would go down in the chute. She gave me a mild dose of Xylazine. The next time she came into heat, I put her in the chute and gave the dose of Xylazine. She went down. I had to open the side door and actually give her thoracic compressions to keep her breathing. I would roll her side to side and give her thoracic compressions. It only took a couple minutes until she could lift her head and breathe. When I got her to stand, she wobbled. She was halter broke, so I tied her to a gate and bred her. She stuck. I would be very apprehensive about using Xylazine again.

 

[wbvs58]

With both Ron's and little Cows situations it is always a possibility that the vet grabbed the wrong bottle of xylazine. The usual one for cattle use is 20mg/ml, vets will also have a 100mg/ml bottle for use with horses. I believe that on the spur of the moment the wrong bottle is grabbed. I know, I have grabbed the wrong bottle until I double checked the label and realised but distract me and I could make an error.

Ken

 

[Redgully]

One of my mates was killed with ketamine by the local vet.

 

[Little Cow]

Thanks for your thoughts.

Redgully, whoa! Accident, I assume?

 

[Bright Raven]

With both Ron's and little Cows situations it is always a possibility that the vet grabbed the wrong bottle of xylazine. The usual one for cattle use is 20mg/ml, vets will also have a 100mg/ml bottle for use with horses. I believe that on the spur of the moment the wrong bottle is grabbed. I know, I have grabbed the wrong bottle until I double checked the label and realised but distract me and I could make an error.

Ken

I never thought about two different concentrations. The vet was a young small animal vet. I was simply telling her about the heifer. She said, "I can give you something to relax her". As I left the clinic, she handed me a syringe with a dose in it. I don't even know if she drew the dose or her assistant did. They could easily have used the horse concentration.

That heifer went down in less than 2 minutes.

 

[Redgully]

Thanks for your thoughts.

Redgully, whoa! Accident, I assume?

No he was a pedophile, accidently gave him too much. Tried to resuscitate him but couldn't. Found out later he had lots of victims, not killed but molested after being drugged. My mate was a really good bloke but going through a rough patch and that vet pounced. They let him out on bail and he topped himself, i hope he suffered and went straight to hell!

 

[Buck Randall]

The vet doesn't necessarily have to make a mistake; some animals are just extremely sensitive. I wouldn't ever use it without having the reversal agent close at hand.

 

[TennesseeTuxedo]

Thanks for your thoughts.

Redgully, whoa! Accident, I assume?

No he was a pedophile, accidently gave him too much. Tried to resuscitate him but couldn't. Found out later he had lots of victims, not killed but molested after being drugged. My mate was a really good bloke but going through a rough patch and that vet pounced. They let him out on bail and he topped himself, i hope he suffered and went straight to be nice!

That's awful. Yes, he's right where he deserves to be I expect.

 

[5S Cattle]

Why sedate for dehorning or castration?

 

[Little Cow]

Redgully, sorry about your friend. There are sickos out there in all walks of life. I'm not a violent person, but sometimes I wish I could have just a few minutes in a locked room with one of those guys.... When I worked for the police, they arrested two of my former public school teachers for molestation. Both were just as nice as could be. They always sent three cops to make the arrest. Two to arrest and one more to make sure the first two didn't screw up the case by beating the snot out of him.

 

[Little Cow]

Why sedate for dehorning or castration?

Some of us have that luxury with small herds. I know the big ranches I worked for never did.

 

[Little Cow]

I'm going back to dehorning paste. Slap a strip of duct tape on top to keep mama cow from trying to lick it off and be done with it. Enough of that drama.

 

[wbvs58]

The vet doesn't necessarily have to make a mistake; some animals are just extremely sensitive. I wouldn't ever use it without having the reversal agent close at hand.

That is true but I am always suspicious when I hear of these so called adverse reactions. I have known more than one young vet that was not aware that there was two different concentrations of xylaxine and particularly when they mix up some of these cocktails like ketstun (xylazine/butorphenol/ketamine) the volumes are rarely worked out in mg/ml on the run but refer to formulas giving the volume of each drug to use for a certain weight animal. Very easy to get it way wrong if the wrong bottle is used. Vets are only human and not immune from mistakes.

Ken

 

[Buck Randall]

The vet doesn't necessarily have to make a mistake; some animals are just extremely sensitive. I wouldn't ever use it without having the reversal agent close at hand.

That is true but I am always suspicious when I hear of these so called adverse reactions. I have known more than one young vet that was not aware that there was two different concentrations of xylaxine and particularly when they mix up some of these cocktails like ketstun (xylazine/butorphenol/ketamine) the volumes are rarely worked out in mg/ml on the run but refer to formulas giving the volume of each drug to use for a certain weight animal. Very easy to get it way wrong if the wrong bottle is used. Vets are only human and not immune from mistakes.

Ken

Fair enough. There are some vets out there who wouldn't admit the mistake, either.

I once got in a hurry and gave a calf xylazine when I thought I was giving Draxxin (I only carry the 100 mg/mL). I reversed him right away and he eventually woke up, but it had me sweating for a few minutes.

 

[wbvs58]

The vet doesn't necessarily have to make a mistake; some animals are just extremely sensitive. I wouldn't ever use it without having the reversal agent close at hand.

That is true but I am always suspicious when I hear of these so called adverse reactions. I have known more than one young vet that was not aware that there was two different concentrations of xylaxine and particularly when they mix up some of these cocktails like ketstun (xylazine/butorphenol/ketamine) the volumes are rarely worked out in mg/ml on the run but refer to formulas giving the volume of each drug to use for a certain weight animal. Very easy to get it way wrong if the wrong bottle is used. Vets are only human and not immune from mistakes.

Ken

Fair enough. There are some vets out there who wouldn't admit the mistake, either.

I once got in a hurry and gave a calf xylazine when I thought I was giving Draxxin (I only carry the 100 mg/mL). I reversed him right away and he eventually woke up, but it had me sweating for a few minutes.

Buck, I can relate to that. One that comes to mind was a kitten that I gave a small vial of insulin to thinking it was a FELV vaccine. The size and colour of the bottles were almost identical. I realised my mistake after they left. I quickly got the IV setup and glucose ready for when they returned and all went well. It was a crystalline insulin I think and did not last long. I was winging it a bit with what to do but it worked.

Ken

 

[Little Cow]

We talked to our vet. He overestimated the calf's weight. Easy mistake since Dexter calves are smaller than most. He's a good vet and has done a lot of saves for us with other animals, so it doesn't change our opinion of him.

 

[ALACOWMAN]

Seems like the higher stung the animal is the stronger the sedative seems too work..its been that way for me anyway especially on horses..